auscab 24th January 2023, 10:49 PM The DVD is basically finished as most must know ? . Not Me until now.
I went looking at JB HiFi today online to spend a gift voucher I received and out of interest I had a peek to see what DVD players were available . There were only two cabinet types for sale. One for $49 and one for $55.
I was a bit shocked so went and googled why.
I read this
"Since 2008, DVD sales have declined more than 86%.
A combination of the Great Recession, a rise in customers buying on-demand and digital copies of films and the launch of streaming services is what has caused DVD sales to plummet.
Since 2011, platforms like Netflix, Hulu and HBO have seen sales balloon 1,231% to $12.9 billion."
I used to have a DVD and surround sound 5.1 system set up many years ago and a bit of a collection of some great concerts . I was wanting to get it set back up again one day and keep buying more good concert releases .
What are people doing now to view their Music on something that was as good as a DVD and 5.1 on a big TV .
Are streaming services as good and are all the artists and all their concerts you could find on the shelves once at JB now online ?
Do I forget the DVD? What speaker set up is good for streaming and listening to music concerts if it is ?
Or are music lovers still using the DVD and 5.1 still ? I see there are 232 Music DVD s available at JB.
I can understand why the DVD has died when it comes to movies . Sitting down to watch a great concert on with Widescreen TV a good amp and 5.1 was something I want again . Unless there is better.
What are you doing for that music experience ?
Rob
China 25th January 2023, 12:08 AM DVD has been superseded by Blu ray plenty of Blue ray machines available Blu ray will play DVD but not the other way round.
derekcohen 25th January 2023, 12:19 AM Hi Rob
I imagine that no one has sold a DVD machine for quite a while. They were replaced by Blu-ray.
There are some quite expensive Blu-ray players around for the serious home theatre for serious viewers wanting both 4K Blu-ray and CD-quality sound. These need to be paired with a suitable 4K TV, and high quality sound system to get the best from it all.
That is not my interest - I am strictly a 2-channel audiophile. However, I do have a high end Blu-ray player, made by Oppo, since it is superlative at playing CDs.
I suspect that most have turned from DVD/Blu-ray to streaming (as I have), for video (e.g.Netflix, etc) as the quality is excellent and accessible. Storing movies is easy enough on a computer and space-saving compared to compact disc boxes. This is happening with music as well - I have Tidal, which streams CD-quality music - around 2 million albums from which to choose. CD's are still around, and better than streaming, but most own a mobile phone, and use this to stream everything. Personally, I am a vinyl enthusiast at heart.
Regards from Perth
Derek
Mobyturns 25th January 2023, 04:26 AM Real audiophiles are listening to LP's on their upmarket turntables.:D
Mr Brush 25th January 2023, 07:58 AM As long as you don't end up like this...
Hi Fi Shop Sketch - complete version - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DvswW6M7bMo)
"What's the difference between that and a gramophone?"
"About 30 years and a plastic cover to you chief"
auscab 25th January 2023, 11:48 AM Hi Rob
I imagine that no one has sold a DVD machine for quite a while. They were replaced by Blu-ray.
There are some quite expensive Blu-ray players around for the serious home theatre for serious viewers wanting both 4K Blu-ray and CD-quality sound. These need to be paired with a suitable 4K TV, and high quality sound system to get the best from it all.
That is not my interest - I am strictly a 2-channel audiophile. However, I do have a high end Blu-ray player, made by Oppo, since it is superlative at playing CDs.
I suspect that most have turned from DVD/Blu-ray to streaming (as I have), for video (e.g.Netflix, etc) as the quality is excellent and accessible. Storing movies is easy enough on a computer and space-saving compared to compact disc boxes. This is happening with music as well - I have Tidal, which streams CD-quality music - around 2 million albums from which to choose. CD's are still around, and better than streaming, but most own a mobile phone, and use this to stream everything. Personally, I am a vinyl enthusiast at heart.
Regards from Perth
Derek
Thanks Derek .
Blu-ray was only around for maybe 4 or 5 years last time I bought a player and I got the Blu-Ray DVD player.
Yeah I see now looking through the different categories at JB that the B-R 4K, B-R and plain Dvd are all there.
I didn't know the blu-Ray had sort of taken over though. And 4K Ive never heard of it.
Ive got the Yamaha 5.1 amp , the TV and the speakers but since the house move its still all spread out and the wires are somewhere in some box ? And the remotes should be around are maybe lost ?
Ive got to make a start and get it all back together . I was just thinking yesterday that mabey its all changed so much that its possibly not worth it . Its seems it hasnt though. There is just a few more options.
