Just Experimenting!

[DPB]

I've been playing around with my new router table to see what I can do with it. This small box (210W x 135D x 75H) is from Rosewood. The centre panel is American Walnut veneer both sides of 3mm mdf.

The box joint ends are intentionally proud of the side walls - another Greene & Greene influence. The ends of the fingers are chamfered to create a "button-like" affect.

The hinge was cut on the router tab and drilled using an Icra Hinge Crafter. To learn more about the technique involved vist the Incra site to view this PDF file.[I] http://tinyurl.com/m57xv

I've oiled the timber with pure tung oil. When this dries completely, I'll finish with Wipe-On Poly.

I don't know whether I like it or not, but I ran the hinge axle from one hinge to the other. Any comments on this as a design feature?

http://img81.imageshack.us/img81/1618/smallboxwithincrahinge1b0es.jpg http://img81.imageshack.us/img81/7678/smallboxwithincrahinge2b2zw.jpg

http://img81.imageshack.us/img81/7902/inrahinge1b7hi.jpg http://img81.imageshack.us/img81/5496/boxjointwithgreenegreeninfluen.jpg

Here's a close up of the 1/2" hinge.

http://img70.imageshack.us/img70/3248/hingesb4ol.jpg

[Tex79]

Hi DPB,

I think the box looks great, and I'm especially impressed with the hinges. I tend to agree with you about the axle, personally I think it might look better if it was cut flush with the end of each hinge, but that's just my opinion!!
The proud finger joints complement the proud hinges and overall give the box good character.
As stated that is just my opinion, but I think it's beautiful box and I'd be more than proud to be able to produce something of that quality and originality.

Cheers, Tex

[Auld Bassoon]

G'day Don,

I'd say that if the axle didn't lend any structural alignment and/or strength, then I'd prefer not to have it between the hinges.

The Walnut looks lovely, and, in my view, even the "boring" Rosewood looks pretty good.

On the joinery, I can't say that I'm a huge fan of this style, but each to their own.

All around, a box up to your usual standards!

[Wardy]

Hi Don,
Even though the grain is plain on the Rosewood I think it looks good. The eye tends to look at the Walnut veneer which compliments the box. The joinery I like because its something different from the "norm".I agree about the solid bar, the box would have a softer appearance if it was cut flush.Another high standard DPB box
Cheers Wardy

[Simomatra]

G'day Don

Another great box. I don't mind the axles like that. Just me

Like the walnut and have no problem with the rosewood. Nice to have boring timbers

Like the proud effect of the fingers also

[NewLou]

Gidday Don:)

I certainly view a lot of your posts with interest and love the 'energy' your putting into the box making forum. I think its a great 'piece' with a number of stand out features.

I love the axle 'effect' you've gone for and think its makes an interesting design feature that tones down the joinery really effectively. I think this approach works really well with more complex 'projects' to balance out fancy joinery and augment plain grained timbers.

However I would avoid using it with more simple elegant pieces that rely more on beautiful finishes n timber grains...................regardless top work.

I've been mucking round with tung oil quite a bit lately myself. How many coats of tung oil did you use and what kind of sheen are you working towards before you slap on the poly???

Do you find the poly brings down the sheen a bit after curing?

REgards Lou;):D:D

[Carry Pine]

Box looks good, Don. The proud fingers are interesting and I'm thinking that an experimental box with some tricky proud joints is not far away (a la the japanese boxmaker pasting).
Agree that the axle is a bit much. Sorry you don't like working with the timber- looks great.
Carry Pine

[zenwood]

I quite like the extended axle, but I don't think it suits this particular box. It would look better on a box that had more of an out-and-out whimsical design, along the lines of Cantwell's design on p. 140 of Lydgate's "Small wood boxes" book (which I believe you have).

I like the G&G proud fingers, but feel that fewer of them (say three per joint: 1-2-1) would look better.

Also: the hinges look a tad big for this box. If they were smaller, they wouldn't pierce the mitre in the lid panel.

[doug the slug]

I don't know whether I like it or not, but I ran the hinge axle from one hinge to the other. Any comments on this as a design feature?

Don, the exposed axle would look nice sometimes, but im wonderinghow a wooden version of the piano hinge would look. one big long wooden hinge along the back of the box might make a lovely feature too. i havent done it myselfso i cant say for sure but you asked for comments so thats mine!

