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Wood Borer
31st July 2006, 12:33 AM
This is a photo story of how I cut mitred through dovetails using an unlidded box as the example.

Photo 1 shows some wonderful timber I was given by Cliff Rogers – Silver Quandong and Australian Red Cedar. These are contrasting in colour and are suitable for this little project.


Photo 2 shows marking the Silver Quandong to a thickness that looks about right. I have no idea how many millimetres thick, I just used the marking gauge to mark something that looked OK.

Photo 3 shows the four sides after cutting on the bandsaw.

Photo 4. I measured the length of the sides and divided by 1.62 to determine the length of the ends so the box is in the ratio of the golden rectangle. This is only for aesthetic purposes.

I then arrange the sides and the ends to make sure they will look OK when finally assembled. As Silver Quandong doesn’t have a featured grain this step is not entirely necessary but I always mark the ends and sides A, B, C & D with an arrow pointing to the up position. This is so the dovetails will match when I cut and mark them off each other.

Photo 5 shows the tails marked out with the 45 degrees mitre marked. The X’s indicate the waste.

Wood Borer
31st July 2006, 12:37 AM
Photo 6 shows cutting the mitre using the dovetail saw. (Difficult to take the photo and hold the saw!)

Photo 7 shows the tails and mitre after sawing. The waste will be removed with chisels – sharp ones.

Photo 8 shows the pins that were marked out from the tails after they were chiselled.

Photo 9 shows the pins and mitre after sawing.

Wood Borer
31st July 2006, 12:41 AM
Photos 10 & 11 shows the dry assembled joint. Often you need to fine tune with sharp chisels at this stage.

Photo 12 shows the Red Cedar after is has been cut on the bandsaw and is now being dimensioned using a No4 Bench plane for the base.

Photo 13. After making the base an even thickness (again I have no idea of how many mm – just a good thickness) I mark the inside of the box with the marking gauge about 1.5 mm or 2 mm greater than the thickness of the base from the bottom of the box. This is so the base will be sit slightly higher than the sides and ends.

Important – after dry assembling the sides and the ends, plane the sides and ends so they are all the same height. When we cut the grooves for the base using an electron burning noisy router, the position of the groove is indexed from the base of each side and end. If these are out, then the groove will be a different height for the sides and ends which will make assembly of base impossible, very difficult and unsightly.

Photo 14 shows dry assembled sides and end with grooves for the base ready to cut the base to size allowing a few mm for the base to expand and contract. The base will not be glued in place but will “float” in the grooves.

Gumby
31st July 2006, 12:45 AM
Hey WB, you know what i'm going to ask don't you. I have the camera if you have the time. ;)


Edit:
oops sorry WB, i didn't mean to get in the middle of this sequence. :o

Wood Borer
31st July 2006, 12:46 AM
Photo 15. Because the base is thicker than the grooves in the sides and ends, the edges of the base will be planed in a raised panel fashion. The marking gauge is set to measurement that looks OK and the base will be planed in a bevel sloping from these marks to the edge until the grooves in the sides and ends can firmly house the bevelled edges.

Photo 16 shows a straight piece of ply clamped on the base so the edge of the ply is aligned with marks shown in Photo 15. This acts as a guide for the plane. The used is a rebate plane.

It is important to plane both sides across the grain and then plane the two sides running with the grain similarly to using a power router. When you plane across the grain, some wood fibres will break away from the unsupported edge but the broken fibres and the timber near them will be removed when the long grain is planed.
Photo 17 shows the raised panel base in the dry assembled box.

Photo 18 shows the inside of the dry assembled box.

To complete the box, I normally shellac and wax the base prior to gluing because it is easier and the wax resists the glue bonding the base and the sides and ends of the box allowing the base to expand and contract freely so it doesn’t split.

I also shellac and sand and the inside of the box prior gluing because it is difficult to sand and finish the inside of the box when it is glued.

The box will be clamped whilst the glue is setting checking everything is square and excess glue wiped up. The dovetails intentionally made slightly oversized will be planed off using a block plane, the outside of the box sanded or scraped after using shellac to raise the grain.

The top edges can be planed with a slight bevel if desired and then the box can be finished using your favourite finish. I normally use Ubeaut EEE wax followed by Ubeaut Traditional wax. They are easy to apply and give a good finish.

