Homemade CNC Router

[rodm]

Darksiders be warned because this is a thread about mechanical removal of timber fibres using digital signals. Look Ma no hands ( and we all know what happens next ) :D

After twelve months or more of contemplating I have finally bitten the bullet and committed to building my first CNC router. I have ordered a Xylotex driver board, power supply and fan and will order the stepper motors next week. If I had orderd it all together it probably would have gone over the $A500 so I decided to pay it safe and split the order.

I am basing it on the popular MDF Gantry design but I am making it out of steel and aluminium. The design concept will be the same but as I have a lathe and mill I will be building stronger and more complex rails and bearing carriages. I have been playing around for a while with linear slides and hopefully what I have designed will work.

Here is a link that shows how to make one of the MDF versions for $US200 plus electronics and motors. If anybody is interested I can send them lots of links to budget CNC 3 axis routers.

http://solsylva.com/cnc/1aplanshome.html

Some have made same design to handle a 2400 by 1200 sheet. Also if you have a close look at the rails and bearing carriages you may notice that this design appeared in a Fine Woodworking magazine in the early 80's for a sliding table on a table saw.

The cheapest driver board I can find is $US70 and motors $US45. I am paying a bit more because the heavier steel construction will need bigger motors to drive it.

This will take a few months to build and I will post the progress on here.

[bennylaird]

Gudday Rod

Already have my electronics and stepper motors and have my Z axis almost complete. Mine is mainly MDF and roller skate bearing etc designed for about 36'" x 12" using a Dremel to cut balsa and ply.

Careful guys this can be a hobby in itself.......

[bennylaird]

Here is my Z-axis, still to fit the drive screw, stepper etc but very little play in the ball bearing draw slides.

[rodm]

Good to see somebody else making one and you certainly have a robust construction there. Are you using drawer slides on the X and Y or is this where you will use the skate bearings? Sorry wasn't thinking as 36 inch travel on drawer slides is a big ask.
Is your's the gantry design and what size steppers and board are you using?
I am going to start with Turbocnc and see if I can still remember dos.
Lots of questions and uncertainty at the moment but it should all sort out as I make each bit.
I got a full set of Jgro (?) plans a while back that has been useful.

[bennylaird]

Using the draw slides for the y axis with on offset. top to the left bottom to the right. Seems to be ok but proof will be in the pudding. Hoping to learn the basics with this one and then use it to cut pieces for a better beast. Using the rollers only for the X axis.

Using a gantry sort of based on Jgro's plan but just using what I can.

Just looking to find the info on my electronics.

[bennylaird]

Heres mine, paid to much but it will do the job with 135oz steppers.

http://www.lowcostcncretrofits.com/2.5amp%20motion%20controllers.html

[bennylaird]

Wrong one, mine is the older setup as below

[Andy Mac]

Hello Rod and Benny,

Yes even Darksiders can find this stuff interesting!:D I see Benny is planning to use a Dremel, Rod are you going the whole hog with a full sized router?
I've heard of some electric guitar maker in Australia using a similar setup to produce his solid bodies.
I'm interested in it from a work perspective, for sculpture and printmaking students. For example, I reckon a computer image could be routed onto any material, wood, perspex, sheet metal etc and be inked-up for printing, as you do a wood block or even an etching.
I look forward to following this one!

Cheers,

[bennylaird]

Not wanting to be disloyal here or break any rules but another forum exists at:

http://www.cnczone.com

Check it out.

[Outsider]

Hi Guys,

I started to build a Jgro Router in May, I engraved my first piece last week.

I followed the plans exactly but used 8mm 1.25 Allthread. As I neared completion I found I had to modify motor mounts and thrust bearing positions as the discussions on the forums recommended these.

I used DYI Controlers and breakout board and built the whole thing for under $400.00.

Benny I am about to modify the long Y-axis to provide support to the pipe and would recommend increasing the diameter of the X-axis pipe and using the larger pipe adjusters as used on the Y-axis. The pipe adjustment blocks are the week link in the system and are definitely much better made of HDPE plastic or such.

Good luck with your builds but the software is the harder part.

[gazaly]

Not wanting to be disloyal here or break any rules but another forum exists at:

http://www.cnczone.com (http://www.cnczone.com/)

Check it out.

SPLITTER

:D

[echnidna]

Another very useful cnc forum HERE (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO/?yguid=125450587)

[rodm]

Benny (I hope that is your correct name)
You might have paid a bit more for your controller and motors but at least it is plug and use. I still have to house the board and power supply, wire it together and make up leads. If I short something it is a long way to send to get it fixed. :(
I am changing my mind about the finer details all the time and in the end it will be bite the bullet and go with the materials I have got. I picked up a heap of steel today but I think it will be too heavy for the gantry - another change in direction. :o
Keep posting and we might learn something from each other.

Andy
From the photos I have seen it is amazing what can be done. All the examples you use can be done. One use I hadn't thought of was using a diamond stone in a dremil and grinding images into mirrors. They are very accurate, repeatable units and quite low cost compared to commercial units.
I plan to use a Makita router trimmer as well as the dremil type.