SWMBO isn't into it at all . The speakers are a wast of space to her . Ill get away with setting the tv speakers up again . Id love to have the TV set up and my old two channel LP playing gear in the house but I wouldn't push my luck with that. The record player is stored away and the quality speakers and amp are now used for workshop music.
Rob
harmo 25th January 2023, 05:37 PM Howdy Rob,
Long time listener (of music) first time responding to a Hi-Fi question on this forum.
It's fair to say that a large and growing proportion of the population are using streaming these days...
If you're looking for full video recordings of actual concerts, then it's honestly hard to beat YouTube for sheer quantity. Is the quality amazing?... well judge that on a case-by-case basis. There are some amazing high-end recordings, of concerts there, but many are not in my particular music tastes. BTW install some ad blocking and YouTube-enhancing plugins to your browser of choice, and you'll find it much more pleasant.
One of my favourite channels takes popular music from previous decades (80s, 90s, some 2000s) and gets the Berlin Symphony Orchestra and some underappreciated vocalists to perform music.. that in my humble opinion, blows some of the originals away. If you're interested, look up "alex christensen and the berlin orchestra" on Youtube.
If you're just looking for high quality sound... The Tidal streaming service is very good, but if you're expecting everything to be on there like Spotify... don't. In fact, it might come down to how "main stream" your tastes are and that will determine how much you like there.
My favourite go to (for all my fellow audiophile addicts) vids on Youtube are:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-h6MoF7HLA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bWVe1GGvs4U
Now before I leave this section, I just want to say that the vast majority of streaming services offer most of their stuff in stereo. Of course, if you want to do multichannel full VR surround sound, you need a good Internet connection to handle the additional bandwidth to handle all that extra data. If you have family members gaming, downloading, streaming in other rooms at the same time... that can tax even high end home connections.
LPs, Blurays, and Beyond...
Despite many folks abandoning the media for decades LPs are indeed back, and growing in popularity. Now, despite the 21st century, and the rise of tech that implies, LPs are STILL a predominantly stereo format... so if you want "surround sound" in any of its many flavours.. you're probably looking for a more modern (read: digital) technology.
I've listened to (and mixed) true LPs for events back in my college days (alongside CDs, and digital files).. yes, they're noisy, but they're fun. Honestly, without training and intimate knowledge of particular recordings... I doubt many folks can actually hear the difference in quality when the moving needle raises the noise floor noticeably. However, I've listened to setups where LP do sound better when matched with certain other amps (not necessarily valve based). There's also a lot of nostalgia for the retirees who can afford the $15K turntables, and $50K amps... There are too many "hipsters" who's parents have such setups, and it's what they were raised with... so it has sort of became a self-perpetuating phenomenon.
As others have said, LPs are big, take a ton of space, need cleaning and other maintenance, frankly.. I don't have time for that... so I'm a digital guy. That said, you can integrate LPs into modern systems and have it sound amazing.
Most people think "vacuum tubes" or "valves" are analogue, while "transistors are digital".. this is based on half-baked knowledge. Between the on/off states, transistors are indeed, capable of partial power states, and is the basis of all transistor amplifiers. Some people get all hung up on "sampling rates" and "digital versus analogue camps". Yes, some combinations with transistor based amps don't work well.... just as some tube amplifiers can sound pretty sad too... so let's not go completely crazy/wistful about one tech or another. Use what you like, and never let anyone tell you you're wrong for having preferences. Price is no guarantee of performance, either. Just saying.
<Taking a breath and getting off my non-partisan, "can't we all get along?" soap box, now>
If you're looking for multichannel/surround sound... it's still hard to beat optical media! However, streaming is catching up... slower than I expected.
Disk based playback (not hard drive/downloads) seem to centre mostly in Bluray players as previous responders have mentioned. A good player will also handle eccentric disk choices like Super Audio CDs (SACDs) and DVD Audio (no video) as well as typical Blurays, DVDs and CDs. I use both new Oppo 4K players and older Cambridge Audio 1080P Bluray based players myself, and they work exceptionally well for multichannel optical media. Despite differing brands, chipsets, decoders, etc... each brings something to make it worthwhile. But like many have already said, optical media is a dwindling if not dying format too.
If you are going to do this, ensure you get a 4K capable player at this stage. Many of these are capable of delivering Dolby Atmos (usually 7.1.4 or above) but if money is tight, consider getting a good 1080P if you're trying to get the best sound for a 5.1, maybe a 7.1 setup. Of course, you'll need an amp that has a sufficient number of channels (whether you use analogue or digital connections).
Pure Audio... not for everyone, but it's great for surround sound experiences... when I can find something I actually like...
