Restoring a Rainbow 12' scow

[ChasingRainbows]

Name is Adrian. I have just begun restoring a Rainbow 12' scow circa early 60's. Below is a picture of what they look like for those of you that dont know what they are ( I didn't until 4 weeks ago ) and for those of you that may know about them then Please contact me.
I purchased this complete and original example 4 weeks ago and have found that it is not only in great shape, it is quite possibly the last of it's era. So the plans for a quick lash of paint and some simple repairs have gone out the window and replaced with plans for a complete and authentic restoration. This isn't difficult because the boat has been in storage for something like 35 years and needs very little work, mainly cosmetic. The difficult part is tracking down people who know about them. I have managed to track down some plans and some basic information about them but since the competitive class was disbanded during the early 80's there is not much that is readily available. I would like to if possible preserve this example and to gather up any pictures, documents, anecdotes etc to also preserve the history of the class. I would appreciate any information that anybody out there may have, no matter how small or irrelevant you may think it is.
Now. I am not a woodworker by any stretch of the imagination, I own a panel saw and a claw hammer, and so I will be posting to this thread often to ask questions of you all and to seek guidance. The aim of this project was initialy just to go sailing again after 17 years and I was enthusiastic about that, but now I am more enthusiastic about preserving a piece ( no matter how small) of Australian sailing history. So your observations, sugestions and general know how would be greatfuly accepted.
So far I have merely stripped back most of the varnish and I am eager to progress, but not untill all of the varnish has gone. I just have some fiddly bits in the cockpit to finish.

[Robert WA]

I crewed a Rainbow for two years at the Port Adelaide Sailing Club. That would have been in the 1950s, the first year was, possibly, 1957/58 season. The boat was an old timer, then, called Skite.

Nice little boat to sail provided the sea didn't get up too much. They flew down wind, to the point of being scary.

[shanefra]

skippered my rainbow in port lincoln (sa) up until 1990 i think..
until it self destructed and started sinking:) that was probably
the last year of rainbows in port lincoln as everyone moved to
the much better 125 class. i think port lincoln was one of the
last fleets?? http://www.plyc.com.au/newhistory.htm#Rainbow

[ChasingRainbows]

Thanks Shane
I had seen the plyc website and I sent them an e-mail last week regarding any further information they may have or contacts but as yet I haven't heard anything from them.

I found this about an hour ago an American site selling plans.
http://www.dngoodchild.com/5365.htm

The picture is very close to mine. My sail no. is V 62 and so plus or minus a year they would be the same age.

[Boatmik]

Wanted Information on the Rainbow Class
I have recently acquired an early 60's Rainbow in excelent original condition. If anybody used to sail one, still sails one, or knows absolutely anything about them please contact me via e-mail or 0408 378 708
Posted By:[email protected]

Hi Adrian,

This was all I was able to dig out - and I suspect it might be you anyhow!

Good luck.

Boatmik

[ChasingRainbows]

Yeah thats me......
None the less thank you.

[shanefra]

dont know how much info you will get off plyc... its been a while
since rainbows have raced. prob the only things they would have
are championship results over the years. probably the only reason
rainbows lasted so long at port lincon is its large well protected bay.
keeps conditions pretty flat, which you need in a rainbow:)
my old rainbow was given to an uncle who did it up, still going
i think... not too bad for a circa 1970's racing yacht...

[ChasingRainbows]

Here is where I am at.
All of the varnish has been stripped off the hull and deck using a heat gun, I am still finishing the cockpit. Here is my first question. Due to the discoloration of the timber from either the coverage of the varnish or the lack thereof I dont think that it would be feasable to varnish it again and so I will look at painting it. What I need to know is; Does the timber have to be sanded back until all color of the varnish has gone? The heat gun and scraper have removed the actual varnish but it has left a stain where coverage was still thick and healthy. Will this affect either filler or undercoat from adhereing to the timber? And so do I have to sand until I get the appearance of new fresh timber or is that going too far?

Adrian

[bitingmidge]

Adrian,
Wait for someone really clever like the Micks (boat or journeyman)... in the meantime chew on this:

I'd take all the fittings off before doing anything else. There are signs of a bit of water penetration through some of the fixings (the black stain in the timber), so I'd drill them a bit oversize and fill all with epoxy filler (You'll need to drill new screw holes later).

I would sand all the goo off (I emphasise the "I" there, because it's what I'd do, and I'm not an expert!), go slowly and try not to go through the top veneer of the ply though.

Then I'd give it a few light coats of epoxy (see boatmik's post on the Cadet dinghy thread), before making up my mind. Despite the odd waterstain, I think you'll find it will look pretty good and varnish will be fine.

To answer your question though, you'd no doubt get away with primer and paint over the existing surface, as a general rule if the paint is stuck to the substrate, as long as you use a compatible product, it'll stay stuck.