Outsider
Thanks for the encouragement. The software is something I am putting away until I have the unit built. I expect it will take a couple of months to build as I only get part of the weekend to do it.
I got some 1/4 inch allthread today but also got 8mm as well. Looking at the 1/4 I thought it a bit weak and understood about the whip they talk about. I wasn't sure if it was necessary to have 1/4 so I got it as it was only $3 a length. Apart from modifying bearings and motor mounts is there a problem using the 8mm allthread (software?).
I would be very interested to see a picture of your unit when you are ready.

Bob
Thanks for the link. I have found heaps of info on this and didn't realise it was so popular around the world.

[echnidna]

The big problem with using allthread is that you limit the speed of the machine, as the maximum rotational speed of allthread is rather low then it starts to whip around.
Acme thread is an improvement and will give you a bit faster machine,
Rack and pinion, chain drive & toothed belt drive can give you high speed machines,

I started building one a few years ago and get so far and rebuild etc.
It occupies a lot of room in my small shed and is a repository for junk but I will get back to it one day.

Theres usually a bit of stuff including steppers and drivers on ebay

[rodm]

Thanks Bob
I'm not sure but the wider pitch Acme thread might be a big ask with the stepper motors I am getting (270 oz)
I was going to use thrust bearings at each end and tension the allthread to see if reduces the whip. I can make adapters on my lathe so it is just a case of getting the design right. This is to be an interim step to get it up and running and I agree with what you are saying. Ball screws are the ideal but it is way over the top for me at this stage.
Did you make any enquiries for a source of long lengths of acme thread in Australia?

[echnidna]

270 oz should handle acme thread.
its a matter of calculating the inertia.

[Outsider]

Rod,
The 8mm althread whips a little but can be damped down by sort of wedging delrin under the long thread at the edge of the gantry base I have considered spring loading something in this position. when I say wedge I mean just slightly put pressure on the thread at this point. I think Jgro calls it an anti-whipping Block.
The 8mm Thread fits inside the Skate-bearings nicely as they are 8mm also.
The software is not a problem as usually there is a constant for each machine which is the no of Pulses per rev of the stepper motor and the pitch of the thread. For 8mm this is 200 (steps per rev) X 8 (pulses per step) / 1.25 ( 1.25 threads per mm) = 1280 pulses per mm.
I was recently in the states and prior to going ove had a friend order from ENCO.com a 6' fengt and a 3' length with 8 nuts and shipping to his house in phoenix for $30.00 US. It is probably prohibitive to have it shipped here but you could ask.
Iam still using the Allthread with 116 OZ motors.
My build log is

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11814&page=1&pp=15

and being added to all the time.

Good luck
Brian

[rodm]

Brian
Your CNC router is top stuff and thanks for the link to your build. I will go back and read your thread in detail later tonight.

I am following loosly the Jgro router but more in concept than design. I have decided on a much more complex bearing arrangement and with a steel base and alunimium gantry.

I built a the same bearing carriage as Jgro many years ago on a sliding table for a benchsaw. I have given it much thought over the years and have come up with what I think is a better design.

My problem with the pipe design is that there is a lot of sideways load on the bearings. There is also only a small contact area between ther bearing and the pipe. The result is that you eventually wear a track in the pipe. I know that the simple solution is to rotate the pipe but these factors have steered me away from his design. I am in no way knocking it as there are plenty of examples like your router where it works.

I spent most of Sunday cutting and threading and I have a couple more weekends of the same before I will have anything to show. I should start a build log on the CNC Zone.

[rodm]

Brian
I had to go out so I have only just read your CNC post. You are adventurous with the electronics and I wouldn't even contemplate building a board from scratch. All round top effort.

[bennylaird]

Rod

The silly thing is I'm a radio technician by trade and could have built my own gear for a fraction of the cost still it's nice to have it all plug and play.

DELRIN!!!!!!

Where can I get some? I searched all over the web and then bought some cutting boards hoping they would do a similar job.

[Outsider]

Benny,
I used Cutting board too. but when I wanted thicker I used HDPE 20mm about 1/4 of a m3 for $30 from a plastics supply place.

OK, it's dear but it's buddy good. Used it on the long axis adjuster blocks as I was sik of repairing striped thread.

Hope this helps
Brian

[rodm]

Brian is right on the money with HDPE as Delrin is expensive. If you want to enquire try here:
http://www.solutions.dupont.com.au/
or
http://www.dotmar.com.au/products/acetal/acetal_main.htm

I have been searching for cutting boards but all I can find is very thin ones. Does anyone know where you can get thicker ones?

Brian why was the thread stripping? Was it because you were using steel nuts? This is important because I am going to use two steel nuts in my anti-backlash design.

[craigb]

What will you blokes use your CNC set-ups for when they are finished?

I'm just curious. :)

[Harry72]

For thicker cutting boards go to a shop that specialises in chef gear. There's one in adelaide I know of called Macmonts.

[rodm]

Craig
For me it is the challenge of getting it to work first. The combination of computer, electronics and fabrication has been too good to resist. These are very versatile units and capable of high accuracy depending on how it is built. They can used on lots of materials such as wood, glass (engraving only), foam, aluminium, plastics and anything else of that type of hardness. Example I have seen of finished work are signs both engraved and cut out solids, engraving or routing patterns or routing out solid shapes.
Sometimes the owners make their second units by cutting the pieces on their first machine.

Harry
Thanks for the tip.

[keith53]

For me it is the challenge of getting it to work first. The combination of computer, electronics and fabrication has been too good to resist.

