Joists

[Pete-IS]

Just wondering if anyone can give me advice on replacing termite eaten joists. I don't want to remove the floorboards as it will be a huge job.
Can I replace the joists from under the floor??
How should I remove the existing termite eaten joists and then replace withe the new joists????
Any help would be appreciated.
Cheers

[Sir Stinkalot]

The joists will be sitting on the bearers so it will be difficult to remove from under. Also the floor boards are most likely to be nailed to the joists, depending on the age of the house. You should make sure that you get the place sprayed before going too far. If the termites are in the joists they will most likely also be in the bearers.

Make sure you get the job done well as any further termites remaining will cause problems further down the track and you will just have to start again.

My advice for what its worth .... Rip up the floorboards, check the damage ... fix the problem. It may be worth the hassle getting somebody in to do the job as there will be structural issues when removing bearers and joists.

Stinky

[Pete-IS]

I need to replace two bearers as well. I was thinking about jacking up the floor so that I could then remove the bearer and replace it with the new one. My biggest problem is that I have a built-in cupboard over the top of one of the eaten bearers...any suggestions???

[Pete-IS]

What type of tradesman would I need? A builder or a carpenter?
How much would it approximatley cost??

[Sir Stinkalot]

Use a qualified builder .... cost will depend on how much work is involved etc. but it will not be cheap. How do you know the termites are confined to one or two bearers? Just because it isn't showing any signs yet doesn't mean that there are not termites present in other bearers joists or possibly stumps (unless concrete). Have you had a pest guy in yet or are you doing it by eye and touch (ie finger through the joist :) ) Is the damage bad enough to need replacement or just removal of the termites?

[Pete-IS]

I have a termite inspector coming in an hour, the bearers and joists need replacing as those sections of the floor are sagging. Small amounts of the wood are eaten away, however there aren't any new mud trails or from sight any new holes.

[Sir Stinkalot]

The termite inspector should know how much work will be involved and be able to provide you with a good estimate on the cost from his experience. Good luck and let us know how you get on.

[Pete-IS]

Cheers Sir Stinkalot!! will do

[John G]

I would contract a re-stumper.
A restumper has the experience and equipment to jack up a whole house while replacing stumps, so the same concept should apply to replacing joists.
Most should also have experience with termite-repair, as often termite damage and poor foundation work go together.

We are currently undergoing re-stumping, plus termite treatment (say goodbye $$$$$), and we have had to replace some joists and bearers.
Ours had to tear up some floor boards as we had insufficient crawl space under the floor, plus some were termite damaged.
Since you are not looking at replacing any stumps, the cost should be significantly less than the thousands we are paying :(

[Pete-IS]

Thanks John. Good news is there are no active termites, we had an inspection yesterday and the little buggers are gone.
Thanks for the advice. Lets hope the repair bill doesn't brake the bank!!

[geoffbarker]

Kind of glad I'm not the only one going through this, but kind of not glad at the same time... kind of.

I have joists, on strip footings and brick piers, that are rotting due to the dampness under the house. I have had the pest man in, no termites near in the house, but a couple of the garden trees have had the buggers in. Next step is the Roblocking man is coming in on friday afternoon to address the joist and resulting sagging floor damage.

I've already started saving the $$$ for the bill. As you may know, if the decision is to replace the floor, it opens up the opportunities to replace the chip board sheets with modern trendy, and pricey, floor boards.

I will ask the reblocking man, but someone here might know, what happens to the kitchen cupboards while the floor is being replaced?

[Pete-IS]

Along with my termite issue i discovered an old fire place under the floor that had been filled with soil and rubble. The rising damp is up the wall about 500mm. I removed the soil and rubble however the whole area under the house is still very damp. The previous owners installed vents in the outside wall but it still hasn't totally solved the problem. The house is built on clay.

[craigb]

Gee your not having a good time are you?

I guess you need to find out why the ground is so damp (I believe that the white ants like damp too). Any leaking pipes or drainage issues?. Just because the house is built on clay shuldn't mean that it's got to be damp. When you've figured out and fixed the dampness problem, then you'll need to repair (or install - depending on the age of the house) the damp proof course. Also make sure that you have good cross flow ventilation under the floor. If you only have vents in one wall it probably won't be sufficient.

