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Gil Jones
11th Feb 2007, 11:28 AM
Mulberry hollow form, with a Walnut collar.
Finished with a coat of lacquer, buffed, and waxed.
76.2mm wide x 31.75mm hi (3" wide x 1.25" hi).
I would like to shorten the base by 6mm, but there is not enough wood.

ss_11000
11th Feb 2007, 12:23 PM
top job gil:clap:

OGYT
11th Feb 2007, 12:27 PM
Well done, Gil.:D
Foot is a little big, according to the golden mean... but what do it know?
I like these with a larger foot. Has a UFO shape... neato!

EX's Timber
11th Feb 2007, 02:06 PM
Nice one Gil, mulberry would have to be one of my favourite timbers

Rum Pig
11th Feb 2007, 04:40 PM
Very nice I like the shape. And the finish looks first class:brava

BernieP
11th Feb 2007, 06:14 PM
G'Day Gil

As usual very nice love the contrast of colours (colors!) but the sameness of the grain.

Cheers
Bernie

TTIT
12th Feb 2007, 12:57 AM
Nice piece Gil - as Bernie said, the grains match nicely. Very different color to the mulberry I have here which is a chocolate brown. Goodonya mate! :2tsup:

joe greiner
12th Feb 2007, 01:15 AM
Looks great, Gil. Golden mean depends on what's being measured with respect to what. Ratio with respect to the maximum diameter would suggest the foot is too narrow! In any event, I'd consider it only a starting point for design, and adjust as seen fit. Color contrast, wood grain, etc. alters perception, and stubborn adherence doesn't necessarily help.

Joe

WillyInBris
12th Feb 2007, 08:56 AM
looks good to me gil but I am only new to this, I like the base the way it is and would love to be able to do the same one day.

I give it a big :2tsup:

Willy

OGYT
12th Feb 2007, 10:20 AM
Golden mean depends on what's being measured with respect to what. Ratio with respect to the maximum diameter would suggest the foot is too narrow!
Not claiming to be an expert, by any means, but I've always heard that the Golden Mean called for the base to be 1/3d of the diameter of the piece?:? If I'm wrong, someone enlighten me. I've never read it... just heard it. :doh:

hughie
12th Feb 2007, 10:55 AM
Gil, Nice one, something I have come expect.Your a dab hand on the gouge. :D




Not claiming to be an expert, by any means, but I've always heard that the Golden Mean called for the base to be 1/3d of the diameter of the piece?:? If I'm wrong, someone enlighten me. I've never read it... just heard it.


Al,
From memory its from Fibonacci 1.68:1 He was a 12th century mathematician from Italy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_ratio

Although as usual the early Greeks seem to have got there first.

hughie
12th Feb 2007, 10:56 AM
Not claiming to be an expert, by any means, but I've always heard that the Golden Mean called for the base to be 1/3d of the diameter of the piece?:? If I'm wrong, someone enlighten me. I've never read it... just heard it.


Al,
From memory its from Fibonacci 1.618, He was a 12th century mathematician from Italy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_ratio

Although, as usual the early Greeks seem to have got there first.

Rookie
12th Feb 2007, 11:14 AM
Nasty stutter you got there Hughie.

Skew ChiDAMN!!
12th Feb 2007, 12:26 PM
A related thread: Basic geometry instead of measuring? (http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showthread.php?t=36665)

'Tis something I'm still mucking about with. :rolleyes:

Gil Jones
12th Feb 2007, 02:52 PM
Thanks to you all for your comments, recommendations, and ideas!!
Tomorrow it will be on my donut chuck for a bit of foot surgery. I have decided to roll (radius) the foot and if it looks doable, make the foot into a bead. Shortening the foot 6mm is not possible (6mm was a guess) as the foot is only 3.5mm hi.

rodent
12th Feb 2007, 07:24 PM
Looks much better than my first try at mulberry love the top mmmm wonder if i could do that with some camphor ??? oh well have too go look at my stocks (may be a walnut top)

rsser
12th Feb 2007, 08:45 PM
Nice piece Gil - as Bernie said, the grains match nicely. Very different color to the mulberry I have here which is a chocolate brown. Goodonya mate! :2tsup:

I'm wondering whether the older the tree the browner the timber.