So, would you use one for repetitive work? How does the software interract with the board driving the router? You'd have different patterns/designs etc. So how do you distinguish between what you want to cut and what you don't.

(Also curious)

Cheers,
Keith

[rodm]

Keith
Repetitive patterns are where this unit will excel.
To give an overview you draw it in a software package that can save it in a dxf extension. This is an industry standard the same a txt or jpg. This drawing is then converted to gcode by software which is a series of commands that are sent through the parallel port of a computer to a driver board that controls the motors. This really is very similar to an ink jet printer or plotter excect a router or dremil is the end tool.
So basically if you can draw it you can make it.

[echnidna]

However cnc controlled machines are used for one off jobs where absolute precision is needed such as in the medical field using lasers etc instead of routers.

[bennylaird]

Mine was originally to cut out Scale model kits of WWI aircraft, however I have found there is not the market for them that I had hoped. Many just buy them complete from Taiwan rather than build. Pity as they are electric powered and fun to fly. (see the Pic.) Kits are available for the EIII if anyone is interested, lol.)

My new intention is to use the first to make a better one from aluminium and eventually gear up to a 8' x 4' which I can do contract work with. There is a lot of demand out there.

Imagine producing carved artwork in door panels with the family crest in 3D.

While repetitive it also allows the accuracy to take a computer image and bring it to life.

Also lots of trim pieces could be made, would love to do a fancy pattern for the varanda woodwork etc.

[Outsider]

Rod.
No I was stripping out the thread in the pipe adjustment blocks.

My uses are not determined yet but custom signs for homes or bars may be a good start. I hope to post a picture of something of interest maybe tonight if I finish it.

Yes rod it will be identified.

brian

[bennylaird]

I might make my pipe adj out of metal me thinks.....

[rodm]

It is a big ask to have such a narrow section of MDF threaded and expect it to take the full load of the gantry. Some of the photos of finished units show distortion of this part. If I was making mine with pipe I would use plastic or alunimium.

Another idea would be to make Jewelery boxes, framed mirrors, etc during the week and then at the weekend markets have people design their own carving or engraving for gifts.

Look forward to seeing some of your work Brian.

[bennylaird]

I want to ad some detail to wooden panels.

You can digitise a photo and then have it carved.

Family crests etc for door panels.

Basically just keep experimenting with what you can do.

Now if I can just finish my machine....................

[captainjsw]

Interesting thread this: I have been wondering about the ability of a CNC Router table to manufacture moldings to go around the edge of draw or door opening in a boat. Having built a 12.8m cat already and done some considerable routing by hand I am in the startup phases of a new 17m cat - well was wondering who to manufacture in quantity this sort of moulding shown in the pic. Can anyone help or direct me to the right place

Thanks John

[sinjin]

Hi capt, there is quite a few places araound that do contract cutting of any sort of material really. Cost varies depending on the type and quanity of material being used.
But NC routers are mostly used by the furniture industry. So if you do the ring around you won't have much problem finding people to do the job.
Sinjin

[captainjsw]

Thanks sinjin,

Just reading my post and decided it was not real clear, what I meant do you think a DIY CNC router is capable of making moldings such as these in the picture. I have been thinking of building a router such as the large solsylva for sometime - and - well if this was capable of doing this this sort of work, it just gives me one more reason to build it. Or more to the point I guess is how are they manufactured, looking at the accuracy of many parts like these not just on the boat but on many other production boats, it must be by machine somehow.

Cheers John

[rodm]

Hi John
I'm not real sure what you are after but if you can hand rout it you can CNC machine rout it. It must be the CNC season as I have a couple of enquiries this week already. I see you are in Perth so if you want to pop around after Christmas I can show you three home made machines and give you a demo. I live in Alexander Heights, north of river so if that is within your travelling boundaries send me a PM.

[crocky]

Hi Rod,

Hope your router table(s) are working fine :)

I am about to make a start on getting the gear together and assembling a CNC router table for the first time. So far I have got the Ozito 650 Watt Plunge Router and I have ordered the Xylotec 3 Axis ready to go kit including wiring from the states.

I am about to get some plans and like the Solsylva.com plans, it appears to be reasonably easy for me to build and with my disability I have to be pretty sure before I spend the money. bennylaird is fairly close by too :) so I may be able to call on him for some help :) I have seen a lot of CNC machines thru looking in this and other forums, should I get the plans about $40 us?

I am an Artist now and I will be using the CNC Router for a number of projects that I have in mind and using a router and not my left hand will be ideal.

[rodm]

Hi Bob
My tables are working well thanks.

Smart move to CNC given your health issues and much safer than trying to hold the router. The Solsylva is a good design and just for information the design was a cooperative effort by a group of CNCZone members.

I assume you have visited their forum here.
www.CNCZone.com

They have a number of free plans available on their forum here

http://www.cnczone.com/modules.php?name=Downloads&file=viewcategory&cid=2

Would be worth a look as they all have similar designs and a low budget approach.

The favored design at the moment is the Joe design and the fellow offers to make the hard bits. There are a number of build logs for this desgn on the CNCZone forum so plenty of photos and detail for you to follow.

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15139

I am giving you a few more options and not trying to steer you away from the Solsylva plan.

CNC routers are becoming very popular and I get quite a few enquiries a week about the concepts of CNC and how to build the machines. It is really only in the last two years that the cost of electronics and software have made CNC affordable for the home workshop. Hopefully the interest will continue and a CNC category can be added to this forum.

