What is the Darkside?

[jugglingogre]

Well, I've been reading about it a bit in the forums here over the last couple of weeks and finally got around to joining the forum so I could ask.

What is the Dark Side? Do practitioners use the "force" to bend the wood to thier will or is it something else less sinister?

Cheers,

Pete.

[Shedhand]

Well, I've been reading about it a bit in the forums here over the last couple of weeks and finally got around to joining the forum so I could ask.

What is the Dark Side? Do practitioners use the "force" to bend the wood to thier will or is it something else less sinister?

Cheers,

Pete.Welcome to the madhouse Pete. Darksiders are generally regarded as recidivists who prefer using handtools to wreck/enhance the wood whioch comes their way. :D
Cheers
Apprentice Darksider. ;)

[Skew ChiDAMN!!]

Let's just say that the only difference a power black-out makes to their work methods is they may need to stop for a minute to light a candle...

[Waldo]

G'day Jugglingogre,

It's when you walk out of a shed at night and turn the light out. :D ;)



But then the darkside found me and I was enlightened when I found some hand planes and other ilk congregating in my shed calling me to pick them up and use them.

Welcome my sone. welcome to the machine.

[Studley 2436]

This is highly secret Juggling. The CIA is watching us and we must use secret language so they don't realise what we are up to. Various ordnance is refered to as planes, this includes Aircraft Amphibious Vehicles Transport and ICBM's There are several levels of destuctive elements at our disposal including Nuclear otherwise known as Scarey Sharp. Other smaller items you will find reference to include LVLA which is a particularly efficient device that is versatile in many situations making it a particularly deadly weapon. You will also notice the Veritas MKII which replaces the difficult to aim MKI although both are especially cutting in the hands of a skilled operator.Electrons refers to those not trained in hand to hand combat but are skilled with heavy machinery and very useful in looking after the rough and tumble of operations before the darksiders are called in to mop up any remaining resistance. Posts which say no electrons were slaughtered are saying that the darkside was able to deal with operations unassisted.

Don't worry about the lingo laddie you will find it all comes natural and you will speak it like a native in no time

Studley

[Shedhand]

This is highly secret Juggling. The CIA is watching us and we must use secret language so they don't realise what we are up to. Various ordnance is refered to as planes, this includes Aircraft Amphibious Vehicles Transport and ICBM's There are several levels of destuctive elements at our disposal including Nuclear otherwise known as Scarey Sharp. Other smaller items you will find reference to include LVLA which is a particularly efficient device that is versatile in many situations making it a particularly deadly weapon. You will also notice the Veritas MKII which replaces the difficult to aim MKI although both are especially cutting in the hands of a skilled operator.Electrons refers to those not trained in hand to hand combat but are skilled with heavy machinery and very useful in looking after the rough and tumble of operations before the darksiders are called in to mop up any remaining resistance. Posts which say no electrons were slaughtered are saying that the darkside was able to deal with operations unassisted.

Don't worry about the lingo laddie you will find it all comes natural and you will speak it like a native in no time

StudleyWell sed stud. ;)

[Knurl]

Welcome Pete, I'm a relative newbie too. Another aspect of the darkside I'm still learning from the masters is how to get illegal new gear into the shed, past SWMBO. Especially exxy stuff. When you figure out SWMBO you're almost ready for the dark side.

Actually...I've been trying to figure it out decades before I joined the forum.

[BobL]

. . . . Another aspect of the darkside I'm still learning from the masters is how to get illegal new gear into the shed, past SWMBO.

In the past I've even found it difficult to get "old" gear past SWMBO. Until Father-in-law's hand tools needed rescuing - now I can bring any old gear onto the property. "What's that for", "Oh that's the whoojarwatchmacalit doodad to fix the dingaling on your father-in-law's spokeshave", "OK".

New stuff is much harder, "why do you need that, does it come in a smaller model, Don't you have one at work, What about your brothers, Can't u hire one . . . . etc". Actually they are all good questions that I ask myself but usually fail to answer in the most sensible manner.

[jugglingogre]

Thanks all.

