Stretching Cartriges

[bdar]

When making cartridge pens, those who do know that any 30 cal cartridge is what is required for fitting up of the slimline nib without to much difference in the transition of nib to the cartridge. .303, .308, 30.06, 30.30 and winchester 300 mag are common for cartridge pens. I have made pens .243, .270 and 25.06 cartridges.

I have been able to what I call cold stretch the cartridges out to 30 cal size. You can heat the brass and if you had a hydraulic press it would work fine. This is my method of how I stretch a cartridge without one. Five items are needed, a 1' lump hammer, a auto hammer (plastic one end and rubber end) a piece of 8mm steel rod 300mm long, scrap piece of 3x3x4 and a jar of vaseline.

First with the block of wood, drill a hole in it so the cartridge will fit into it, about 40mm approx 1.5" I put a washer in the bottom of the block to stop any compression in the timber fibres. Take the 8 mm rod and grind a taper on one end to fit inside of the .243. there is not much difference in diameter between the 3 cartridges that I have stretched. I place the cartidge in the block I have drilled then coat the tapered end of the rod and put it into the top of the cartridge, take the lump hammer and gently tap at first to set the rod and start the stretch. Just as it flares out to a round hole I check for straightness, you can adjust this by hand .

A couple of more taps and by this time you should be about 20mm into the cartridge, I then get the auto hammer and use it to knock it of the rod by using a drawing blow to the primmer end of the cartridge. Iwas give a few of the smaller cal cartridges and did not want them to go to waste so this is what I did and just wanted to share this with you.
Darren

[Skew ChiDAMN!!]

What sort of difference is there between, say, the bullets Toni's supplying and the nib dia? (/Me not a firearms man... /me a bow'n'arrow primitive. Mr Plod gets his knickers in a twist when I even look at a firearm nowadays. Something to do with a fictitious armed siege, I believe... :rolleyes: )

Just a fraction of a mm? Could a timber adapter be made to fit the two seamlessly? Are you talking about the internal dia to fit the brass tube, or are you talking about matching the external (bush) dia? :?

Or should I just wait for the mail and work it out for myself? :p

[bdar]

Skew can't remember what cal bullets Toni was using and I think that there was some cutting of the casing towards the slug end of the bullet. Toni chime in on a how to with your method please for clarification. The internal diameters for a .243 is approx. 6mm, a .270 is approx. 6.5mm and the 25.06 is approx. 6mm onced stretched the internal diameter is 8mm and the external diameter is 8.1?? very close to the outside diameter of the slimline nib give or take a thou. When you mentioned a timber adaptor did you mean a timber sleeve on the tube so it fits neatlyinside the cartridge, if so, yes. As to what diameter to drill out the cartridge at the primer end varies from 7mm to 9mm. If you drill 7mm then you will have only a have a small timber sleeve to fit at the nib end and at the primer end glued brass to brass. This at times can cause the mechanism to jam and not work, I drill an 8mm hole which means I can use a full timber sleeve and the timber at the primmer end allows the brass tube to expand and not jam the mechanism. There are as many methods of setting a casing ready to be made to a pen as there finishes to a pen. So Skew a couple of .303, .308, 30.06, 300mags, .243, 25.06 and .270 to be sent you way then:q
Let me know if you want to try any. From smallest to the biggest .243, .308, .303, .270 25.06, 30.06 and 300mag
Darren

[bsrlee]

You could save a bit of effort by buying the brass already to size - if you want 8mm that's .317 or .323 of an inch, depending on whether its 8mm or 8mmS - do a search on 'Norma' or 'RWS' cartridges. I think there is an 8mm based on the 30.06 round - in Euro-speak that would be 8x63, and Remington have something in the same line, probably called 8mm Rem.

Magnum cases these days are based on the Holland & Holland belted case, so you have a raised area (the 'belt') at the base, while the ',06 family are a continuous taper.

[Cruzi]

The .243 and .270 are basically "necked down" .30- cartridges
243 is a 308 case and 270 is a 303 case, there is/was a necking attachment for reloaders that you could use to go either way (up or down)

[Skew ChiDAMN!!]

Skew can't remember what cal bullets Toni was using and I think that there was some cutting of the casing towards the slug end of the bullet.

.308, I think. At a glance it looks to be the same outside dia as the nib, so that's one problem less.

I'm toying with the idea of trying a casting resin pour between the casing & tube.... I'm not sure yet whether I'll be leaving the case intact, I may halve it and use the primer end as the finial, so I think binding won't be a problem. [fingers Xed]

'Tis going to be an interesting exercise. :)

[lubbing5cherubs]

Gidday Sorry been busy. Darren. The one that I used in the tutorial with lots of help from my hubby. We used a 22-250 there. I have also used 243. ( I take what the shooters finished with and learn from there) I have never used the .308 that what I got this time to use and sent out so we are all learning together. So I appreciate your input here Darren
bye Toni

[dai sensei]

I was just going to fill the whole cartridge with resin then redrill all the way through for the sleeve, sort of like the way Skew was suggesting. Haven't tried it yet, but don't want to stuff it up, so am I on the right track?

[bdar]

Brslee,

I do buy my 30 cal bullets and does save heaps of time and effort, but as I said in the orriginal post, a mate who is a roo shooter gave me the 243, 270 and 25.06's and did not want them to go to waste. The 270's that I have are "Normas" and the 243's are WMS?
You are right the 300 mags have the raised belt and make a big pen.