[Scally]

A great looking box.
I must try yhose hinges.

I know what you mean with the rosewood. The two timbers should work well together but somehow it looks a bit flat.
How would a banding of light coloured timber around the panel go? It might give it a bit of a lift and accentuate the colours in the walnut veneer.

I have seen gifkin boxes with the panel frame with an internal edge of different timber.

[Driver]

Great work, Don. Another really interesting box.

I'm not sure that I agree with your use of 'boring' to describe the wood but I understand the point you're making. I think your 'raised button' finger joints are very appealing and particularly suited to the colour temperature and subtle grain of the rosewood.

I agree with zenwood on the size of the hinges and their positioning relative to the mitres.

If your hinge spindle was highly polished and maybe of greater diameter it would look superb. Could you find a sleeve to fit over it between the hinges? (Narrow section brass tube?)

Keep it up. You're making us all think and giving us something to aspire to.

All the best

Col

[TTIT]

As always, very nice box DPB. I like the box joints that way, :D but I think you should lose the axle ;). I'd rather see the hinge extended right along the back.

[labolle]

There are quite a few elements of that box that I really like.

I really like those protruding finger joints proud. The word they bring to my mind is "rustic." I like rustic, but the exposed brass between the hinges and the walnut burl in the framed lid don't fit in with the image of rustic instead the image the lid brings is elegant. Rustic elegance?

Hinges. The thicker offset where the hinge pin is looks pretty tricky, but cool. The mass of the hinge pins seems to make the protruding pins seem slender. It would be nice if they both the hinges and the box joints protruded the same amount AND were made of the same material.

Keep experimenting!

...I'm off to the shed to try out some of those protruding finger joints myself.

Thanks for the inspiration.

[Wood Borer]

It looks good Don - well done.

[RufflyRustic]

Lovely work Don. You always make it look so easy, but when I try for myself I find it is definitely not that easy:)

Is that Australian Rosewood? I haven't seen much of it, but the little I have seen doesn't show much grain or flame variation when compared with the NG Rosewood I can get here in Toowoomba. And well, comparing rosewood to walnut, I think Walnut would always win for interesting grain.

cheers
Wendy

[DPB]

How would a banding of light coloured timber around the panel go? It might give it a bit of a lift and accentuate the colours in the walnut veneer.

I have seen gifkin boxes with the panel frame with an internal edge of different timber.
Scally, this is a good idea, one I originally intended for this box but forgot when it came to making it. It would be a definite improvement.



How many coats of tung oil did you use and what kind of sheen are you working towards before you slap on the poly???

Do you find the poly brings down the sheen a bit after curing?
As a general rule of thumb, I apply three coats of tung oil. I have obtained the best results by flooding the timber with the oil by applying with a well soaked rag. I leave it for an hour then wipe it down with a clean dry cloth to remove any oil that has not soaked in. I remove as much of the oil as I can. Then I leave it for at least 24 hours - longer is better, and repeat this process two more times.

Before applying the Wipe-On Poly, I will let it dry for a few weeks. I've found it best to let it dry at house temperatures (20 degrees). Then I apply two to three coats of Wipe-On Poly. Again, the key is to let this finish thoroughly dry - 24 hours at 20 degrees. I lightly buff the applied surface with '0000' steel wool before subsequent coats. Depending on the finish I am trying to acheive, I will leave the final coat with the sheen or lightly rub down with the steel wool and then apply Ubeaut Natural Polish for a softer less reflective surface. To satisfy my taste, I want to see and feel the timber, not the finish. So even if coated with numerous layers of finish, the result I am looking for is a natural finish - even if an illusion.

Thanks everyone for your comments and suggestions. I think the variety of replies underlines the reality that everyone sees things differently. This is encouraging, because despite the divergence of opinion, I am concluding that the design more-or-less works.

I agree that the timber hinge is too large for this box. It would have looked better with a 3/8" hinge rather than the 1/2" hinge.



Is that Australian Rosewood?
Wendy, I'm not certain, but I believe it is Australian Rosewood.

[Andy Mac]

Hi DPB,
I really like the box, and those raised fingers a la G&G are a great feature. With regards that hinge pin, I think it would be more suitable if there was another hinge or two involved, like one in the middle or something. It would then have more of a reason to extend that far. A sort of disrupted piano hinge:rolleyes: .
BTW I tried to make something similar without the benefit of a jig...just saw, drillpress and a disc sander to finish. The finished items looked the part (WA mallee burl), but they didn't act as hinges!!:eek: The pins were out of alignment...they look too nice to throw, so I keep them around as a reminder of what is possible!:D

Keep up the inspiring work.