It seems I am a darkside aspirant as I only have a cordless drill. Everything else is powered by me. I'm not enjoying ripping even crapiata down the grain but the rest is fun.

My steelcraft block and hand plane from Mitre 10 do the job though I would love some better and more acurate planes.

I have the same problem getting any kind of gear into the shed. I think it is a common problem. I being in IT have a similar problem in my other office trying to get new gear in there :rolleyes:

A question about mitre's, why do my mitres always have a bow in them? The edges are on the line but the centre is always bowed out making a curve rather than a straight line.

I am clamping the wood to the mitre box but it doesn't seem to help.

Cheers and thanks for the replies.

Pete.

PS: what is SWMBO? I assume you are talking about your partner but what is the acronym?

[Termite]

She Who Must Be Obeyed, or else risk your life ......or something worse.:D

[MICKYG]

Welcome Pete,

Darkside is vere de light dont shine, and dere is no cords to plug in, just kidding.

Where old blokes get hung up on using hand tools of yesteryear, there is a small element of this in us all.;) Darkside gear usually found on ebay or at garage sales you just have to keep looking.

Hope you enjoy this great hobby

Regards Mike

[doug the slug]

Hi Jugglingogre, and welcome to the fruit farm,

Darksiders are a sub species who are easily recognisable at woodshows by their propensity to congregate in large numbers around sites like Lie Neilsen or HMT Gordon making appreciative clucking noises over obsolete equipment. when away from such gatherings the darksiders can also be identified by those in the know by the vaseline they always apply to their knuckles to prevent gravel rash. :D :D :D :D :D

seriously though, i do admire the absolute darksiders who are maintaining skills and equipment from yesteryear that are no longer practiced by professional woodworkers. lets face it everyone owns a chisel or two cos you cant do everything with a routerhttp://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/images/icons/icon14.gifhttp://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/images/icons/icon14.gif

[ele__13]

HMmmm i have very much a love of the dark side im one of those people who stands at a Lie Neilsen stand and pats them lovingly and whispers precious when the slug comes up to see what im looking at i put them gently down and walk away before i make 2 much of a goose of my self hehehehehehehehhe cheers all jules

[BobL]

Recently I have found a very good reason to re-develop my dark side. I used to just make sawdust on weekends and holidays but recently I have found it very relaxing to make some sawdust in the shed for an hour or so after dinner. The trouble is living in an inner city suburb I can't exactly start the dusty and joiner or TS up at 8pm, well I could but the neighbors would soon have the local council on my case. Instead I've have at these times returned to the dark side. Who can complain about the gentle swoosh-swoosh-swoosh of a hand plane or the zig-zig-zig of a hand saw. One thing doesn't change - the expletives when when I stuff up, but the neighbors don't seem to mind about that.

Cheers

[doug the slug]

The trouble is living in an inner city suburb I can't exactly start the dusty and joiner or TS up at 8pm, well I could but the neighbors would soon have the local council on my case.

if the local council ISN'T on my case i wonder why not, i adhere to all the regulations but but that doesnt stop the cretin neighbour complaining. after 9 years of this i'm on first name terms with representatives from all local authorities and they just phone me and say "your cretin neighbour complained again today". :D :D :D :D

[JDarvall]

Hi Jugglingogre, and welcome to the fruit farm,

Darksiders are a sub species who are easily recognisable at woodshows by their propensity to congregate in large numbers around sites like Lie Neilsen or HMT Gordon making appreciative clucking noises over obsolete equipment. when away from such gatherings the darksiders can also be identified by those in the know by the vaseline they always apply to their knuckles to prevent gravel rash. :D :D :D :D :D

:D So if Lie Neilsen fans are a sub species, what does that make me. I like beatup old planes better.



seriously though, i do admire the absolute darksiders who are maintaining skills and equipment from yesteryear that are no longer practiced by professional woodworkers. lets face it everyone owns a chisel or two cos you cant do everything with a routerhttp://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/images/icons/icon14.gifhttp://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/images/icons/icon14.gif
Seriously though, I do like ya tits !......

seriously seriously though, I don't think your right. plenty of professionals use hand tools for certain procedures, when its simply better to do by hand.
In fact I'd say there'd be few that use power tools exclusively.