I'm looking forward to seeing more progress!
Cheers,

P
:D

[ChasingRainbows]

Ok well hmmmm
This pic was taken day before yesterday, and since; I have removed the mast step which was mounted on a strip of malthoid(?) and the are no signs of water damage to the timber beneath it. The inspection ports have been removed ( had to drill the heads of the brass bolts holding them on as the nut had seized to it ). The forward stay attatchment point remains because I am unsure whether the three stainless screws holding it in place are in fact self tappers or if they have a nut on the otherside, if the latter is the case I will need arms 7 foot long to get to them.
As for epoxy........
This part of discussion was going to come later, but...
This boat is original and as was when built thus I am the first one to mess with it. When constructed it was done with copper nails and resourcinol ( unsure on spelling ) and the only epoxy / glass used that I can find is under the decking to the gunwhales. The big thing I have is this. To use epoxy and glass in the restoration would this be deemed as restoration or modification? Remebering that I want to keep it as authentic as possible.
I have resigned myself to the fact that I will have to use an epoxy based filler on both the deck and hull, as the darker grey areas you se in the picture are where the varnish has cracked and peeled leaving the timber exposed and it has pitted ( if thats a wood term, I am far more familiar with steel ) . The pitting has resulted in grain of the top veneer of ply open up and there are dips in these grey areas as much as 1.5 mm deep and so they will need to be filled and faired to acheive a smooth finish. I want to glass all the seams ie. along the gunwhales, the chines, the deck to the transom and the square edge from cockpit to deck to give the glue a chance to keep doing its job but I am unsure whether this would be deemed as I said a restoration or a modification.
The biggest fear I have is destroying something that has lasted this long with my cack handed ness or poor decisions.

[ChasingRainbows]

Just took the camera out to the garage just now. This might give a better indication of where I am at. 1.As you can see the varnish it self has been removed but it has left the stain 2. This pic shows a bit clearer where the varnish has cracked and peeled

[journeyman Mick]

Adrian,
Wait for someone really clever like the Micks (boat or journeyman)...

Sorry Midge, I know next to nothing about this field:o

The only clever thing I can say about this, seeing most of the timber boat work I've done was on traditional planked hulls whilst working for others, is to get good technical advice. Find a marine paint supplier who knows their stuff and tell them what you have and what you want to achieve and get them to reccomend a paint system for your application. If you don't know of a good supplier then go to several with the same information, they may be selling different products but they should come up with paint systems that are fairly similar. Hopefully BoatMik can steer you in the right direction.

Mick

PS Midge, I thought my tip of throwing salt in the bilges (standard practice on timber hull trawlers etc but apprently a no no on ply and composite boats:o ) was a bit of a giveaway as to my lack of knowledge:rolleyes:

[shanefra]

when we did up my rainbow (looks pretty similar to yours stripped back)
we just sanded it up real nice then wacked on a few coats of marine
varnish. mine had alot bigger wave striker on the deck though? might
have been a bit of an updated design after they worked out scows in wave
get pretty wet up front:). also mine had a nice tapered aluminum mast:)
too bad i was 6foot4 and looked like giant in the thing... had to just about lay down
to get thru tacks..:(

[Daddles]

too bad i was 6foot4 and looked like giant in the thing... had to just about lay down
to get thru tacks..:(

Cripes Shane, you remind me of a bloke I know who wanted to go dinghy racing. He wound up on TS16s because they were the only boats where he could get under boom :eek:

Richard

[ChasingRainbows]

Todays update.
I took the sails to a sailmaker earlier in the week and asked them to inspect them for me to find if they were still serviceable. I also asked if they could provide a quote on new sails that I could use while keeping the originals stored away. The concensus is that the sails could still be used but I would be better off replacing them " Nobody uses cane battens anymore cause they're crap." ( I have the complete set of cane battens to go with the originals.) The quote came back at $1630 which included main With battens, jib, and a spinaker. Is this reasonable? I had explained to them that I was restoring the boat and I certainly wasnt looking to race, but it would seem that I am being quoted on the latest and greatest.
Perhaps I could commision The Midge to cut me some sails from poly tarp (?)
Today I also received in the mail the class manual on Rainbows circa mid 60's from Nick Hutton at Sandy Bay Sailing club. This includes the history ( up to the 60's ), basic class specs on dimensions, sail plans, hull plans, construction plans and tips, timber requirements and tuning and sailing. Many thanks go to Nick for getting this to me. It was coincidental that it surfaced on the same day that I wrote an e-mail to Nick ( who heads the Sandy Bay Sailing Club ) requesting any information his club may have on the class, that an older member walked into the club carrying a garbage bag of books and sailing memoribilia which happened to include this manual!
Last night I also made contact with a Gent named Don Chaplain from SA who still owns and sails 4 Rainbows out of Largs bay sailing club. He suggested that I should be talking to his Son inlaw Mark who was apparently a state title holder and an organiser for the class here in Vic. Thus I made contact with him and spoke with him for over 30mins and he is keen to see my Rainbow in the flesh. I am appreciative of this as I realy need someone with knowledge of the boat to look it over and advise me whether I am being too precious about restoring it or if it realy is worthy of being resurected to it its original glory. I have sent Mark some pics via e-mail and I will put the boat on the van roof and take it down to him to inspect maybe next weekend.

No time to work on it this weekend cause I am helping a mate move house.
Still, the research continues.....

[Daddles]

Adrian, please spend some time in the company of dinghy racers. They do NOT understand wooden boats like I do and, I suspect, like you do. They think nothing of spending squillions of hours rebuilding an old wreck but consider anyone building a new one mad. I kid you not. Also, despite what they say, their attitudes are twisted by the racing bug. I found being in a dinghy racing club a surreal experience (hey, I'm weird, I don't expect to fit into the 'norm').

None of this need be a problem and if you are intending to immerse yourself in racing this boat, seriously racing it, much of what they say is correct.

However, if all you wish to do is resurrect an old boat for the fun of it, if all you want to do is have fun sailing with others, you may wish to question their attitudes.