Including taking the photos, the project took approx 3 hours of my Sunday afternoon - an enjoyable time.

Groggy
31st July 2006, 12:52 AM
This belongs in best of the best, top job!

PS: I'd be getting Gumby to clarify 'exactly' what he means about having the time and the camera. If he calls you Pokey at any stage, well...:eek:

Wood Borer
31st July 2006, 01:01 AM
I spent quite a bit of Saturday dealing with your profession Gumby and hopefully a few more this week.

Thanks Groggy, I'll keep my wits about him.

JDarvall
31st July 2006, 01:11 AM
very nice.

my process is similar,,,,a little different. I would have mitred the bottom as well, and done through grooves with a small plough plane or whatever... but much of a muchyness

cedars lovely looking stuff eh.

Interesting you mention the raised panel, cause, I'm working on a stanley 55 idea at the moment that will cut them out as well cross grain....for drawer bottoms and doors...that sort of thing.

Thanks for the pictures. Good to see how others do it. Pinch a few ideas too ;)

JDarvall
31st July 2006, 01:15 AM
hang on.... just had another look. you did mitre the bottom. Sorry my mistake.

bedtime I think. Night.

Lignum
31st July 2006, 01:25 AM
Excelent run down WB:D And as Groggy said straight to the pool room that one. Well done

Wood Borer
31st July 2006, 09:27 AM
very nice.

my process is similar,,,,a little different.

cedars lovely looking stuff eh.

Interesting you mention the raised panel, cause, I'm working on a stanley 55 idea at the moment that will cut them out as well cross grain....for drawer bottoms and doors...that sort of thing.

Thanks for the comments Jake, I guess everyone uses a method that suits them and their tools all methods that achieve similar results are great as you indicated.

Cedar is great timber, a pity it is a bit scarce.

I'll be interested in reading about your new idea with the 55. The LN 10 1/4 I use has cross grain nickers which I rarely use but I would if I was planing a step in the raised panel.

Auld Bassoon
31st July 2006, 09:59 AM
Very informative essay Rob. Thanks for that :)

Zed
31st July 2006, 10:51 AM
you're a good man Rob. my comments would be :


good photo sequence - valuable to a learner... (like me)
lovely product placement of the CC guage & LN hand plane in the pics
but more seriously (well only a little bit...) can I suggest that your phot images could be a bit crisper ??? theres a bit of fuzz in them.. i assume from shrinking the photos. I'll email you a prog called Jpegcompress that grunt provided - great stuff!your friggin' dark sider you!

;)

jmk89
31st July 2006, 11:07 AM
A really useful set of pictures and explanations, at least for someone like me for whom these things are quite new.
And if the flexible rubber man wants to make a video nasty of you doing it, then that would be even better. Greenie sent

Gumby
31st July 2006, 11:13 AM
but more seriously (well only a little bit...) can I suggest that your phot images could be a bit crisper ??? theres a bit of fuzz in them.. i assume from shrinking the photos.
;)

Monkey man, I think you'd better get your eyes checked. They look fine to me. ;)

DPB
31st July 2006, 11:19 AM
Nice WIP, Mate. The first time I did this, I determined that all future through-DT'ed boxes that I made would have mitred corners. IMHO it's a much more finished look. I'm sure your photo-story will inspire others.:)

Stuart
31st July 2006, 11:21 AM
Monkey man, I think you'd better get your eyes checked. They look fine to me. ;)

Looks like someone else needs their eyes checked then!! Guess I'd better come along to the video session with my camera, to make sure all the good bits are in focus.

(seriously - a couple of videos would document the process well, and the resulting combined video would be great).

DPB
31st July 2006, 11:22 AM
you're a good man Rob. my comments would be :
but more seriously (well only a little bit...) can I suggest that your phot images could be a bit crisper ??? theres a bit of fuzz in them.. i assume from shrinking the photos.;)
I am under the opinion that shrinking a photo tends to make it appear sharper, not fuzzier.:confused:

Gumby
31st July 2006, 11:22 AM
Nice WIP, Mate. The first time I did this, I determined that all future through-DT'ed boxes that I made would have mitred corners. IMHO it's a much more finished look. I'm sure your photo-story will inspire others.:)

Not sure if inspire is exactly the right word Don. In my case, before I saw this, I didn't think I'd be able to do it. Now, after looking at these pics, I know I definitely wouldn't be able to do it. :o

(only jokin' Rob, it's great as always)

Driver
31st July 2006, 11:46 AM
Great piece of instructional work, Rob. This is definitely a candidate for Best of the Best. Well done!