Now most people are addicted to compressed formats, and some are starting to appreciate "lossless" formats. But it still seems that few people have heard of "higher than average" quality of various optical formats. Super Audio CDs, DVD Audio, and of course, Bluray has "Pure Audio". There's no video content, it's using all of that new found space for the best audio recordings producers can squeeze onto the disk. A producer in the Netherlands has a particularly nice jazz-style album that I adore, but it's more the exception to the rule, since most of the albums are niche, and certainly no "pop" or top 40 songs will ever be found here... I sometimes ask myself if I'm somehow uncultured, since I feel many of 2L's albums are too self-indulgent, oddball productions with understandably (but largely unrelatable) Norse influences... (to an Aussie bloke like me) and as a result I find that while they're interesting... I wouldn't listen to them regularly. Nonetheless, the Hoff Ensemble's "Quiet Winter Night" is everything high end, surround sound music should be.. I listen to it a lot, and I'm not even a Jazz fan. For more info:
Album: QUIET WINTER NIGHT- an acoustic jazz project in 5.1 surround sound (2L-087-PABD) (http://www.2l.no/pages/album/087.html)
However if you're looking for video recordings of concerts... again, it'll be hit and miss, but optical media is probably where you need to look, even today.
What sort of music are you into? If I don't know stuff that's interesting to you, I know others who might.
Happy listening!
Hamish.
Mr Brush 25th January 2023, 05:50 PM Hamish - thanks for the summary of the "state of play", very useful info. I have played around with ripping to some lossless formats, especially as costs of storage media have come down, but have been contemplating going back to physical media for a while now.
I'm guessing the next TV will be 8K the way things are going !
auscab 25th January 2023, 07:20 PM Howdy Rob,
What sort of music are you into? If I don't know stuff that's interesting to you, I know others who might.
Happy listening!
Hamish.
Thanks Hamish for that huge post.
I love all music . If someone was telling an interesting story of how to ring a bell I'd be into it.
What I'm wanting to replay on my tv is just some of the basic standard pop stuff I have on DVD. Eagles, Elton John, Roy Orbison and a couple of others . Oh yeah, Crosby Stills and Nash Live . David Gilmore live . The recent Passing of David Crosby got me re thinking of my DVDs. And I saw a few I'd new ones I'd like to buy and watch .
What I like to listen to though is everything that's good. I love seeing docos on Ytube about Music Stars and the story of how they start off and try hard and finally break through and become discovered.
I love all music, US and English music . Country, Bluegrass Blues . The lot . And spent years listening to classical ABC on the radio in Melbourne . 3CR and 3RRR .
I only got into learning about Nina Simone a few years ago . Wow . Not just what she sings but her message and how she puts it across.
What I like about Apple music is being able to learn a bit about an artist then go listen to their breakthrough album and more . I was doing that with Dolly Parton and George Jones a bit lately. Ive only listened to a tiny amount of Jazz . Plenty of time for some more of that though.
And How can I not mention what started me off loving music . The Beatles. That has been something Ill never get tired of watching and listening to.
Most of the time I'm listening to stuff on YouTube with headphone on . The TV and 5.1 set up is for what music I have on DVD and Also Movies .
I'm also so sick of the pathetic sound that comes from only the TV speakers as well.
Rob
Pagie 25th January 2023, 07:57 PM Iv'e still got a gramophone with a windup handle.
derekcohen 25th January 2023, 08:54 PM Hi again Rob
I am not a surround sound fundi. As mentioned, my set up is geared to two channel stereo for music. Mostly we just listen to the TV speaker. However, when there is something worth listening to on the TV, the hifi connects. Still stereo, but also with a sub-woofer (in the corner), and the sound is excellent. The point is that stereo sound with the TV is another avenue to consider. And, if that grabs you (because of the convenience), then consider going one step further and getting a higher end sound bar for the TV. There are some superior - and expensive - ones out there.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYHnEnhpZeQ&ab_channel=AndrewRobinson
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mu3fF_rfCQA&ab_channel=AndrewRobinson
My two-speaker system ...
https://i.postimg.cc/V6tTWRdp/1.jpg
Regards from Perth
Derek
Mr Brush 26th January 2023, 08:53 AM Agreed. After getting a high end Samsung soundbar (with about 10 individual speakers in it), I wonder how I ever put up with the crappy sound from the (Samsung) TV alone. There are some very effective soundbars out there.
Good enough for anything but the hard core audiophiles?