I'm someone who builds boats because I enjoy building them. To me, the joy of creating a working creature from raw sheets of ply and planks of timber, is more important than this week's cup at the sailing club. I view boats differently to the average sailing club member. I've seen blokes start restorations requiring more work than a new construction, blokes who have expressed horror at the thought of building from scratch :rolleyes:

In other words, there are some weird attitudes out there. The trick is to find which one suits you and to live with it. (yes, the letter from MY doctor says I'm nuts but I'm safe :D ).

As for the price of sails, I had a lug sail for Redback made for $300 - that's a single lug sail for a pram. I've been told that I can get a jib and mainsail for my Yellowtail for about $700, but perhaps I need to know the right people to achieve that. In either case, $1,600 sounds a hell of a lot. Secondly, perhaps you don't need to spend that up front. You suggest otherwise. Get it sailing, then think about wings. Thirdly, the front runners of any class will buy front line sails, use them for a season and then sell them ... the average fleet runner won't notice the difference. I'd look for alternatives (such as the club champion's second hand set) before forking out $1,600.

Boats are a weird world. You need to work out where an advisor is coming from BEFORE you weight his advice. Getting advice from me is getting advice from someone who loves building and doesn't really give a toss about ultimate performance (as long as it works) and doesn't really know as much as he likes to think he does. Talk to a recent national champion in any class, and you can bet that his priorities all revolve around chasing the last few poofteenths of performance and few at that level really understand what the muggins sailor is all about (though some do). That doesn't mean that you ignore the race winner, because a lot of what works for him will aid the muggins like me (like Mik Storer's foil shapes), but ...

Am I helping?
I hope so.
Just remember, the only gospel was written by someone trying to do something totally different to what you want to do. Take it quietly, do it to the best of your ability, and feel proud at what you achieve. If others don't share your pride, that's their problem, not yours.

Richard

[Boatmik]

Howdy,

Richard's Rant (if I may call it that) is pretty much spot on.

The first thing to work out is where you are coming from.

Then you can evaluate the advice you are given.

I doubt there is much logic in bringing a 1970s Rainbow up to full modern racing spec. But if that's what you want to do - it's fine. But you do have to be sure that's what you actually want to do.

But if you just want to restore the existing boat to look like the 1970s boat that it is you can still make use of the racing guys info.

For example, I would use the racing guy's positions for all fittings - particularly for all ones to do with mainsail and jib sheeting, but keep the fittings you have now. Use the sails you have now too - or pick some up secondhand. Be aware that Rainbows are not all that common and it is unlikely that there will be anyone selling good sails after a year of use (there are always a few in the most popular classes that do exactly that.

There is value in not updating the boat too much - keeping it in good 1970s condition and use it - also only if that is what you want!

The new sail price sounds about right for three sails and battens. But unless you are racing regularly against other Rainbows you will never know the difference.

Lots of people get caught up in the "Arms Race" of modern dinghy racing. Be aware that with proper fitting placement but everything much the same a top notch sailor could jump in your boat and finish in the top third of a fleet of 100 boats - even with the existing sails and foils.

If you want a sail quote speak to Brett Averay at Binks Sails 08 82946211. He is trustworthy and if you tell him what you have planned - to get a 1970s boat into 1970s form at reasonable cost - he will give you a benchmark price for the lot. There is lots of labour in all sails - the only real price advantage of Richard's discussion of polytarp ones is that you can do the labour yourself. The materials are a relatively small part. (BTW polytarp won't stand up to the loads a Rainbow can put on them - just in case you are thinking of going that way.)

Best Regards

MIK

[dazzler]

What about a black paint job, smiley shark teath, ramming rods and small cannon and just go and have some fun sinking everyone!:D

Now that would be fun, and you can grab a new sail as they go down!:D

[bitingmidge]

Dazzler,

With an attitude like that, YOU need a PDRacer!

P
:D :D :D

[shanefra]

from the first piccy, those sails dont look tooo bad. probably blown out of
shape a bit, but just whack some new battens in, fair fix any probs with hull,
varnish and sail... easy:) its not as though u will be racing against other rainbows,
and they are more sensitive to weight than cruddy sails (says the
6'4 bloke who used to get creamed on the race course by 50kg midgets
every week:)...)

[dazzler]

Dazzler,

With an attitude like that, YOU need a PDRacer!

P
:D :D :D

Actually a mate and I were politely asked to no longer fly our remote control planes at the local club after we were chasing each other and both collided with a blokes replica tiger moth:D

Funny thing was mine just knicked the moth and made it wobbly into the path of my mates.:p

Anyway, sorry seaman you can have your forum back:rolleyes::D


dazzler

[ChasingRainbows]

The rainbow project has been progressing slowly with almost all the varnish now removed. I am now spending an hour or so at a time sanding miniscule areas around the difficult areas. Filling and epoxy work will begin shortly, for now though I am concentrating on preparing the boat as best I can. Normaly I charge right into things and regret the rush when the poor results show through.
I have a bone to pick with that bloody puddle duck thing as well. They got me thinking about a land yacht at one part, and the poly tarp seemed simple as well. And so it was with they're way of thinking; read cheap, that a mate and I have embarked on an endeavour to make the cheapest and most fun land yachts possible. We had initialy thought about the poly tarp idea but found for the same cost we were able to source windsurfer rigs. This could also be a path for PD's as well, unless you are a purist and find the need to manufacture your own spars and sail.
Now this project is not even remotely related to woodworking however if you are interested in our Land Yachts you can view it at;
http://landyachts.co.nz/cs/forums/thread/52.aspx
Cheers for now
Adrian