Col

zenwood
31st July 2006, 12:02 PM
Nicely done, WB.

When making the raised panel base, I find that it's easier to plane the bevels with the grain first, then do the cross-grain bevels. This way, you don't get the splitting off at the end of the plane-strokes because the bevel there supports the grain. Hope this makes sense.

For those who own a tablesaw, that would be another option for producing the groove in the sides to receive the bottom (a zero clearance insert helps, but is not essential). Using a scratch stock is a darkside way to do the same thing.

Regarding the photos, I agree with Zed. The photos have been shrunk to about 20kB, and I think some compression effects are starting to become visible, which leads to Zed's 'fuzz'. Compressing to about 80-90 kB should eliminate the visible compression effects.

Excellent thread, WB. I particularly like that fact that few measurements are needed: just what looks good.

AlexS
31st July 2006, 02:12 PM
Excellent thread WB. Good way for beginners (or anyone else) to produce a nice result. This is one of the projects I suggest to my beginners woodwork class.

debugger
31st July 2006, 02:16 PM
Great work Woodborder,
Looking forward to seeing the final pics after finishing if you could....
Well done and Thanks for sharing.

jow104
31st July 2006, 06:05 PM
Craftsmanship superb,
Photography as good.

Must try doing it that way next time, perhaps in October?:)

JDarvall
31st July 2006, 08:23 PM
Thanks for the comments Jake, I guess everyone uses a method that suits them and their tools all methods that achieve similar results are great as you indicated.

I think your right. seems to many ways of doing anything in woodwork.



Cedar is great timber, a pity it is a bit scarce.

It is tops isn't it. I rarely get a chance to use it.......:D HOWEVER, a bit of a coincidence.....I scored some old cedar today. Took a photo of it this arvo after work. For a few weeks I'm prettying up an old joint in town for sale....which involves re-roofing,,,cleaning up windows...etc.

I had to remove an old ventilation fan, that was attached to the inside of a window....under it was this board that was ruffly placed to hold the fan....didn't think much of it, so I stuck my pry bar under it, and crack off comes this piece of cedar.....

The whole lot was cedar, which I quickly smuggled to my ute :D ...I'm thrilled. Not often that I get this amount of cedar to work with. And when I do, its usually riddled with nail holes.

Amazes me how plentiful the stuff must have been, for it to be used as a ruff backing board...in a similar way as we'd use ply now I guess.



I'll be interested in reading about your new idea with the 55. The LN 10 1/4 I use has cross grain nickers which I rarely use but I would if I was planing a step in the raised panel.
I've finished the first profile for the 55, and it works fine, just have to get around to taking some photos. Glad your interested. Was beginning to believe that only the yanks and poms use 55's. Apparently aussies use them mostly as door stops. :D

I didn't know that LN10 1/4 had a nicker. What kind is it ? 3 point spur, or a circle cutter ?

I'm a bit confused by what you mean by a step in the raised panel. I thought by what I see in picture 17 that you planed a step....uno, that little vertical drop a couple of mill before the profile slopes off.....Call them a fillet in profile work.....oh, do you mean a deeper drop ....where multiple nicker cuts are needed rather than just that single marking guage scribe ?

Though I'd imagine you cut that marking guage scribe quite deep since cedars so soft.

:)

Wardy
1st August 2006, 05:21 PM
hi woodborer, excellent, easy to follow instructions and photos.top thread
:)

chrisb691
1st August 2006, 11:09 PM
Hi Wood borer,

Thanks for the howto, got a lot out of it. Bit confused with the 'raised panel' on the base. Does the bevel go right through to the edge, or is there a parallel section to fit into the grooves?

HoutBok
2nd August 2006, 08:03 AM
Thanks Wood Borer!

Another of your excellent picture tutorials for my collection. Looking forward to the video version.
You make it look easy enough for newbies like me to try - which is what we need to do - try.
Probably waste a lot of wood proving that it's not that easy but will learn lots more doing that than sitting on the web.

Greeny on it's way.

Wood Borer
2nd August 2006, 09:18 AM
Does the bevel go right through to the edge, or is there a parallel section to fit into the grooves?

The bevels go right through to the edge.