Good luck

[Pete-IS]

Not fun at all!!
The house was built around the 1920's. It has cross flow ventilation, vents all the way around the house. I don't know what the damp proof course is craig. Can you explain it?

[craigb]

Pete,
A damp proof course is an impermeable membrane inserted in a mortar course at the bottom of a wall to stop moisture rising up the wall due to capillliary action. In a house of your age you should have one, probably of some sort of bitumised material. If you go ouside and look at the bottom of a wall it should be clearly visible.
If the DPC is breached or missing, then you are going to get rising damp.
I used to own a terrace house that was built in the 1880's and a DPC was a foreign concept to the person who built it, so rising damp was a problem for me.

By the way, How come the fireplace is UNDER the floor?

Hope this helps

Craig

[Pete-IS]

Craig
The fireplace was positioned in a corner. The previous owners decided to remove it and turn the then dining room into the now bedroom. Only problem was when they removed the fireplace and replaced the floor they left the existing fireplace structure and filled it with bricks and dirt.

[geoffbarker]

By the way, How come the fireplace is UNDER the floor?


My question too??


Also, at my house, the underfloor space, as mentioned above, is damp. This is an excellent living condition for termites and worth sorting out straight away.
I am going to install a 12 volt fan, ecofan I think it was called, and knock out a few bricks at in the opposite wall to the vents and fit it. This will go to a timer and run on/off through out the day and night. No point in replacing the floor and still it being prone to getting damp.
The rising damp around the 'sunken' fireplace could be handeled with a liquid type damp proof course that you pour into drilled holes into the bricks. In the local paper where I live there is a couple of trades people that do this, so I gather it must be commonplace. After reading the pamphlet it would be a DIY job saving you a bit of $$, that you will need for the floor, council permits, termite control, 56 unforseen problems etc etc.

[John G]

Here is my termite adventure. It may help answer some general questions:
Our house is a 1920's weatherboard in Melbourne. We bought it about 4 years ago newly "renovated". About 2 years ago we first noticed termite damage.
1) 1st course of action was termite treatment using termite powder. 12 months and $1k+ later, we are told they are no longer using the product because it doesn't work! But of course no refund. So next option is to spray under the house, except we have no access to the crawl space.
2) Insufficient crawl space meant the floorboards had to come up. Not that bad since some were termite damaged, plus we needed to get some restumping done anyway.
4) Under our bathroom was an old fireplace similar to what Pete has. It was piled right up to the joists. This has allowed termite access, as well as killing ventilation. The reblocker has removed a hell of a lot of rubble and bluestone from under the house.
5) Under floor will be damp if there is insufficient ventilation and ground clearance. As long as there are enough ventilation holes, (and no plants blocking the vents!) this should be plenty without needing a fan.

Good ventilation will keep the under floor dry and hence help prevent termites.

Regarding the floors:
6) In the bathroom the vanity will need to be removed in order to allow new joists to be installed, but only because the joist is under the vanity. We will replace the floorboards there with tiles.
7) In the kitchen/living, we have several choices:
- leave the cabinets, and have new floorboards fitted ON the old floor, around the cabinets. This will raise the floor the thickness of the boards, but save the hassle of cabinet removal. I don't really like this option though.
- removing the cabinets and replacing the floorboards, but I am nervous about doing this if the termites come back.
- removing the cabinets and lay thin boards over a chipboard floor. As I understand it, chipboard is more resistant to pest intrusion than just timber, although those thin boards can look very fake.

In either case, we will be waiting 1-2 years before replacing the floors in order to be convinced we've defeated the termites. So we are going to live with temporary chipboard floors until then.

Lessons learnt:
- Not having access under the house is criminal, as you can't do any inspections.
- Our termite problem was encouraged by insufficient ventilation and poor termite proofing (bearers on soil)
- Builder's insurance supposedly does not cover old work that is renovated. Only new work. So the builder had no duty of care to termite proof the old section of the house. Therefore he could leave bearers resting on soil. This bit I am angry about.
- Any amount spent on prevention is worth it, compared to the cost and hassle of repair.

John.

[geoffbarker]

Under the floor I (well a trademan) am going to replace some joists. The original ones are Oregan (and rotted), and I am going to have these replaced with Treated pine as the under floor is a little prone to dampness. I know the ends of cut treated pine lengths have to be coated with something to seal the exposed end - what is it? So I can make sure the restumper will do it.

Any other hints I need to make sure the job is a good one??