JZG 26th January 2023, 10:45 AM A 2.1 or 3.1 speaker set-up gets you everything other than some surround sound effects for movies and avoids the tricky part of placing and wiring the rear speakers. For concert viewing I think a pair of bigger speakers or a 2.1 system with somewhat smaller speakers would give you 99% of what a 5.1 system does.
auscab 26th January 2023, 11:05 AM One of the things that I keep thinking about the 5.1 speaker set up is how to do the wiring to the rear and where to put those speakers . Its a problem area .
We are in a more open plan living area now with the sitting/TV dining and kitchen all in the one space. Rear speakers have no where to go unless I do some sort of free standing set up or put them way back in the kitchen. I can see in house WW3 with you know who on that. And the wiring ??
Ive just been listening to the sound bar links Derek put up . They look good. I don't know much about these things.
Questions .
Do wireless speakers need charging to work ? Do you have to check battery level and charge ?
And do these soundbars just connect to the TV . No Amp needed ? I cant see an amp in between so that must be the way ?
Mr Brush 26th January 2023, 11:32 AM Soundbars have multiple ways of connecting to a TV; which you use depends on the vintage of the TV. No amplifier required. Samsung has Bluetooth, optical (TOSLINK), and HDMI to connect directly to TV, and they just need mains power.
I only got a Samsung soundbar to go with a Samsung TV just for the integration - it all works seamlessly off one remote.
I have the Samsung Q990B, but those Bose soundbars which Derek linked to also have a very good reputation. By clever use of multiple speakers in the one soundbar (room modelling, audio delay techniques?) some can almost approximate to surround sound from just the soundbar placed beneath the TV.
Mr Brush 26th January 2023, 11:33 AM It might be worth finding a retailer where you can audition TV soundbars in a proper listening room, rather than in an open shop. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised :cool:
JZG 26th January 2023, 11:43 AM Do wireless speakers need charging to work ? Do you have to check battery level and charge ?
most wireless speakers eliminate the speaker wire but have an amp built in instead so you usually plug them into a PowerPoint. There are rechargeable ones though which should get you through some hours.
I would find having to move them To recharge them and having to plan ahead a bit too annoying. If you really want rear sound a Soundbar that emulates surround might be the Way to go but they are physically small speakers with the compromises that requires.
Beardy 26th January 2023, 11:54 AM I wanted to go from a component system with floorstand speaker to a soundbar due to room placement constraints.
I researched the heck out of it and went to several stores to audition to as many as I could on the hotlist and the Bose 900 with subwoofer was my syand out pick. It was also the dearest but still peanusts compared to a component system
I have had it for two years now and are happy with the outcome. I mainly stream spotify and utube music
Sonos it the best for integration of multiple speaker setups but sound quality is lacking compared to others IMO
FenceFurniture 27th January 2023, 08:46 PM There is another option, known as "Nearfield" or "Desk-Fi", and it is the direction that I have pursued. Don't have a TV now, just use the computer monitor. Tunes are stored on an external hard drive, fed to a music software pgm (JRiver Media Center), then out to an external DAC (computer DACs are rubbish), which goes to a 6 band equaliser, which goes to a small headphone amp. I can then use either headphones or send the feed to a studio monitor system (two stereo monitors + subwoof, so 2.1). All the speakers are 1 metre or less from, at my desk. Monitors = amps built into the speakers.
The sound is killer, but it's probably a $15k system.
It means that I can send YouTube sound through the system, if it is warranted. We don't watch TV, and just use iView or SBS On Demand. I have a Blu-Ray DVD player for the computer (again, small) but I am yet to investigate how it performs for watching DVDs (I'm sure it will be fine).
Re 5.1 vs 2.1: the centre channel is pretty irrelevant because those mono duties can be done with equally split stereo, and the two rear channel don't have much fed to them, so I don't really miss it at all.
I can post more info on request, but as it is a re-investment in components, it may not appeal. It is particularly good for only one viewer.
Moondog55 24th May 2023, 03:15 PM Good home theatre amplifiers are really quite cheap if all you want is 5.1/ 7.1-7.2
But real music impact won't happen with tiny speakers no matter what subwoofers you have.
You may have WAF problems but if your main speakers are tiny the music will almost always sound thin and tinny
Speakers have always been the weak link in the music reproduction chain simply because good speakers are not cheap.
I am lucky as my music reproduction has always been my own priority and I have good WAF
So I can have decent speaker boxes hung off the walls for out HT.
Lot's of good cheap used speakers around for not much money tho, it is important to have all the speakers in the system the same tho.
My cheap Blu-Ray player plays the music DVDs well enough and the beauty of the change in how some people reproduce music means DVDs can be bought at Op-Shops for around a dollar each now where-as used vinyl is fetching $20- to $50- for rubbish
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