I did PM you yesterday and feel free to use my email address to ask any questions.

[crocky]

Hi Rod,

I didn't get a PM from you? Nothing in my PM box.....

Thanks for the info and the other avenues to look at for a CNC machine. I just left joe a PM and asked the price for a joe's kit :) so I will wait for a while. I got a copy of his plans and the reader that it needs, so I will spend a bit of time going though them too before I make a decision.

CNCzone sure has some info, I spent all day yesterday and the day before there! The links make it so much easier though :) just overloaded with info at present.

[rodm]

Bob
It isn't all that hard but you need to absorb a lot of information in the first round. Don't complicate things and just concentrate on the mechanics for the time being.

Accuracy in building is important and don't take a near enough is good enough approach. If you do it will reflect in your finished product and also slow your machine down due to binding.

As I said it is not hard to build these machines just a bit overwhelming at the start trying to get your head around it.

I will send a PM again with my email address so you can ask questions.

I just checked my outbox and it isn't there so typical of me I have pressed the wrong button or something equally silly. I have sent a PM just now.

[crocky]

Hi Rod,

I am still reading, and reading, and....

So far I now have an Ozito Router, full 3 axis Xylotec kit with the wiring to the stepper motors and set for 220 volts (basically a plug and play set-up) which will be good for me :) the steppers look really nice too.

I have ordered the skate bearings from the States last week, I guess they will turn up sometime. There is no rush yet.

I have asked Joe for the price of one of his kits and the freight would be a killer (96lb) so he is trying to get someone over here that can cut one for me using local materials for a price, so I am just waiting on Joe now.

I have got some router software to learn in the mean time :)

[rodm]

Hi Bob
Good to see things are moving along on your build. Keep us posted.

[crocky]

Hi Rod,

Joe's friend that he had in Victoria has sold his CNC Router and cannot do the build so I am back to looking for someone that can manufacture the parts of his kit locally including the HDPE parts for a price. I have put an ad on the CNCzone so we will see how it goes. I put it in the Build Logs area and Joe and ccsparky have already written to me and said that they would give any help needed.

Got the skate bearings yesterday :)

[rodm]

Hi Bob
Good to see it moving ahead. In Perth we have to pay premium for everything because of freight. The HDPE parts might be worth getting Joe to make because local price for this stuff is over the top. You will cut out the freight cost by the saving in material cost alone and I don't think there is a lot of weight in the HDPE parts anyway. Freight from Perth for the MDF parts would not make it worthwhile for you either.
I am sure there is somebody in Victoria with a machine and maybe having the MDF cut by a CNC shop might be the go. I know Benny (ynebb) has or did have a large sheet router so that might be an option for you.

[crocky]

Hi Rod,

ynebb was the contact that Joe was talking to and he has sold his router table so that avenue dried up. I did get contact overnight in a round about way with a guy called splint (David) who works at the Ford proving ground and he has offered to build the mdf parts when his router is finished. I know that you know of him because I have seen your mail in his log :)

I didn't think of getting the HDPE parts from Joe, I have asked him for a quote for them now and I'll see how it goes.

Thanks for your help.

[rodm]

Hi Bob
David's machine is going to be very strong and as good as any commercial machine built. You will get good qualtiy parts from him. :2tsup:
I hope it all comes together for you.

[crocky]

Hi Rod,

After quite some weeks of trying to get some parts made, without success, I have decided to try and go it alone and see what I can come up with. I got the motion technologies cd catalog today so I have somewhere to look now :)

Expect some questions as I progress!

[rodm]

Hi Bob
There is a machine nearly completed about 30km from your place. Go to your CNCZone post and look up a reply from Greolt. He is a lot closer to finishing now and might be able to help so talk to him.
I am happy to help out with information or any lathe or mill work for items that would be economical to send by Australia Post for you. I machined all the motor mounts and ballscrews, etc for a CNC builder in Sydney and the postage was about $140. Not cheap because of the weight and location of Perth.
Having your project stall is a good thing. It takes a while to get your head around a lot of this and the more research you can do the better your machine will be. The BBQ's they have over your way would be good to go to as well.
If you are after parts and don't mind buying overseas I have a list of contacts who we have found to be the best for servcie and price. Items such as $18US for 276oz steppers, ballscrews for $1.25US per inch and ballnuts $26US. Freight kills those prices a bit but still less than half price for anything in Australia. Just PM me with your list and I will provide contacts.

[crocky]

Hi Rod,

I have put a CNC router for the disabled in the new disabled area :) got to get a CNC area on this board :doh:

Greolt has been a real champ for me and has nearly got everything done......

[rodm]

Hi Bob
I read your post and your machine is coming along nicely.

I think CNC lends itself well to people with creative minds and limited movement so it is good to share your experience in that thread.

Knowing Greg he will be doing a great job on your machining so you will not have a problem there.

I think there should be a CNC topic on this board but there is not a lot of interest here yet so maybe not for the moment.

I have nearly completed machine number four and have another two machines ready to follow on with. I sold three of my machines recently so what else was I to do. :wink:

[crocky]

Hi Rod,

I have already had a query from Les who want's to build one for PCB's so there is plenty of interest in the CNC part of it and we really do need a CNC Router topic on this board. The main reason I go to cnczone is it has the topics that I need to read and of course it has a place to put the cnc router log there because there is not one here. I think I will write to the admin and make a suggestion for a CNC Router topic.