[sinjin1111]

Many moons ago i was a boatbuilder and repaired (some) Rainbows. Mostly redecking etc after clotts dropped or fell through them C/board cases and so on.
For a boat as old as yrs one of the main problems is the glue maybe well and truely on the way out. You can tape up the seams which is not hard but this would not be the thing to do if you want to keep it original. If you want to have a new coat or 10 of clear Poly you will have to get ALL the original varnish off. Your boat looks in great shape so be careful how you go about this sort of thing. Its not difficult to sand through laminations and ruin the ply. Your problem then will be trying to match the ply. If you want to sail this boat pay extra care arounf your C/board case. Its not a difficult job to get your boat in really good shape. But it will take a fair bit of care. And your biggest issue is what do you really want to do with it...Ie...take it out a couple of times a yr. Or use it whenever you can.
Sinjin
PS i'm in Melb so if you want to have a chat over the phone feel free.

[Boatmik]

From my experience just reglassing the seams will give more than enough strength as epoxy is being used - the old method of using polyester resin worked OK in conjunction with the timber on the inside, but is not reliable enough on it's own for stressed structures.

The advice to check around the centrecase is excellent as it is one of the most highly stressed components.

It might be worth considering running a fillet (diameter 2.5 times the thickness of the ply in the area being considered) along the higher stressed components.

They are - centreboard case, shroud and forestay attachment and mast step and other structure that takes the mast loads into the boat. It might be worth having a bit of a gentle pry and making sure none of them are on the verge of coming off first. If they are coming off it is great - just remove them - clean them up (or replace) and glue in place with the epoxy.

I wouldn't go ahead and epoxy fillet everything - it will add too much weight and the glass tape will be doing the work anyhow. But I would take a 1 inch brush and work a couple of coats along all the pieces of timber inside the boat that hold things together. It will go into any cracks and gaps and make things just a bit stronger without adding too much weight.

Michael

[ChasingRainbows]

OK here is where I am at.
Mick I respect your advice on glassing and it was definitely what I was considering in order to get back out and go sailing in her.........but.
If you go back to my first post I implied that I was interested in restoring her to her original and authentic condition since it is a well preserved example. The whole boat in its construction had been glued using resourcinol with the only epoxy and tape running along the inside of the seam/join between the deck and gunwhales.
As such I have made many enquiries all around Aus and I have finaly made contact with the son of the designer of this craft. The Rainbow was originaly designed by one R J Hill of Perth and according to his son Graeme was first made from tea chests as the Hill family owned a Tea house over there in WA. Since I first acquired the Rainbow I had a notion that it might be something a little bit special hence my enquiries and investigation before doing anything too detrimental to it, and possibly incurr the wrath of the likes of that rabid dingo fella;). To date I have only removed the varnish from it that was in relatively poor condition and had been atacked by a previous owner in parts with a sander.
I have a conundrum that I hope will cause much debate and musing here on this forum between the traditionalists and the sailing enthusiasts. As I have previously said I bought the boat to get back out on the water and sailing again. I saw it as a cheap repair and away we go, and if this was a 20 year old mirror then you would never have heard from me and that is what I would have done. However this boat is circa 1956 - 1958 and is completely original of this era and once again as I have stated before I dont want to be the guy to bodge it up with a dash of liquid nails and a coat of house paint. Graeme hill was certainly pleased and suprised to hear from me regarding this boat and has expressed an interest in acquiring it himself to add to the collection of his fathers memory which may well be displayed in the Australian Maritime museum over in Perth. Now I have agreed to this and only asked for the reimbursment of my initial outlay and I am not looking to profit from him as I know what it would mean to him to have it.
Now the debate that I have is this. What would be of greater value to the memory of the designer, to have a 50 year old example rejuvinated using current methods and materials to sail again and to keep it ongoing for another 50 years or to have it handed over to a museum to be restored and put on display forever more never to be sailed again?
I am not doing anything further with the Rainbow at this stage until I hear more from Graeme. I am however still trying to track the history of this particular boat as it appears from all the documentation I have, to have been built to national standard at minimum weight and additional strength. It appears that it was at the cutting edge of the class design for the time. Sadly however I cannot find any club race records at this stage to prove that it was a worthy contender. But having said that I cant find any records that prove that it wasn't either.....I cant find any bloody class records at all. So if anybody may be able to help then please contact me. Any information whatsoever is valuable no matter how small. This Rainbow carries the Sail no V 62. the sailmaker was one Graham C Douglas of Blairgowrie. The boat appears to have been in storage out of the elements for a considerable amount of time, but I dont know where, surely somebody does.

Cheers
Adrian

[journeyman Mick]

Adrian,
maybe you can have your cake and eat it too. As a historical record it's worthy of archiving/displaying in a museum. Maybe you could build a copy using today's technology as a user. That way you'd be keeping the original desgner's work alive in two equally valid and important ways.

Mick

[Boatmik]

Howdy,

All taken on board - the restoration/rebuilding/preservation argument is a long one indeed - and its part of the process to go through the positives and negatives before doing too much work to any particular boat.

It is truly worthwhile to put the boat in the original condition - there are not many older sailing dinghies that are pure versions of the original - most have bits and pieces that have been added through the years.