[Stuart]

Hi DPB,
I really like the box, and those raised fingers a la G&G are a great feature. With regards that hinge pin, I think it would be more suitable if there was another hinge or two involved, like one in the middle or something. It would then have more of a reason to extend that far. A sort of disrupted piano hinge:rolleyes: .
BTW I tried to make something similar without the benefit of a jig...just saw, drillpress and a disc sander to finish. The finished items looked the part (WA mallee burl), but they didn't act as hinges!!:eek: The pins were out of alignment...they look too nice to throw, so I keep them around as a reminder of what is possible!:D

Keep up the inspiring work.

Guess that says something about the Incra hinge jig, which seems very expensive for just drilling holes in line, but if it is too hard to do it another way....


Now I know what my problem is- trying to learn how to do quality woodworking in pine. Crap timber.

Course, if I can get pine to look good - what will it be like working with rosewood, or any of those other exotic ones that I've never really seem to buy (or more likely been able to afford)!

I really must hunt down a local supplier who isn't charging gold teeth for splinters (like some stuff in Carbatech - saw some yesterday- 10"x6"x3/4" ebony was over $140. That sounds expensive to me anyway.

[ddeen]

DPB, I like the box. Very original design. Like most of the comments in the tread I would go with a flush center hinge pin.

[AlexS]

Don, I like the box, and have no problems with the full length hinge pin. Perhaps the size of the hinges could be reduced from 1/2" to 3/8".
Also like the extended finger joints.

[TTIT]

Wendy, I'm not certain, but I believe it is Australian Rosewood.
Can't stand by and see a great Aussie timber's reputation sullied. Correct me if I'm wrong, but Australian Rosewood, AKA Dorrigo Rosewood is quite hard, one of the reasons it was used by the early settlers for fenceposts. It is aromatic to work, machines and sands beautifully, is a very rich red color and finishes a treat. Going by the color and 'softness' of your timber Don, I'm guessing it's NG rosewood. This is Aussie Rosewood here (http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showthread.php?p=306333#post306333) , although the color doesn't show well in the pics.

[DPB]

Can't stand by and see a great Aussie timber's reputation sullied. Correct me if I'm wrong, but Australian Rosewood, AKA Dorrigo Rosewood is quite hard, one of the reasons it was used by the early settlers for fenceposts. It is aromatic to work, machines and sands beautifully, is a very rich red color and finishes a treat. Going by the color and 'softness' of your timber Don, I'm guessing it's NG rosewood. This is Aussie Rosewood here (http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showthread.php?p=306333#post306333) , although the color doesn't show well in the pics.
I appreciate your input, TTIT. I must confess complete ignorance concerning the timber I used. It was left behind by a friend who wanted to make some boxes for his daughters last Christmas, but never returned to finish the project.

He identified it as Rosewood. It has the aroma of aromatic cedar, is quite soft, and doesn't sand well. It sands into a powdery dust, and the surface never seems to get smooth. It doesn't plane or scrape much better - hard to avoid tear-out. As you would expect with a timber described as soft it is very light in weight.

Am I correct to assume that NG Rosewood is from New Guinea:confused:

[KRH]

I like it Don. Particularly the hinge. I agree with others in that a chunky hinge may look OK in a piano hinge arrangement ie. right across the back. I haven't tried this but you have inspired me to give it a go.

[TTIT]

He identified it as Rosewood. It has the aroma of aromatic cedar, is quite soft, and doesn't sand well. It sands into a powdery dust, and the surface never seems to get smooth. It doesn't plane or scrape much better - hard to avoid tear-out. As you would expect with a timber described as soft it is very light in weight.
Am I correct to assume that NG Rosewood is from New Guinea:confused:
What you've described sounds like New Guinea rosewood for sure Don.:) Some years ago I made some bedside tables, an aquarium stand and a box from it which I was quite happy with but would much rather use the local stuff now if I could get hold of enough. Round the North NSW coast, they sell rotten old 100 year old rosewood fenceposts at about the same rate as gold. The NG stuff wouldn't last a year in the ground I reckon!;)