Number four, you're certainly a glutton for punishment<sp> :wink:

Greg is doing a TOP job :2tsup:, he sent me pictures last night of my y-axis and it is basically complete now and he is very pleased with it :)

I have a shuttlepro2 usb on the way over from the states and they have a mach3 plugin for it so it will be even easier to control :roll: and I have pretty well got the software sorted out now.

[rodm]

Hi Bob,
The shuttles are good and I have been using one for quite a while now.
I get emails quite regularly from prospective builders but I am never sure where they come from so maybe you are right about a CNC topic on here.
Here is a sneak preview of number four.

[crocky]

Hi Bob,
The shuttles are good and I have been using one for quite a while now.
I get emails quite regularly from prospective builders but I am never sure where they come from so maybe you are right about a CNC topic on here.
Here is a sneak preview of number four.

I see it's Rocket too :)

I like the gantry design too, not much wasted space with it like that. What cutting dimensions are you going to have, it looks like the length will not be a problem :).

I have written to ubeaut about a CNC Router Forum and even suggested he can make me a moderator if he wants to, just to be sure we have decent content in there. I run a couple of bbs systems over here, www.aus-cartalk.com is one of them. Deals mainly with mazda mx5 convertibles. Well see what happens, he should see quite a few CNC users :U

[rodm]

Hi Bob
You would make an ideal moderator if they decide to go ahead with a CNC topic area. :2tsup:

The cutting envelope of this machine is 500mm by 500mm by 110mm approx. The cranked gantry is designed to centre the router over the X axis rails. A straight sided gantry has all the weight forward of the rails. It also has the advantage of being able to reduce the table lenght by the amount of offset.

Notice also that the ally table stops 50mm short of each side. This allows for cross clamping and I pinched this idea off Greg. There are a few new design features I am trialing on this machine. I'm not going to do a build log for this machine as it takes a bit to document and take photos of the build. I have done this three times already and I thought it a bit of overkill if I do it again.

[vaughan green]

G'day anyone who is out there-look I'm so new to this I don't even know what a thread is-and a darksider ?-sounds like Harry potter to me-so in case I lose my way around could anyone who would help me write to my email address which is: [email protected].
What I want to ask is: should I buy a xylotex controller and motors or is there something cheaper/better/locally that I could get?
I have just made one of those MDF cnc machines from Rockcliff and am ready for motors etc.
Also a question for anyone else who has made the same machine: I have been immensly carefull to get the bushes well aligned on the shafts and they slide with firm finger pressure-would that be o.k. for the motors to operate against?

[martink]

G'day anyone who is out there-look I'm so new to this I don't even know what a thread is-and a darksider ?-sounds like Harry potter to me-so in case I lose my way around could anyone who would help me write to my email address which is: [email protected].
What I want to ask is: should I buy a xylotex controller and motors or is there something cheaper/better/locally that I could get?
I have just made one of those MDF cnc machines from Rockcliff and am ready for motors etc.
Also a question for anyone else who has made the same machine: I have been immensly carefull to get the bushes well aligned on the shafts and they slide with firm finger pressure-would that be o.k. for the motors to operate against?

This might be a bit off topic, but how did you go making the thing from the plans, have much trouble getting all the bits (apart from the MDF I mean)? I've been very interested in building one myself to make wooden clocks but when I try and get the bits locally they are difficult to find or so damn expensive that it's just not worth it.

Ciao,

M.

[vaughan green]

Hi Martink-I think I'm getting the hang of this-anyway to answer your question-I went to a firm called onesteel for the shaft rod and blackwoods for the bronze bushes-(these two firms are in most major cities and larger regional centres) but then had to find someone with a lathe to take some metal off the inside of the bushes to make them fit. For whatever reason the same firm doesn't sell the two items that logic would suggest go together-might not matter to a skilled engineer but to us beginners it can be a nightmare. Also make sure you go either metric or imperial right from the beginning-I went metric.
Half way through the construction I felt that a better method of construction would have been to use High quality ball bearing drawer runners and/or ball bearings with aluminium angle -it would have resulted in fewer alignment problems and less friction-just the same I am happy with the result for my purposes.

[crocky]

Hi Vaughan,

Xylotex is a winner if you don't know your way around :)

You will be amazed at how much pulling/pushing power the motors have, mine are only little 269's and the are certainly strong enough :)

Fire any question you want, someone will answer them. My build log is http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=35996 because there is no place for it here.

G'day anyone who is out there-look I'm so new to this I don't even know what a thread is-and a darksider ?-sounds like Harry potter to me-so in case I lose my way around could anyone who would help me write to my email address which is: [email protected].
What I want to ask is: should I buy a xylotex controller and motors or is there something cheaper/better/locally that I could get?
I have just made one of those MDF cnc machines from Rockcliff and am ready for motors etc.
Also a question for anyone else who has made the same machine: I have been immensly carefull to get the bushes well aligned on the shafts and they slide with firm finger pressure-would that be o.k. for the motors to operate against?

[vaughan green]

thanks crocky-appreciate your info-will order xylotex controller and motors-guess I can use them on the bigger better machine I plan to build down the track. I've noticed a lot of talk about the sensitivity of these systems to crossed wires frying them-so: why don't they have some form of overload protection?- is the xylotex system colour coded for example to protect us electronic tragics against our ignorance?
Cheers Vaughan

[rodm]

Hi Vaughan,
The Xylotex board as Crocky says is a good choice. It is in my opinion the cheapest sure fire way of getting going and having a well tested and reliable controller.