Like the NS14 at the Sydney Maritime Museum has one of the very early hulls, but the rig and sails are much more recent.

It will be hard work finding fittings and ropes that are suitable - but you need to stick to your guns!

Even if plywood needs replacing it becomes a difficult decision too. Take the piece out and you lose the evidence of the original material and original workmanship.

Anyway - these are the sorts of things that you willl have to think about and find a satisfactory solution to each of them.

Also make sure the museum has the resources to both display and continue to care for the boat - having documented history may well help that process - ie if there is documentation it makes hte boat more valuable as an exhibit.

Anyway - food for thought - and best of luck!!!

Michael

[ChasingRainbows]

umm yeah Mick I found all the fittings I need so far....... They are still attatched to the boat. :p I have also been busy collecting information and pictures from Rainbow sailors past. The work is continuing and I am not doing anyhting further to the actual boat, but I am busy collecting contacts around Australia.

Cheers
Adrian

[swaf19]

I still sail at Chelsea Yacht Club (on Port Phillip Bay) where they used to sail Rainbows competitively in the 1960’s and 1970’s. A friend of mine had one which I sailed on occasionally. Not much buoyancy up front during a spinnaker gybe from memory.
To coincide with the centenary of Chelsea railway station, Chelsea Yacht Club is holding a Centenary Regatta on February 3rd, 2007.
Old timber yachts such as Rainbows, Vee Jays, Vee Esses, GP14’s, Skates, Heavy weight Sharpies, etc are most welcome. Visiting yachts can sail in the regatta or participate in a static display on the beach. If you or anyone else with a timber yacht is interested please contact the secretary at www.chelseayachtclub.com.au (http://www.chelseayachtclub.com.au/)

[ChasingRainbows]

I have previously e-mailed Chelsea YC regarding any details they may have or persons of interest that may have had an involvement with the class, but I didn't receive a reply. No matter. As you can see I am trying to establish a history of both this boat ( V 62 circa 1956 - 1958) and of the class so if you could pass on my request once again to your club I would appreciate it. Now might actualy be an excelent time for research as no doubt members of your club may well be digging through old photographs, documents or memories they have in preparation for your event. If the boat is still in my possesion I would be keen to display my Rainbow in the hope that somebody might recognize it. I am in two minds ( or is that three now ) as to whether it should be sent to Perth or should it stay here in Vic where it may well be part of local club history. For now though it is resting warm and peacefuly in the garage awaiting it's fate.
Attatched are just some pics and docs I have uncovered so far.

Cheers
Adrian

[swaf19]

Hi Adrian,
could you please resend your email to me so I can follow up for you. [email protected]
Could you please provide a contact email or prferably ph number.
Rainbows ceased sailing at Chelsea in the late 1970's but there are still some ex Rainbowers as members.
We have recently located an ex Chelsea Rainbow under a house. Its ex owner (from when it was at Chelsea) plans to get it going for the Centenary Regatta. It wont be in the same condition as yours and is a late example where yours is an early example.
best regards,
Stephen

[ChasingRainbows]

Ok, the project has well and truly stalled as I am fearful of destroying something from the past that would be precious to some ( many? ). I have not done anything to the boat since stripping the varnish and since I feel that my skills as a woodworker / boatbuilder / archeaologist are not quite up to spec I want to pass this boat on to someone that can do it justice. On top of this I need / want some garage space back. I want to offer the Rainbow to any members of this forum that feel they can step up to the plate and fullfill the restoration, keeping in mind that it is a mint example of it's era.
And so I am accepting all offers from any members of the forum for the next week before I release it to the hordes on E-bay. Now if it was a money thing ( God knows I need it ) I would write up a full description on E-bay describing its pedigree and history and start it at a price of $1000, and I would more than likely get it. But this is not a money thing, from the right person willing to detail and document they're progress on this forum all I ask is the price I paid, this is personal and passionate. Please read back through the forum thread and PM me or post your replies in the open for all to see detailing why you are the most deserving.
Clearly if I dont get a reasonable response within 7 days then it will be going to the house paint and liquid nails brigade.
As far as acquisition goes then I am willing to deliver to anywhere in Vic for expenses, you can pick up, or I can assist with interstate freight ( crate at your expense ).


( The missus doesn't understand, " if it is so valuable then sell it and lets go shopping! " )

Please, any questions stick em up here in the forum or call me 0408 378 708

Cheers
Adrian

[Boatmik]

Howdy Adrian,

You can do the project I am sure - but only if you want to of course - I am not pressuring you here.

But you are the guy with the passion to make it happen in the right way.

Boatbuilding is not rocket science.

If you want any technical help (that fits in with restoring the boat to close to its original state - now I understand what you want to do) I am happy to help.

Michael

[ChasingRainbows]

Thanks for the encouragement Mick, but I have some other projects going and so I need the space in the garage.
The offer still stands. If anybody wants it let me know.

[Daddles]

Hang it from the roof in the shed. It'll be safe and will get in the way enough to encourage you to finish it :D

Richard

[Boatmik]

Hang it from the roof in the shed. It'll be safe and will get in the way enough to encourage you to finish it :D

Richard
Upside down.

MIK

[meerkat]

DUDE Nooooooooooooo

Like Mik & Daddles say hang it up for a while but PLEASE do ebay it.

