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TTIT
15th January 2007, 01:27 AM
I had been saving a big chunk of Walnut crotch that Mong generously donated to me until I upgraded the lathe. Seemed like a good time to tackle it and thought it was supposed to be great stuff :no::yuk: Horrible tearout, takes the edge off the tools in seconds and not even a very nice color - but most annoying is the way it reacted to CA. Some of the piece was a bit punky and the heart had a small hollow I filled with brass powder and everywhere the CA touched, the timber went very dark. Assuming it would all darken and blend in with oiling like other timbers, I continued on, but as you can see in the pic, the CA sticks out like dog-balls :~:yucky::tears:. Unless someone knows a way to even the patches out, I'll probably texture the rim to hide it but the outside of the piece will always look like crap where the CA has run down the sides :C.
Does any one have any ideas what I can do to fix it?????

Gil Jones
15th January 2007, 04:05 AM
TTIT, I have found that CA soaks into most any wood and causes the stains you see in your Walnut (some woods are not so bad, some are worse). Sanding is no help, as the stain is too deep for all but cutting deeper or as you said, texturing. On relatively small pieces if I am not cutting any deeper) I would quickly coat the whole surface with thin CA to get a uniformly stained look.:) To prevent the CA stain, I usually apply some lacquer or wax to the surface around where the CA is going to be used. The lacquer/wax stops the CA from soaking into the wood and causing the stain. Good luck with your piece.

Hickory
15th January 2007, 04:42 AM
Bite your tongue :o Walnut, or at least American Black Walnut, Is a prized lumber (Timber) in these states as well as the rest of the American loving world. It turns so beautifully, sands so smooth, and the color endures (although it fades over time leaving an excellant Patena)

If you are having trouble with Walnut, then it can't be American Black Walnut. Must be one of the others (English, perhaps, which acts & looks more like Butternut than Walnut) or you have some from a riverbank where the grain grows in stress from too much water, or it was dried inprperly or you got ahold of a stressful piece.

I love Walnut, Please don't fatmouth all Walnut because you have had a bad experience with one piece. Or better yet, go ahead and discourage as many as possible, leaving more for me to enjoy.

hughie
15th January 2007, 08:35 AM
Vern,

All the Walnut I have come across down here to date is nothing to write home about. I have often wondered the difference and came to the conclusion we have a different species, seeing Hickorys reply I think we got the poor cousin :C .
Back to CA and stains etc, having been caught out a few times :~ with these darn stains etc. I now sand to finish and coat the timber with a setting oil [ Flood penetrol I use ] -- you'll want to use a fast setting type if your impatient like me, or use a wipe on poly. This seals the timber and the CA does not cause a problem. I prefer the wipe on poly as it can easily removed if needs be.

In your current dilemma, dunno :no: sand or cut the mark out if you able.... or fire wood.

sori cant be more helpful, I have been there a few times on some real nice timber and I know what its like.

soundman
15th January 2007, 11:52 AM
Bite your tongue :o Walnut, or at least American Black Walnut, Is a prized lumber (Timber) in these states as well as the rest of the American loving world.

Well theres your problem right there:q :q :oo: :oo: :D :D

Seriously we are very spoilt down here.
We have sooooo many local timbers that are just wonderfull and heaps more that are feely imported from all over the place, don't be offend if we dont get excited about wallnut, cherry and oak.

cheers

Hickory
15th January 2007, 02:58 PM
Well theres your problem right there:q :q :oo: :oo: :D :D

Seriously we are very spoilt down here.
We have sooooo many local timbers that are just wonderfull and heaps more that are feely imported from all over the place, don't be offend if we dont get excited about wallnut, cherry and oak.

cheers

This is true.... I often Drool when I see the postings of you lucky blokes with that beautiful wood you use as fence posts, even.... Walnut is as good as it gets here, with Cherry a close second.... We have some interesting figurings but nothing outstanding.

Back at the delima of tearout, I too suffered from that just today (on a Cherry bowl) I am already at 3/8" thick now and a deep gaping gnarly rough area has shown up. (two actually, one on the other side to match the grain, etc.) So I soaked it in Sanding sealer and tomorrow I will sharpen my tools and try to trim out the trash as best I can, then resort to industrial duty sanding to lessen the growth of the splintering.

My hope is that the sanding sealer was able to soak into the wood and solidify the area holding the fibers more stable and able to stand some additional slicing. Looks like I will have a 1/4" thick Fruit bowl when I'm done, was planning on a Salad bowl but this sealed its fate , I'll rescue what I can but will be forced to restart this bowl.

BTW I seldom use CA for the reason you discribed. I opt for more friendly methods. (like sanding sealer) CA I reserve for last chance conditions such as Cracks.

Lignum
15th January 2007, 03:59 PM
Bite your tongue :o Walnut, or at least American Black Walnut, Is a prized lumber (Timber) in these states as well as the rest of the American loving world. It turns so beautifully, sands so smooth, and the color endures (although it fades over time leaving an excellant Patena)



Couldnt agree more. Although iv never turned it, as a furniture timber its second to none. Yes we have stunning timbers here in Oz but none of them are as nice to use as your Black Walnut. Unfortunatly (unless you want to pay big $$$ ) the only stuff we get here now is the younger steamed variety, and i find it to uniform and pale. The deared un-steamed older growth if you can get it is just pure joy:2tsup:

For those wondering, they steam it to make the early and late wood a more uniform color as the timbers milled are a lot younger and have a great variation.

rsser
17th January 2007, 05:23 PM
In another thread touching on Walnut someone observed that only our larger trees develop that, well, deep walnut colour.