[greensabbath]

The Darkside is the place to be in my opinion, i don't know why they consider it the "dark side" unless they mean that we can work in the dark since we don't require power. Sorry for my noobness, until i saw this thread, i thought going to the darkside was using some fancy new power tool that only require button pushing that my neighborhood pet squirrel could do :D

Oh, i'm a member of the Japanese hand tool darkside, is there a special phrase for that?

[Lignum]

seriously seriously though, I don't think your right. plenty of professionals use hand tools for certain procedures, when its simply better to do by hand.


Have a look at the best practitioners of wood around the globe, the ones we all revier. They all have one thing in common. They use both machine/power and hand tools. Their is probably an exception somewhere, but their arnt to many who use just hand power to create materpieces.

It takes just as much skill to master the use of a beltsander as it dose a smoother, maybe even more

Darksiders are at a disadvantage as they are only realy good at one side, whilst real woodworkers are good at both hand and machine/power:D

[jugglingogre]

Nick that is a seriously goodlooking case! You have got me thinking now about how I can mangle a few bits of wood and make something that looks nothing like yours.

(extreme case of wood/skill envy here).

How much of it was darkside and how much using powertools?

[greensabbath]

Nick that is a seriously goodlooking case! You have got me thinking now about how I can mangle a few bits of wood and make something that looks nothing like yours.

(extreme case of wood/skill envy here).

How much of it was darkside and how much using powertools?

Thanks a lot. Unfortunately, only the doors and the mortices were truly darkside (i was still transforming back then) but check this out:
http://forums.bit-tech.net/showthread.php?t=109996

That's what i am working on now, all the joints are from the darkside and also this:
http://www.nickfalzonedesign.com/portfolio.html
The second project down was something i did for university all by hand with an 11 inch ryoba saw and my chisels

[Lignum]

Nick:D Just finished watching the interview on DLTV. Great stuff. Did you have your heart in your mouth as he dropped the saw on the side of the case:eek: .. Looking foward to seeing the progress of the new case.

If anyone watches it (recomended) i couldnt fast foward to the start of the interview, but it starts at 10min 30 sec into it. So you can start it, get a cuppa and come back in 10 minute and have a look:D

[greensabbath]

Nick:D Just finished watching the interview on DLTV. Great stuff. Did you have your heart in your mouth as he dropped the saw on the side of the case:eek: .. Looking foward to seeing the progress of the new case.

If anyone watches it (recomended) i couldnt fast foward to the start of the interview, but it starts at 10min 30 sec into it. So you can start it, get a cuppa and come back in 10 minute and have a look:D

haha, it was a bit surreal actually and i was more embarassed for him than anything else since that saw doesn't mean too much to me now. If that had been one of my Mitsukawa saws it would have been another story

[JDarvall]

:D ohhhh, you Stirrer !



It takes just as much skill to master the use of a beltsander as it dose a smoother, maybe even more

I wouldn't know about that comparison. I don't have a beltsander (thank god).....more frikken bloody plastic, noisey, dusty crap ! :p ........ WHAT ! I CAN'T HEAR YOU SWEATHEART ! (hangon maybe thats a good thing :D )

If it is just as hard using it, then why use it ? ....:rolleyes: oh, thats right, to speed things up, and make some MUNNNNNI ! :D



Darksiders are at a disadvantage as they are only realy good at one side, whilst real woodworkers are good at both hand and machine/power:D
Why, don't ya sleep ? .... mustn't if you found the time to practise enough using both types so you can be classified as a real woodworker.....clever bloody powertool heads:rolleyes: deary me ;)

[Lignum]

Actualy Tripper, not stiring but being serious;) Try getting a 2100 x 950 Blackwood table top and flattening it as close to perfectly flat as possible using a beltsander with no hollows, scratches, ridges or anything. Very, very difficult. Also not an easy task using a Jack and Smoother either. Both take great skill. And its not about speeding up to make munnnni but with only 24hrs in a day and so much woodwork that you want to do and things you want to try and make, workshop time management is very important. Like me slipping in a few hours on friday to do the (Darkside) join in the sculptered box 11 thread:o Having said all that its rare i belt sand a top. But if the need arises care and skill must come into it:D

[black1]

PS: what is SWMBO? I assume you are talking about your partner but what is the acronym?

just call her the "War Office" mate and all will be well:cool:

[BrisBen]

Hey Lignum and Apricotripper

What if the timber was dressed on a slab master or similar...