EX's Timber
12th Feb 2007, 08:51 PM
I have cut down a mulberry tree down that was at least 80 yrs old and it was a nice golden yellow color.

Have found that if it's exposed to sunlight it goes browner in color

Gil Jones
13th Feb 2007, 04:14 AM
DJ, our Mulberry is colored like yours. A beautiful brilliant yellow when green, turning slowly into a golden brown as it ages. Like yours, the color change is faster when exposed to UV light. Osage Orange is part of the Mulberry family.
This pic is Mulberry that was blown down by a hurricane that came through near here in 2004, and turned while green. The yellow color is nice, but with in a year it was heading towards brown. Pardon the odd foot; this was among my early attempts at turning (though I still seem to have trouble with my feet:- ).

EX's Timber
13th Feb 2007, 07:42 AM
That's exactly right Gil. The tree I cut down looked very much the same as your log there except the bark was a little rougher.

This is a link (http://www.woodworkforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=31409) to a bud vase I turned about 5 yrs ago elsewhere on the forum. This pictures was taken within the last 6 months.

It used the be a bright yellow gold colour when it was originally made. I think I still have the spigot from it sitting on my shelves and it is still a bright gold colour.

At the time I turned it I didn't have a camera. It's at my parent's house and it has always sat on a side-boy next to the window and I can say that it change colour fairly quickly.

TTIT
13th Feb 2007, 08:55 AM
This is a link (http://www.woodworkforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=31409) to a bud vase I turned about 5 yrs ago elsewhere on the forum. This pictures was taken within the last 6 months.

It used the be a bright yellow gold colour when it was originally made. .
Thats the stuff DJ ! :o All of mine is that color but it's been seasoning (in Dad's shed) for about 25 years too - sunlight or not, maybe it all ends up that colour eventually :shrug:


Pardon the odd foot; this was among my early attempts at turning (though I still seem to have trouble with my feet:- ). Stop worrying about your feet Gil - they're fine! You're going to end up with a complex at this rate :;

Gil Jones
13th Feb 2007, 01:34 PM
DJ, that 5 yr old piece does look nice as dark as it is. I have not seen our Mulberry turn that dark, even sitting in the sun, but who knows, our Daughter-in-law has it now out in California..
TTIT, I doubt there will be any complex between these ears. I liked it as it was, but the foot was wider than I cared for. Here is the piece after a bit of toe surgery this morning.
The dimensions are now 76.2mm W x 28.575mm hi x and the foot is 25.4mm wide. So the major diameter is the same, the height is 3.175mm less, and the foot went from 38.1mm to 25.4mm wide. This piece is as small as it can get and not become a funnel. My wife, Bunny, likes it, so that is that.

joe greiner
13th Feb 2007, 03:47 PM
A related thread: Basic geometry instead of measuring? (http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showthread.php?t=36665)

'Tis something I'm still mucking about with. :rolleyes:

Skew, your link mentioned proportional dividers for the golden ratio. The tool is called a "Fibonacci gauge." Here's a link:
http://woodstore.stores.yahoo.net/figaandhowto.html

They sell a pdf file, but the math isn't heroic; likely within our/your capabilities. Use Al binder posts for the hinge points.

Joe

hughie
13th Feb 2007, 04:04 PM
[ our Mulberry is colored like yours. A beautiful brilliant yellow when green, turning slowly into a golden brown as it ages. Like yours, the color change is faster when exposed to UV light. Osage Orange is part of the Mulberry family.
This pic is Mulberry that was blown down by a hurricane that came through near here in 2004, and turned while green. The yellow color is nice, but with in a year it was heading towards brown. Pardon the odd foot; this was among my early attempts at turning (though I still seem to have trouble with my feet:-



This bodes well for me as I have a couple logs under the bench with burl type lumps here and there.I was wondering what the mulberry would be like.