All of these style controllers and even up from this range are prone to letting the magic smoke out if a wire is disconnected with power turned on. The reason for this is the full motor current passes through the chip on the board.

Take the motor away under power and the current has nowhere to go but bust through the chip.

I have built four of these boards for myself and helped with others and so far no problems so with a bit of care and doubling checking you should be fine.
The board does not come with wiring but there are very good instructions and drawings to help you. They have a forum specifically for these boards as well as an area on CNCZone for asking questions.

You can order a pre-wired box that is turn key so if you are not confident then this might be a better option for you.

Interested to see photos of your machine.

[bennylaird]

Gudday Bob, Rod etal.

Mine has not progressed except for being move to school. Hopefully I will find some time to get it going over the next few months. School work takes up all your spare time even with the holidays.

Have to drop in a see how yours is going Bob.

Cheers
Benny

[prozac]

I have just posted MDF on Buy&Sell if anyone is interested.

[vaughan green]

Hi Rodm-have only just seen your note to me -still finding my way around-thanks-yep you're probably right about getting a ready to go controller-why take the risk of blowing something up?-I think xylotex make a plug and play option for about $us450 or so-will send you a pic but as you will see it's not complete and is much the same as many of the other MDF machines of this design-my only change is that I went to 10mm threaded rod and I will mill it down to take a bearing on the free end to minimise whip.
Cheers Vaughan
P.s. photos will have to come later when I work out how to attach them

[vaughan green]

Hi Rod-photos as promised -cheers Vaughan

[rodm]

Hi Vaughan
Nice job on the machine and glad to see you have painted it. :2tsup:
Keep us updated on how it progresses.

[WillyInBris]

Yep I as well will say the xylotex gear is good, the instructions in the kit are very good but if you can buy the plug and play it will make things a bit easier.

I built a machine on RODM's latest design :2tsup: (it rocks) I have added a couple of pics of the electronics box I set up.

Sean

[rodm]

Hi Sean,
Very neat enclosure and for a first try even more brownie points. You should post a picture of your machine on here. I like your message at the bottom - only a CNC'er would appreciate that.

Hi Benny,
Just noticed in post two of this thread your machine has been two years on hold. I wish I had realised that earlier so I could have hassled you more to finish it. :D

[vaughan green]

Hi Sean-I'm convinced-I'll go xylotex plug n play-if you or anyone out there wants to send photos of your machines-i'm already looking at bigger and better-something with supported bearings-I would appreciate it and if anyone wants any help would be glad to.
Cheers Vaughan

[vaughan green]

Hi bennylaird-have just seen your post from a while ago looking for delrin-I have a couple of blocks which were given to me and am willing to part with a small amount (no charge) for nuts etc-so if that is any use to you let me know.
Vaughan

[vaughan green]

Wrong one, mine is the older setup as below
I notice a photo posted by bennylaird showing what look like older style motors-I have been given 3 of these -does anyone know if they are ok-mine are made by sanyo denki japan and are dc 5v and 1.3 amp with six wires coming out of them-will modern xylotex drivers operate them?-does anyone know what power they are?
cheers Vaughan

[Outsider]

Vaughn,

I was able to get specifications for some Laserjet stepper motors from the manufacturers web site just by putting the model no into google.

I think that 6 wire motors are series steppers so are limited to certain types of controller boards. It's all a bit hazy now as its two years since I 90% finished my CNC. I can use it but........

The main thing that governs the power of the stepper is the holding torque and the curve relating to steps per min and power output which will be given in the specifications as well as the connections.

Good luck in your quest.

[vaughan green]

thanks brian- will try that-I will probably go completely new stuff from xylotex as I've said in other posts-but thought that perhaps I could save a hard earned dollar!!!
cheers Vaughan

[bennylaird]

Hi bennylaird-have just seen your post from a while ago looking for delrin-I have a couple of blocks which were given to me and am willing to part with a small amount (no charge) for nuts etc-so if that is any use to you let me know.
Vaughan

Gudday Vaughan

WOuld love enough to make a couple of nuts, will PM you.

Cheers
Benny

[Greolt]

G'day all

I have just read through this thread. It started a while ago.

Good to see Rodm progress from beginner to someone who I and others would consider an expert among homebuilt CNCers in Aus. :2tsup:

Benny I see you do not live far from me in Geelong. If I can be of any assistance to help you get this project moving again then let me know.

I think there is a need for a local Australian forum on hobby CNC. Most info type stuff can be had on CNCzone but local contact and help still has it's place.

It would not be big and "Woodworkforums" could be a good home for it as many woodworkers will be interested in this area.

Greg

[WillyInBris]

G'day all
I think there is a need for a local Australian forum on hobby CNC. Most info type stuff can be had on CNCzone but local contact and help still has it's place.

It would not be big and "Woodworkforums" could be a good home for it as many woodworkers will be interested in this area.

Greg

Yes I would have to agree Greg it would be the best possible place to share our work with everyone and also help people out.
Whilst I don't mind the CNC Zone its the creativity of the people and helpfulness of the people on this forum that I love.

Please, Please, Please Mods give us a home.