I'm doing an international cadet up(http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showthread.php?t=29435), it's stalled a little too being winter and all but i'll have it finished in a month or so. I have no real experience but with the help from the guys i've muddled my way through and it's starting to come together.

Hang in there if you can, it'll be worth it.

Regards
Andrew

[bitingmidge]

Adrian,

Unlike the others, I am not a stranger to half-built dreams! :D

Why not approach the contacts you have made to see if there is any interest from some of the old stagers? Even a maritime museum may take it on even if it is just to throw in archives for the next few decades.

Anything but sell it to someone for a crab boat!

Cheers,

P

[ChasingRainbows]

No but seriously it has to go. You are certainly an encouraging lot, I didnt think it would be this difficult to give away! I am only asking $226.00 for it ( same as I paid ). My time is spread too thin, and my garage is not big enough for all of the ongoing projects. Even if you haven't got the money at the moment, you can pay me in installments, form a syndicate amongst yourselves or write me an IOU just please I want it to go to someone with a passion and enthusiasm for the boat.

By the way.... I love that signature of the beer truck. Anybody noticed my occupation?

[ChasingRainbows]

Sold !!!!!!!

clearly owning just one plywood boat is never enough.

You wil never guess who!

[meerkat]

Yep I couldn't resist :o:eek:

So I will continue this thread hopefully showing some better decisions and progress than the cadet and look forward to getting more history on it as well.

I gotta say considering the weights and dimensions the rainbow is like a cadet on steroids :D

Quite an interesting boat.

[bitingmidge]

Fantastic result! Congratulations to you both.

I look forward to the saga continuing!

cheers,

P:D

[jmk89]

Me too:D

[Daddles]

Hey Meercat (or anyone else daft enough to take her), while you're in the mood for buying old, obscure boats, like to buy my old 12 footer, Henry? Genuine unkown design, reasonable condition. She's got good sails and bits. And all I want for her now is to have a good home (seriously, she's dying just sitting in my backyard).

Richard

[ChasingRainbows]

Well there is now a great big gaping hole in the garage.......oh yeah now I remeber why, I needed the space. But this one looks like the outdoors type. Rugged good looks and all:). Seriously though as I explained to Andrew this morning I was initialy looking for a cheap boat to get out and get amongst it all again, unfortunately the Rainbow didn't fit the bill, it was too good! I am in the market for something rough and rugged just for bashing about in. Must be cheap!
I wish Andrew and his boys all the best with the Rainbow and hope that they get alot of pleasure from working on it, uncovering it's history and from sailing it. I look forward to seeing them progress with it.

Cheers
Adrian

[meerkat]

Hey Meercat (or anyone else daft enough to take her), while you're in the mood for buying old, obscure boats, like to buy my old 12 footer, Henry? Genuine unkown design, reasonable condition. She's got good sails and bits. And all I want for her now is to have a good home (seriously, she's dying just sitting in my backyard).

Richard

Dang, nice colours :eek:

Considering my performance lately your remark about being daft fits.

oh yeah, btw the deadline for heaping it on expired after the 5th beer:D

No seriously I've had my fill now thanks.

Andrew

[meerkat]

Sorry for the lack of updates.

Well we sat down and sanded back the mast, boom and spinnaker pole. They have all come up nicely.

The mast has what appears to be some fibreglass reinforcement around where the stays connect to it. This will need a little attention before varnishing the mast.

The spinnaker pole has begun to seperate so we will have to reglue that together again.

[meerkat]

Some more history on it.

My dad found out that in 1967 62 'Balandra' won the Championship Series of racing at Mordialloc.:cool:

[ChasingRainbows]

So I see the cadet is finished ,kudos, but what has been happening with the Rainbow?



Adrian

[meerkat]

been a bit slow on the rainbow, put a patch on the hole in the hull but didnt take too well so now that we are back from the Cadet Nationals, we can do a few little repairs on the cadet and then focus on the rainbow.

[Boatmik]

Well,

How has the Cadet gone in club racing and the nationals - is your son having a hoot - and how is the boat holding together/performing.

I think you still may have some space to improve other performance of the boat further too!!

So tell us (er me) please!!!!!!

Er - maybe in the Cadet thread.

MIK

[meerkat]

okie dokie then.

The hole in the hull needed fixing so the damaged ply has been cut out and a replacement piece has been scarfed and glued in. There was a couple of places where the ply didn't stick down so i'll be retrying those bits later this week. (Skandia week this week:2tsup:)

Once that is done I'll fill and sand to even off the hull on the outside.

Went around and filled the nails around the hull coz the old filler was falling out and started to repair where the bow and top deck meet as it has started to seperate. The only place on the whole boat. There is a horizontal split in the bow that goes pretty much the whole width as well.

Most probably put some light glass on it to keep it secure and seal the front bouyancy tank. The only problem is that it won't look nice on the top.

We are trying to keep the top "natural" and due to the patch and various gouges, the hull will be white.

No need to glass/fillet the chines at this time because the original glue is like bear poo on rabbit fur. :D

The transom needs a little work to fill the holes left by the fittings ready for refit.

The ply on the hull needs some protection eg several coats of undercoat to fill the cracks and put some oil (or something) back into the ply.

For instance the cadet soaked up alot of the undercoat so I'm not sure whether that would be the best approach or something else, maybe a light poxy coat like for the deck.

Boom is fine, just a sand and recoat.

Mast needs the glass around where the stays and trapeze are attached looked at but
the rest looks good so once thats done, a sand and recoat.