Feet, as long as they reach the ground your on a winner :D

Hickory
13th Feb 2007, 04:10 PM
Gil, Change not nothing.... I LOVE IT THE WAY IT IS ... That "Golden Rule" is for minimum requirements at best. As a student of design (although a number of years ago) I faintly remember that that Golden set of numbers and equation was a basis for comparison not a set in wool "Oh My God" restriction where a plaque will befall your first born should you not obey.... There are terms like "no less than" and the most important "In My Personal Opinion"... That is a Loverly piece and the base is just fine. The 1/3 suggested rule applies to "NO Less Than" but larger is not a problem.

My question concerns the color (colour for the Canadians reading this) Is it natural or did you stain the piece? I have seen several pieces of Mulberry (I hate what the birds do to your car when you have one of these trees in a neighbor's yard across the street) wood and have not seen such dark marking before. Just courious....

Gil Jones
13th Feb 2007, 05:14 PM
No stain or dye. Deft lacquer, buff, wax, and more buff. If you use oil or oil base finish it will darken even more. The Golden mean, ratio, or triangle (and the like) is okay to nudge us in the right proportional direction, but I have no desire to be chained to it. In the case of this little Mulberry piece (and others I have turned), I did not notice that the foot "looked" a bit high and wide (mostly too wide) until it was parted off. Fortunately, my donut chuck can handle most ‘modifications’. My vacuum chuck will soon make up for the donut chuck's shortfalls. I need to get into the habit of unscrewing the scroll chuck (with work in it), and look it over in the vertical. For some reason I sometimes miss certain visual cues in the horizontal.
Possibly, birthdays are partly at fault.

Skew ChiDAMN!!
13th Feb 2007, 07:05 PM
Skew, your link mentioned proportional dividers for the golden ratio. The tool is called a "Fibonacci gauge." Here's a link:
http://woodstore.stores.yahoo.net/figaandhowto.html

Thanks, Joe. I've been meaning to build a set of proportional calipers (which I've also heard called "hourglass" or "double-ended" calipers), but somehow I haven't gotten a round tuit. They're a bit more suitable for turning.

But something tells me I'll also build something like the one in your link... :wink:

Frank&Earnest
15th Feb 2007, 11:28 PM
Hi everybody. I have done a bit of research on mulberry, because it happens to be the most prized wood to make goke, the bowls the Japanese use for storing the stones used in the game of igo (which I like to play). The two main species are the white (morus alba) native of Asia which produces the leaves eaten by silkworm, and the black (morus nigra) native of the Middle East. The name comes from the color of the wood (hence the dark brown mentioned). There are also a Chinese, a North American and an African type.

Here is my question: while the black variety is good for carving and turning, the white is generally reputed poor for these purposes. It would seem logical, however, that the variety prized by the Japanese would be their white variety. Any chance to find out whether that beautiful bowl was made with it, disproving its fame, or was it maybe one of the others (not the black one, obviously)? None is indigenous, anyway.

Maybe you could feed the leaves to silkworms to see if they eat them...:D

PS. Sorry Gil, I am getting senile :- . I have noticed now that you are from NA. That answers the question, doesn't it? I would still like to hear from any Aussie who has tried the white one, though. Any advice greatly appreciated.

rodent
16th Feb 2007, 12:59 AM
joe if only you knew skew , especially when he gets a bee in his bonnet .

joe greiner
16th Feb 2007, 01:29 AM
But something tells me I'll also build something like the one in your link... :wink:

I'm posting a reply with cartoons at http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showthread.php?t=45048

started, with derivations, by Claude in Verona (La truciolara).

Joe