Sean

[rodm]

I get quite a few enquiries from this thread and others on this forum so there is definately interest in CNC builds in Australia. This thread has 22,000 hits so that in itself is an example of the interest.

On the CNCZone there is probably more Australian CNC builders per capita of any other country. I also think that the machines built are first rate and a credit to everyone that has overcome the supply issues we face here.

Collectively the Aussie builders have a wealth of knowledge and a willingness to help others out with builds and supplier links. Our friends in NZ also have an active interest in CNC and they would also benefit from a forum relative to our location. Even if you do not want to build a machine the price of CNC ready machines is reducing with a new mill from the Sieg factory just released. I predict it will not be long before commercial gantry woodworking machinery is within the reach of the hobbyist as well.

Bob (Crocky) asked the administrators and also offered to moderate a CNC forum but I haven't heard how this was accepted. Bob would do an excellent job. Neil of course has final say and I respect his decision on how he handes it. I feel confident that we could quickly fill a couple of threads with machine pictures and of the work we do.

[Greolt]

It's amazing this thread has had no posts since mid November but in that time has had nearly 4,000 hits.

There definitely is a lot of interest out there in this subject.

Greg

[tleah]

Hay guys i am new to this forum and just starting my 4x8 machine, i paied for the plans from the internet and was very dissapointed but have made mods and think i am on to of it now. i am using 460oz/in steppers with dedicated drives ( 3 off) breakout board but will have to locate / build a power supply around 400 w at 48 volts. if any one want to share my infomation or plans i am happy to help out

Tony
:2tsup:

[Greolt]

Tony have you run into Rod yet?

I reckon it would be a good move to make sure you do.

Greg

[WillyInBris]

Tony have you run into Rod yet?

I reckon it would be a good move to make sure you do.

Greg

Yes I would as well he got me started and I built one of his designs, the grand master of CNC Mentoring and tutorials :U

[seafurymike]

Hey Greg,

Amazingly your on here doing CNC of all things.

Attached is a picture of my proof of concept machine for those interested.


/Michael

[rodm]

Hi Tony,
I would be very interested to see a photo of your progress.
Just a heads up on the power supply I would be surprised if you need 400 watt power supply for 460oz steppers. That is more than 8 amps per motor.
You do not have to allow for all three motors drawing full power at the same time. You can get a switching power supply quite economically but building one using a toroidal is probably better.

Hi Michael,
It looks more than a proof of concept machine to me. A lot of work has gone in to that and I see you are using top quality components for motors and drivers.

[eighth]

Hi all,

I started reading this thread before I began my build. Now that I'm almost done I thought I'd post some happy snaps.

I have based my build on the Solsylva belt drive table: http://solsylva.com/cnc/belt_drive.shtml


http://www.woodworkforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=78700&stc=1&d=1216861760

The machine has the following travels: X=1640mm; Y=760mm; Z=140mm.

The original design was modeled and tweaked in a CAD program before building for two reasons:

1. The Solsylva plans have lots of words describing the components and drawings of discrete parts, but no assembly drawings. This drove me batty - I had no idea what component went where until I built a virtual table, then everything clicked into place

2. American stock and components specified in the plans made using Australian stock very difficult. Tweaking sizes made everything go smoothly. Mostly. I bought things like belts and pulleys from sdp-si.com and econobelt.com before I redesigned the machine. My X belts are too short because I got too ambitious with the X travel, and the Z belt is too short because the gantry beam is wider than specified in the plans. These are small inconveniences.

The table is constructed from 3mm steel angle, bolted together. It flexes, but not as much as you would think. The 20mm NB pipe rails on the X axis add quite a bit of stiffness. The table deck is 140x45mm lumber. 12mm gaps between planks act as T-slots.

http://www.woodworkforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=78701&stc=1&d=1216861768

A $50 Ozito plunge router seems to work pretty well. 20mm flexible electrical conduit keeps cables tucked away.

http://www.woodworkforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=78702&stc=1&d=1216861768

Ugly, ugly, ugly. But it works for the time being. Computer and controller sit on top of a cardboard TV box until I get going with my first plywood project: a little workstation to house the controller box and to put the laptop on (with a big red stop button).

The controller is the Xylotex 3-axis drive box with 425 oz.in. steppers. The computer is a second-hand Dell Latitude D600 laptop. I had doubts about whether this would be the right choice of computer - I'd read that the parallel ports in laptops weren't always up to the job. But the risk paid off because this setup seems to work really well. The Ozito router is plugged into a power board with switches behind the laptop and turned on and off from there.

The laptop runs the Ubuntu Linux live CD with EMC2 from http://www.linuxcnc.org (http://www.linuxcnc.org/)
I can't recommend this setup highly enough. EMC2 and the Axis user interface are fantastic and uncluttered (unlike Mach3) and Ubuntu Linux is very, very nice, and very easy. And everything is free. Which is a definite bonus.

http://www.woodworkforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=78703&stc=1&d=1216861768

My first real project on this thing wasn't even a routing project - I used it as a mill and created a proper clamping bracket for the router out of left-over 6mm aluminium angle and plate. The original setup (in photo) used band clamps, but this wasn't too nice. I bought some 1/16" carbide end mills off ebay (bottom of picture), a 1/4" to 1/8" adaptor bushing from McJing tools (the little round thing above the 5 broken bits - these things are so bloody fragile ;), fired the thing up with a prayer and let it go for a couple of hours. The result can be seen in the pictures above: a neat clamp that holds the router tightly, and a place to put a vacuum cleaner nozzle too.

