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dopeydriver
4th December 2006, 06:59 PM
Reading through my old copies of "Wooden Boat" , I'm impressed with the quality of some of their articles.In one copy alone , there are comprehensive articles on "Sail and Hull performance" (traditionalists may be the pioneers of efficiency) "Philip C.Bolger Boat Designer"(Defiling the temple or defining the boat?) and "The restoration of the Trader Ketch Defender" , a Tasmanian boat.
Plenty of quality reading !.
Rob J.

bitingmidge
4th December 2006, 09:44 PM
Read, enjoy, collect, but don't believe!

Traditional construction methods have a place, and that is in the restoration of traditional vessels.

It never ceases to amaze me that people fall in love with the romantic notion that these methods were somehow noble and to be emulated forever.

The methods were all that were available at the time, the boats derived from them similarly. If any of them had truly stood the test of time they would still be being raced or used as work boats rather than being described in "surprising" terms, ("surprisingly fast, seaworthy etc).

Why don't aviation buffs build Wright replicas for touring, or petrol heads tour in Model T replicas? Both could be described in similar noble terms, yet we know better than to try, but when it comes to boats.....

Read and learn though!

Cheers,

P (Who subscribes to woodenboat)

Oyster
4th December 2006, 11:18 PM
Actually I do not have a problem with some of the new hybrid construction methods of traditional building, not not plywoods but solid woods. Its being done very successfully all of the time. I personally have two trailable hulls in mid 20 feet build of solid woods of cedar and even one with a cypress bottom. If many of you are not aware of the properties of cypress, the wood has some issues with changes of deminsion with increased satuation by its natural nature.

This topic can create some interesting replies depending on purests that do not have an open mind of evolution of hulls, no difference than the people that used and made their own iron nails for fastening planks in lieu of trunnels. For some of you young bucks, there also were folks that use to use square pegs in round holes.

There are still boats being built with trunnel nails to this day eliminating many problems with metal fasteners.

bitingmidge
5th December 2006, 08:08 AM
There are still boats being built with trunnel nails to this day eliminating many problems with metal fasteners.
But of course using modern methods, there is only limited need for permanent fasteners of any kind, which is sort of my point!

Timbers such as you describe are not readily available in Oz, but even so I wonder at the over-design of "modern?" solid wood craft.

A good example of this is the WoodenBoat simple skiff currently designed to get people into boatbuilding. They argue that building a small (crude) rowing boat out of 1" materials gives a beginner experience in a number of basic techniques.

I would say it gives a beginner a poorly handling, heavy vessel, and the techniques should not be applicable to a craft of that size anyway!

"Great technique, shame the boat doesn't work"

But there you have it!

Cheers,

P:D

Oyster
5th December 2006, 09:54 AM
Boats that are now being built with trunnels are in the area of the world that created harsh enviroments for the quality of metals or let me say the lack of quality fasteners because of the limited demands for the specialized hardware creating limited outlets to purchase the fasteners. Its sometimes called capitalism or the lack of that has added to the demise of good materials.


If you add that to the issue of raw materials that is made avaliable to the modern world you have limited sources for which to draw from for foundaries and fabricators. Add that to the decreased demands and you have folks that are seeking alternative methods, and reverting back to some of the old ways. I know that I personally have found that even with the very best plywoods, you have a finished product that has to be perfectly maintained or else you can also have spoon quality wooden soup.

Heck way back when, long before hardwood plywoods, we use to resaw hardwoods and use solid veneers. 1/4" to 5/16" for multiple layers of diagonally planked hulls to include the old PT boats built for the wars of days gone by.

Boatmik
5th December 2006, 05:45 PM
Heck way back when, long before hardwood plywoods, we use to resaw hardwoods and use solid veneers. 1/4" to 5/16" for multiple layers of diagonally planked hulls to include the old PT boats built for the wars of days gone by.

They're not veneers - they're planks.

MIK

Oyster
5th December 2006, 08:50 PM
They're not veneers - they're planks.

MIK
Actually the finished wood product, consisting of a thickness of around 1/4 " to 5/16" derive from PLANKS. I seriously doubt that much more than roaches and mouses can walk a 1/4" plank across an open span of any real width without it breaking and leaving you a bit wet in the ole buttocks.:cool:

In my area of the world, there are good veneers and bad veneers that are required to end up being glued together, forming larger components configured into structual components such as sheet plywood and hull structures. We normally make every attempt to form together known quality veneers, eliminating some structual issues with flawed veneers that are hidden from sight in sheet form in todays world and in the past, you know those thin pieces that will not stand alone for much more than a ratsass to cross an open span.