Neil,

The idea of pouring resin has merit, but to drill it you would need a beall collet chuck or something as acurate for the lathe to keep the hole central. You would have to pour a big quantity of bullets to make the resin a cost effective process. Thats why I use the the timber sleeve method due to it being cheaper to produce.

Cruzi,

The 270's I have are more like the 30.06's I have. You know the shape at the primmer end of the 30.06, the 270's are similar to that. The 303 has a wide rim and tapers from there. Are there different styles of 303, I ask this because I don't own a gun, I just ask for the different cals and then buy them.

Toni,

As Brslee said any 30 cals are the best and they are the right size for the nib. Try and convince them to change to 308's. Have a look at Cozee's tutorial at TPS, I think it is done with a 308. Cozee drills the primmer end with a 7mm, I drill with 8 or 9 mm and run the timber sleeve through the full length of the bullet.

Darren

[Cruzi]

Like most of the smaller calibres, the 270 started life as a "widcat" calibre, vermin shooters started out necking down 303 cases to get higher velcities and hence a flatter trajectory("flat" to 270m), some time later the factories started making them and the case was changed slightly when they did the commercial release, in the case of the 243, they did not change the case at all.

Not sure but I think from memory the 7mm and 7mm magnums took a bullet very close to .30 calibre

Used to do a lot of shooting before the hoohaa, don't even have a single cartridge anymore, let alone the re-loading gear.

[madmix]

Hi Neil,

Yes your on the right track, and the 308 shell is probabbly the best
for this purpose.
Just a tip, Remove the used primer from the shell, then use a short
pottato plug in the neck and pour resin in through the primer hole.
Makes drilling a lot easier and more precise.

cheers Mick

[dai sensei]

Hi Neil,

Yes your on the right track, and the 308 shell is probabbly the best
for this purpose.
Just a tip, Remove the used primer from the shell, then use a short
pottato plug in the neck and pour resin in through the primer hole.
Makes drilling a lot easier and more precise.

cheers Mick

Gee talk about timing, I was just about to go down to the shed to do it the other way round - pour the resin in the open end, then drill it out from the small end, ending up through the dead primer.

Can you expand on why it should be the other way round?

[madmix]

Hi Neil,

Drilling the shell is far easier if the primer is removed first, this allows the
drill to be automatically centred when drilling from the primer end.
If you drill from the neck and attempt to drill through the primer, you will
find it difficult to hold the shell
Likewise if you try to drill through the primer from the base and difficult
to centre.
Once primer is removed, you can plug either end and drill to your
hearts content from either end, it is just easier to plug the neck by
pushing through a slice of potato than to plug the primer hole for
pouring the resin.
Hope that makes sense

cheers Mick

[Penpal]

If you are going to drill brass cartridges on a regular basis what I do is hold them in a near close fitting collet in my Hercus Metal lathe,when I drill the bullet I use two special drills made to drill brass and copper,two drills to accomodate the step in the biro refill.
Cartridge cases are tapered slightly and need carefull alignment in the collet.
When cutting the brasses I made a device to use a dremel in the metal lathe ,could be adapted for the wood lathe using the black cut off disk,one disk cut 200 cartridges still in use,
Because bullets I use are copper sheathed lead the special drills do not jam up and handle both the copper and ead without problem.
Have had great success cutting cartridges using my small three wheeler bandsaw,flat file then cheap taper reamer.
I have not come to grips yet whether to coat the brass or let it age gracefully.
Tried used cartridges for a while but found they were shape distorted,new ones cost around 1 dollar without primer and suitable bullets around 1 dollar eacg adding 2 dollars to the cost of a pen that sells for 40 dollars.
:2tsup: Peter

[bdar]

Peter thanks for the good information. I don't use the the lead slug as the tip of the pen, just me and the thought of having lead near the fingers. I use the slimline nib instead. You are right about drilling them out, you do need an accurate chuck for the job and my little pin jaws on the vicmarc are ideal for that. I sell my casing pens for $45 with timber tops, I add more for deer antler or buffallo horn. Here is one from a while back.

[dai sensei]

I should have asked how to get the primer out. I tried punching from both ends without success. Being impatient, I held the shell in my pin jaws, and using a drill that was the same size as the inside of the neck (so the neck was a guide) drilled all the way through. I then cast the resin and then redrilled with the correct size. Luckily for me, straight down the center.

So next time, how should I have removed the primer?

[Penpal]

Thanks for the pic of your pen I make mine another way,also favour the gun clip,called Sam and recommended he contact you to progress his cartridge designs,he seems to have a quick learning curve.Looking forward to seeing the results of others.Mostly I want to continue with timber at this time. Cheers Peter:2tsup:

[Simomatra]

Thanks for posting the picture Bdar

I take it that you faced off another cartridge to make the centre ring or did you machine it seperately?

Like the pen clip as well

[Schtoo]

Neil, find a 2mm rod, and run that down the inside of the case. Tap with a hammer to pop the primer out.

This should work most of the time.

There is a small hole in the middle of the primer pocket, that's where you want that rod to run through.

Problem is, some cases have two smaller holes. Since you are not using the case for it's original purpose, hit it with the hammer a lot harder. ;)

Cruzi, the 270 (Winchester) is based on the 30-06 case, as is the 308 (Winchester) and 243 (Winchester). All one big, happy family.

The 303 has effectively no similarity to any of them, other than being classed as a 30cal, and even then it uses a bigger pill.

Sorry.