So, that's it. It's definitely not perfect and will always probably be a work in progress, but it works. Having the flexibility to cut small alminium parts as well as sheets of plywood and other large things on the same machine is good. Now all I need are some projects, and the enthusiasm to make them.

Mark

[rodm]

Hi Mark,
Like the way you have approached it. Every machine I look at there is something different and your belts and gapped planking stand out.
Job well done and I hope you get years of use out of it. :2tsup:

[Zoot]

Mark,
Your machine looks great ... I am planning something similar, about 1500 x 900 and was looking at belt drive only for the X axis (Solsyla style) and screws on the other axes. Others have suggested rack and pinion in lieu of belt, so am currently weighing up the pros and cons (and cost!). How have you found the belt drive ... any stretch etc? When you are milling your aluminium, what pass depth are you using and feed rate ... I seem to be too agressive @0.2mm!
Cheers,
Alan

[eighth]

Rod: Thank you for the words of encouragement. Building the thing was a hobby in itself. I'd always wanted a CNC machine after using a machining centre at uni. I'll get years of use out of it when I figure out what to do with it ;)

Alan: As far as I can tell, this belt drive setup works really well. I haven't investigated what sort of stretch I get out of the belts, but If you've ever seen an L-sized belt you'd see that they're pretty stiff. At a guess, I'd say that any cutting aggressive enough to stretch the belts any considerable distance would cause the table and aluminium components to flex mightily before then. There are two L-belts on the X axis (one on each side of the rails) and one wrapped around the gantry for the Y axis.

The belts and pulleys for all axes worked out to cost about US$335, including postage. I don't know how that would compare with a rack and pinion setup. It would have cost US$104 less (yes, 31% less) if sdp-si didn't have such a stupid system - they sent my package via UPS without quoting first. Buggers. And it only arrived about two days before the econobelt order, which the nice man sent via USPS for $13.50.

Milling aluminium with little bitty 1/16" cutters is a steep learning curve. Lucky these things only cost about $20 for 10 off ebay. To cut the clamp out of 6mm plate in the pictures above, I could just about get away with a feed of 250mm/min at a cut depth of 0.2mm. The band clamps didn't hold the router in very good alignment, which meant that going around corners (for the circular parts) put undue strain on the cutter. I snapped a couple before I learned to ease the speed back.

Maybe bigger cutters are the go from now on, in aluminium anyway. I've got a 1/4" end mill and an 8mm ball nose end mill for carving things (the Ozito router comes with an 8mm collet as well as the 1/4", which is handy).

Good luck with your build and your cutting!

Mark

[andyross]

Hi Gents,
having pawed thru the cnc zone site I came across this one. I am looking into building a machine with a view to expand to a 16 foot length to machine foam core for wind turbine blades. I build the big ones 2MW) for a living and would like to eventualy build my own much smaller unit. Am investigating construction, software, drivers, 3d design software etc. I worked at RMIT Aero for a few years and had a lot of exposure to CAD CAM etc. Now I just need to do it on my own budget. Any guidance greatly apprecated
Andy Ross

[WillyInBris]

Hi Andy and welcome to the forum :2tsup:.

Anything is possible 16ft thats about 4m could it be done cant see why not for what your looking at doing, I have started small and have learnt a huge amount from the journey so far I will look to start to acquiring parts in the next couple of months for a larger build myself.

Feel free to start a new thread with your questions we all will try to help as much as we can we only ask that you do the same with others down the track.


Willy

[rodm]

Hi Andy,
16 foot is huge. :oo:
Cosidering the cost of rails, etc I think the only affordable (for me) construction would be the Mechmate design.
Try
www.mechmate.com (http://www.mechmate.com)
While I would encourage anyone to build a machine I think you may want to at least cost this type of work being contracted out. The software alone can run into thousands and maybe tens of thousands of dollars and unless you have heaps of work you might not break even. Anyway I am sure you will look into it or have already.

A machine like you see on this forum will run about $3,000 for linear rails and zero backlash drives. It used to be cheaper but steel has gone thorugh the roof lately and the second hand market for parts is being driven by an inceased demand in Hobby CNC machines.

Anyway welcome aboard and ask away. As Sean said probably better to start a new thread with a few of your ideas to kick around.

[eighth]

Hi Andy,

The mechmate design does look snazzy. I suppose it's all about how much you have to spend. The solsylva belt-drive table http://solsylva.com/cnc/belt_drive.shtml (the one I had a go at) is easy-ish to build in a home workshop and is scalable.

Software-wise EMC2 and Ubuntu Linux are easy, excellent and free ways to drive a machine: http://www.linuxcnc.org (http://www.linuxcnc.org/) . The Xylotex 3 or 4 Axis drive box is a fuss-free way of getting everything moving: http://www.xylotex.com/

3D CAD/Solid Modeling software with a G-code post-processor is the budget killer. People have said good things about: http://www.rhino3d.com/.

I did my PhD thesis on small wind turbine blade aerodynamics, so your venture sounds really interesting. If you get going with building a big machine for foam blade cores please keep us up to date. I for one would like to see a big home-made machine cutting out wind turbine blade :)

Mark