Spinnaker pole has seperated and while we don't have a spinnaker it is not a big problem, we still need to reglue and recoat.

Foils ..
Centreboard/Spitfire wing doesn't need much if anything at all done and the rudder is pretty much in the same boat:;

Well theres a little update.. more to follow:2tsup:

[Boatmik]

The two big areas where advantages are to be had is with the sails and the foils.

Sails is not only the cut of the sails but also the setup for adjustment.

Foils just have to be perfectly shaped with a reasonable surface finish.

But I'd wait and see how your son goes with the rest of the season.

If he can get into the situation of borrowing a board from one of the hotshots and see what difference it makes it can be edifying. They can cost quite a lot, but are easy enough to make with templates.

Michael

[meerkat]

There are a pile of screws on the boom etc but have like corroded in the wood thereby making it extremely difficult to get out without breaking them off.

Does anyone know of a way to loosen them a tad ?

I was thinking a little water soaked into the wood might loosen things up a little.

[Boatmik]

Howdy,

One interesting engineering thing is that if you leave fastenings in the holes the compression strength of the timber is unaffected!

Interesting eh?!

Do you reckon they are glued in or just frozen or what?

MIK

[meerkat]

Mik if I said I understood what you were saying I'd be lying:-

Anyway no not glued just been there since pontius was a pliot :wink: so I'd say just "frozen".

[meerkat]

Oh well the boys have got some of the screws out:- maybe half of each screw. There are two options as I see them

1. drilling them out etc using the drill press and having large holes filled with poxy

2. Filling the holes as they are with the remaining bits of screws in them and move the fittings slightly to allow new screws to be used.

Any Ideas coz the 1st option sounds the best but I don't know how successful it will be ?

[Boatmik]

Option 2 is the better idea. Making bigger holes so you can fix smaller holes doesn't make sense in spars - and the epoxy won't be as strong as the timber it replaces - in terms of the types of load the spars will be under.

Sorry about being unintelligabelsdfle before. Just that having screws or nails in timber doesn't reduce the compression strength.

Michael

[meerkat]

well theres good news and bad news .....

The good news is that I've done the hull, that is filled and undercoated it:2tsup:

The bad news is that once I turned it over to start on the deck we noticed where the deck was seperating. :~ So then we looked at the condition of some of the ply deck and up forward there was a patch of delaminated ply, and aft the deck was soft enough that one poorly placed butt would go straight through it.

Also the front bouancy tank was actually a front water tank :doh: that is to say it would hold water better than it would hold a boat afloat :U

So upon further inspection the effort to fix these things compared to taking the lid off and checking out the complete damage and taking it from there was very little in difference.

Soooooo yup we took the lid off. See attached .

Basically it took little effort as the resourcinol (or whatever) had gone off in most places and even the fibreglass had decided to lose its hold on reality:;

Overall the hull is still pretty "stuck" but to be sure the suss areas will be filleted with poxy, holes filled etc. Then the lid will be stuck back on.... oh be still my beating heart:roll:

The daggerboard casing etc looks pretty good so not much needs to be done around there.:fingerscrossed:

[ChasingRainbows]

Just called past out of curiosity.
Been a while since any activity on the post, but looks like some progress has been made.
It's summer again, I still have no boat to bash about in. On the plus side I have managed to use the garage space to set up a complete motorcycle workshop. I have built 3 race bikes, but still have a longing to go sailing again.
One day:roll:

[Boatmik]

:--)

[rlm]

YouTube - Historical Sailing; 12' Rainbow scow, Brighton and Seacliff YC, circa 1960's

[Boatmik]

fantastic .. wonderful. Maybe a Brighton person will know .. but looks like late '60s or maybe a bit earlier.

MIK

[kats1719]

Gee that brings back memories i sailed a rainbow for about 9 years during the seventies and early eighties thy were a real hoot down wind. we built tow R36 and R45

[Stuart Harris]

I have just stumbled across this website and was most interested in reading about restoring a Rainbow.
I sailed Rainbows in Hobart for 6/7 years in late 60's early 70's. My boats were called Miyako and Misaki. Reprsented Tas in Adelaide, Melbourne and Perth and had a 2nd and a 3rd in Australian Champs. Won two Tasmanian senior titles and one junior title.
Terrific boats and many happy memories.
I have lots of photos and may be able to be of some assistance. Give me an email if I can help with anything specific.
I also mess about making models and would love to have some design specs/plans to make half hull of a Rainbow. If anyone can help me, that would be good.

[Boatmik]

Hi Stuart,

The thread about the rainbow is from a while ago, but the great thing that this forum does is to get stuff up on the net so people can find it later. So anything you can add here is great.

Personally a lot of the info of the heyday of Australian plywood boatbuilding needs to be saved ... so anything you can put up here would be greatly welcome.

Michael Storer

[graemet]

The video brings back memories of the plywood days in Sydney, VJs and Skates, twin planks and big kites and everyone built their own boat! The Skate is still sailing (in a highly modified form) but the 50th anniversary was held earlier this year at the Concord and Ryde Sailing Club on the Parramatta River. Well over a hundred old Skate sailors turned up, proving that they don't die, they just smell that way with wet woollen jumpers, football shorts and not a wetsuit or buoyancy vest in sight!
Thems were the days!:U
Cheers
Graeme

[ChasingRainbows]

Mick, exactly why I started this thread so long ago. There was bugger all info available to me so I figured by asking around people might come out of the woodwork ( pun intended :U) and thus those others that may well be looking like I was may stumble across it.
I still call by here from time to time but it seems Meerkat and the young fellas have let the thread slip. Nevermind I just hope that the job got finished and she is proudly bashing about the bay again.
I did enjoy the short journey I had with this boat. Following up history and talking with those that did sail them along with those that designed and built them.