As for CA I must be turning the wrong timbers. Never had a staining problem although with light timbers the CA/dust infill sticks out as being somewhat darker.

joe greiner
18th January 2007, 01:04 AM
I've had good and bad results with CA as a final finish. Usually splotchy like yours. But on a recent small piece, I applied it while on the lathe at somewhat slow speed, and buffed with a paper towel. Need to withdraw the paper just in time, or you get a paper overlay.

Joe

TassieKiwi
18th January 2007, 10:09 AM
The deared un-steamed older growth if you can get it is just pure joy:2tsup:


So that's why Sam Maloof filled a big shed up with the stuff....

Lignum
18th January 2007, 10:27 AM
So that's why Sam Maloof filled a big shed up with the stuff....


No doubt about that. Having seen the way he free hands on the bandsaw Walnut would be perfect. Its so good and cuts, routs and carves like butter and polishes up increadably good. Dose have a mild blunting effect but what timber dosnt.

The new stuff is to pale and creamy brown/purple and when freshly cut has awsome reds, yellows and purples in it, but after a bit of oxidation it quickly mellows out and is a bit bland. If you can get some old stuff its worth it just to experience one of the realy great timbers of the world

powderpost
18th January 2007, 11:13 AM
I find black walnut a very nice timber. However, our balck walnut has different characteristics from the American and European variety. The Australian walnut, both black and yellow, has a very high silica content that certainly bluntens tools quickly. Speed here is the major problem. Try working walnut on the bench with hand tools and you will have a very different experience. Both black and yellow walnut are very hard on machine cutters. Try working at a slower speed.
Jim

OGYT
18th January 2007, 11:53 AM
.....everywhere the CA touched, the timber went very dark.... Unless someone knows a way to even the patches out, I'll probably texture the rim to hide it but the outside of the piece will always look like crap where the CA has run down the sides :C.
Does any one have any ideas what I can do to fix it?????
Vern, about the only way you can take care of that problem is to turn the CA away. I've done it before, too. :(( Had to take another couple of passes with sheering cuts to take that CA stain out of it. :C
One way I've found to keep that from happening is to give the piece a coating of Lacquer Wash (25%Lacquer/75%Thinner), then I let it set for about 10 minutes, then I use the CA. :2tsup: The Lacquer Wash keeps the CA from soaking into the wood around the repair. The Lacquer Wash sands off enough to apply an oil finish if you like. :D (meaning that it doesn't clog the pores to such an extent that the oil won't penetrate.)
BTW, I love Black Walnut, but sometimes it can be a PITB.

TTIT
1st February 2007, 04:23 PM
Didn't bother fixing the CA stains on the outside but managed to cover up the patch on the rim. Went for a practice run with the pyrography gear but didn't want to hide the entire rim - wotchareckin?

No offence to the yanks but I'll be sticking to Aussie timber - can't see the CA on anything from round these parts :shrug: (and a lot less tear-out!! :~ )

RufflyRustic
1st February 2007, 04:31 PM
Nicely saved Vern!

Cheers
Wendy

Rookie
1st February 2007, 04:38 PM
Yep. Great save Vern. Looks magnificent.

Just wish SWMBO would stop organizing things so I could get out to the shed myself. It's been ages.

Gil Jones
1st February 2007, 04:40 PM
Vern, I reckon you did exceptionally well!!
I like the undercut rim, and the pyrography looks very good.

Wayne Blanch
1st February 2007, 04:59 PM
Once again a lovely bit of work. You certainly did a good job with the save. I like the design of the pyrography it fits well with the piece.:2tsup:

BernieP
1st February 2007, 06:28 PM
G'Day TTIT

Man thats one hell of a bowl and a neat way to get around the CA.

Cheers
Bernie

powderpost
1st February 2007, 09:15 PM
Excellent piece. Marvellous how a bit of imagine can lift a piece. Well done.
Jim

Caveman
2nd February 2007, 12:45 AM
Niiiiice one!!!


I like the undercut rim.

Me too. What tool do you use to undercut?

TTIT
2nd February 2007, 08:43 AM
What tool do you use to undercut?On an undercut bead like that one I shape the bulk of it with an Oland tool or the Sorby hollower and then cut the sharp corner in with the point of the Sorby shear-scraper teardrop. Taking the corner out in shear-scrape mode leaves a good finish which is handy cos' it's a bugger of a spot to try and sand!

ubeaut
2nd February 2007, 09:02 AM
Looks like a bit of Qld Walnut to me. Have used it and it is one of the worst timbers I have ever come across. Ripped the edge of razor sharp HSS tools in about 2 seconds. Absolute garbage. The stuff I had didn't even burn well.

Completely different to US Black Walnut. European and English, don't judge the others by the stuff you have just turned. as there is no comparrison at all.

However having said that, I still find most walnut to be a bit ordinary and over rated along side most of our timbers. Hellishingly expensive here too, if you can get any good stuff.

Cheers - Neil :U

TTIT
2nd February 2007, 09:45 AM
Looks like a bit of Qld Walnut to me. Have used it and it is one of the worst timbers I have ever come across. Ripped the edge of razor sharp HSS tools in about 2 seconds. Absolute garbage. The stuff I had didn't even burn well.

Sounds pretty close to the mark !:U

Shedgirl
2nd February 2007, 11:16 AM
Vern, I reckon you more than saved that bowl, you made it way better! Good one!

Bleedin Thumb
2nd February 2007, 04:07 PM
Yeh great save. Looks like you meant to do that all along!

Caveman
2nd February 2007, 04:56 PM
On an undercut bead like that one I shape the bulk of it with an Oland tool or the Sorby hollower and then cut the sharp corner in with the point of the Sorby shear-scraper teardrop. Taking the corner out in shear-scrape mode leaves a good finish which is handy cos' it's a bugger of a spot to try and sand!

:2tsup: Thanks.