But I used a cabinet scraper to smooth it?

And a hand plane to champher the edge

A ROS to sand it between coats

And finish with hand rubbed EEE ultrashine

Does that make me a shadowsider?

I cant work out if the project was half dark or half light...:)

[martrix]

haha, it was a bit surreal actually and i was more embarassed for him than anything else since that saw doesn't mean too much to me now. If that had been one of my Mitsukawa saws it would have been another story

Great work Nick. When he fumbled the saw, did it actually leave any marks on the case?:eek:

To watch go here Sangaku Case Mod (http://digitallifetv.com/blogs/digitallifetv/archive/2005/12/22/3575.aspx) 2nd down on the right

[greensabbath]

Great work Nick. When he fumbled the saw, did it actually leave any marks on the case?:eek:

To watch go here Sangaku Case Mod (http://digitallifetv.com/blogs/digitallifetv/archive/2005/12/22/3575.aspx) 2nd down on the right

Thank you, the saw actually missed the case thank goodness or at least it didn't make any marks on it and surprisingly the saw teeth were fine too. The only thing that really got damaged was his dignity:D

[JDarvall]

Actualy Tripper, not stiring but being serious;) Try getting a 2100 x 950 Blackwood table top and flattening it as close to perfectly flat as possible using a beltsander with no hollows, scratches, ridges or anything. Very, very difficult. Also not an easy task using a Jack and Smoother either. Both take great skill. And its not about speeding up to make munnnni but with only 24hrs in a day and so much woodwork that you want to do and things you want to try and make, workshop time management is very important. Like me slipping in a few hours on friday to do the (Darkside) join in the sculptered box 11 thread:o Having said all that its rare i belt sand a top. But if the need arises care and skill must come into it:D

I know what you mean. And I know what you mean by a beltsander requiring a great deal of skill to use. Big clumbsy thing that wants to constantly run off on you all the time, ,,,the belt skewing off all the time having to adjust it with that side knobby thingy. (I've used one plenty on floor boards)...... Belt changing at the right time,,,,,,..

It cuts a bit like a rocker bottom plane, I reakon. And you don't want to use one of them to get something flat.:p ...so, franky, I think your right, a great deal of skill is needed to get a table top flat with it.

But when using one of them you don't have to read the grain at all do you. Don't have to worry about tearout.

I can see when the job would quite simply get done faster with a belt though. Like when the timber so hard that its much faster to rip into it with coarse belts. No sharpening blades. Even though your going through a ton of belts, you'll get the job done faster, which seems to be quite important to most .. doesn't it ? :confused:

Why there was ever a need to compare the 'skill' needed for each is beyond me. How does one make that comparison anyway ?

I would have thought making munnni is ultimately the main idea behind the importance of time management ? yes ?

I don't know Lignum...... I think I'm starting to bore myself......

So mate, on the off chance....you wanna buy a corner chisel ? Good for stirring paint :D Nobody else seems to want it.
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showthread.php?t=32211

[Bob38S]

It's a little like comparing cars
Think of our forum Darksiders as vintage cars [others from elsewhere as luddites] - slow, steady, most looked good in their day, they do get from A to B but its all about the journey not the actual arrival, the tasks get done - very well from some of the posted pix.

As to the electron burners - like V8 Supercars - fast, efficient, get the job done, enjoy using what was built, enjoy getting on with the next job. Time for a beer or 3

This is not to have a go at anyone - simply "horses for courses" "different strokes for different folks" etc............

[Lignum]

Very good analogy Bob;)