Oh and stuart
From the 1st page of this thread http://www.dngoodchild.com/5365.htm
I did also acquire some original drawings and plans for the Rainbow from Sandy Bay Yacht club when I was researching this boat - they went with it so contact the current owner and see if you can get a copy.
Adrian

[draculam]

Sonic 5115
nearly ready for the water, only a few weeks away

[Hawk]

Nice looking boat Draculam.

There's another one up on EBay at the moment.

It's a shame it's so far away. I'd really love to do up one of these babies for myself. I really can't justify it yet until my boys know how to sail.

Rainbow Sailing Boat 12ft - eBay Sail, Boats, Boats, Watercraft, Cars, Bikes, Boats. (end time 13-Oct-09 16:18:42 AEDST) (http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Rainbow-Sailing-Boat-12ft_W0QQitemZ160366899663QQcmdZViewItemQQptZAU_Boats?hash=item25569cb1cf&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14)

[sailfast]

Hi Chasing Rainbows,
I am an ex rainbow sailor and builder. My father Ron Hill is the only designer of the class so I really had no option but to build boats with him and race them.
I am currently sailing a sharpie from East Fremantle Y.C. in Perth. I also own and manage Hill Sailmakers in Hilton near Fremantle.
The construction of a Rainbow is very simple ie western red cedar frames, gunwhales, chines and stringers. The king plank that runs the whole length of the bottom was usually made of meranti as the centreboard loads on the centrecase usually ended up with a leaky centrecase that is impossible to repair.
External glass tapes were often used on the chines, usually the resourcinal glue and brass brads or copper nails are enough to hold the boat together for many years.
The bow transom was usually made from Nyatoh or Meranti and the bow chainplate was screwed on with strong self tappers, often being glued in with epoxy- removal was done by heating the screw with the tip of a soldering iron softening the epoxy for easy removal.
Cheers,

[Boatmik]

Thanks for dropping by. That helps enormously filling in more of the picture about repairing the boats and also some more of the background.

Thanks hugely

MIK

[Andy B]

I had a Rainbow in about 1967, which I raced from Mordialloc Sailing Club on Port Phillip Bay. They planed at amazing speeds downwind with the flat-cut spinnaker set on an 11ft long spinnaker pole. They were a National Class at that time, with fleets in Victoria, South Australia and Tasmania. A modern stitch and glue ply/epoxy version would be simple to build and be a great boat for young teens. I forsook my Rainbow for the more sophisticated and sexier Cherubs, another wonderful speed machine. I suspect the instigator of this thread made a mistake in selling his Rainbow restoration project.

[sailfast]

I have just stumbled across this website and was most interested in reading about restoring a Rainbow.
I sailed Rainbows in Hobart for 6/7 years in late 60's early 70's. My boats were called Miyako and Misaki. Reprsented Tas in Adelaide, Melbourne and Perth and had a 2nd and a 3rd in Australian Champs. Won two Tasmanian senior titles and one junior title.
Terrific boats and many happy memories.
I have lots of photos and may be able to be of some assistance. Give me an email if I can help with anything specific.
I also mess about making models and would love to have some design specs/plans to make half hull of a Rainbow. If anyone can help me, that would be good.
Hi Stuart,
I have rainbow plans and a copy of the manual used when building a new boat, I also need copies of any photo's of rainbows , please contact ([email protected])
cheers
sailfast

[pantahjack]

Hi Chasing Rainbows,
I am an ex rainbow sailor and builder. My father Ron Hill is the only designer of the class so I really had no option but to build boats with him and race them.
I am currently sailing a sharpie from East Fremantle Y.C. in Perth. I also own and manage Hill Sailmakers in Hilton near Fremantle.
The construction of a Rainbow is very simple ie western red cedar frames, gunwhales, chines and stringers. The king plank that runs the whole length of the bottom was usually made of meranti as the centreboard loads on the centrecase usually ended up with a leaky centrecase that is impossible to repair.
External glass tapes were often used on the chines, usually the resourcinal glue and brass brads or copper nails are enough to hold the boat together for many years.
The bow transom was usually made from Nyatoh or Meranti and the bow chainplate was screwed on with strong self tappers, often being glued in with epoxy- removal was done by heating the screw with the tip of a soldering iron softening the epoxy for easy removal.
Cheers,

Hey Fred... Was busy surfing da net and what do ya know... Must pop in and say g'day.

For others I raced these fantastic little boats during the seventies. Even crewed with Graham on Angel a few times out of Perth Flying Squadron in Perth.

The highlight for me was when crewing on Pete Chappells Quecumber and sticking twin trapesses on for the 1972 nationals at Sandy Bay in Tassie. Had a blast during many seasons and 4 national regattas.

Jack (Gary Whitcombe)

[gybey]

Sail Boats X 2 (eBay item 110620611383 end time 12-Dec-10 18:39:43 AEDST) : Cars, Bikes, Boats (http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=110620611383&ssPageName=ADME:B:EF:AU:1123)

ebay

another fantastic RAINBOW, lotsa sails and a classic moth,plus a trailer thrown in