Cost of building a new house???

[Phil Jennings]

Hi All,
we're hoping to build a weekender (ie cheap, low maintenance, nothy too grand or fancy) in the Blue Mountains west of Sydney. We bought some cheap software from Tandy to draft our floor plan and I built a scale model out of oregon scraps. Took it to a building designer as they are much cheaper than architects (sorry Sir Stinkalot). He is also a builder.

When it came to budget for our 150 sq m weekender clad in corrugated iron all over he thought we were way too short. So he did a detailed cost estimate cost that came to $1867 sq m.

This puts us exactly $100,000 over our intended budget. Does anyone know a cheaper builder or at least how to find one? Is it possible to build a house with no frills for $1300 sq m or less?

All advice welcome.
Thanks in advance.
Phil

[Sir Stinkalot]

First of I must say that I am deeply hurt … you are basically taking the food from my families mouth (or really taking the bandsaw from my workshop) by using a building designer over a fully tertiary trained architect. :p

Just kidding …..

Now to be serious for a second the price seems to be a little on the high side. We are currently in the process of designing a weekender on an island that has no water or power and can only be accessed by a boat. The design is basically a small house with three bedrooms, bathroom, ensuite and powder room etc. In other words it fairly flash. The size is about 180 m2 and we are expecting around $1500m2. This is of a high standard of finish however. There will be plenty of custom steel work going into this property as it has a rolled form roof. Your house price may be high for a number of reasons,
1. Access to the site may be difficult.
2. They may be using trades not in the area.
3. They may not really want your job so they are giving you a dummy price.

Just shop around until you find the price you want. Make sure you specify the quality of finish that you are after. Try local trades to the site. You may also look into a prefab (cringe) home, they are simply made off site and put up in a few days. Less problems with weather and they are mostly done to standard sizes in the workshop so there is no tricky work such as our custom rolled steel work.

Hope this helps

Stinky.

[Phil Jennings]

Thanks Stinky that's good advice. In fact the design is purposely done to be easy to build and it's quite a flat site in an area where there are quite few builders.

What I'm not sure about is how to "shop around" for a builder. The quote we got so far is very detailed and we paid to have it done. Would we expect to pay other builders for a quote. How accurate is a quote anyway?

Best regards
Phil:confused:

[Phil Jennings]

I meant to say quite a few builders.

[journeyman Mick]

You will probably have to bite the bullet and pay someone to draw a set of plans. Take pictures of your site, especially access, add notes as to access to water and power and then go shopping for a builder. Up this way no builders that I know will charge to quote off supplied plans. Even if you don't get complete quotes I would be looking at a M2 estimate (making sure of course that the builder you are talking to fits into your planned timeframe), and when(if) you find two or three builders you are comfortable with you could look at a firm quote. This way you will be comparing apples with apples and you will be presenting yourself as someone serious and ready to build, not a time waster or tyre kicker. Personally when people ask me for quotes I ask to see their plans, if they have none I give them the names of some design draughtsmen and tell them to give me a call when they've got some plans.

Hope this is of some help,

Mick

[Phil Jennings]

Thanks Mick,
we're trying to get plans drawn up but what are the guidelines for inexperienced people like us to make sure our plans will fit in our budget? Is there a range of average costs per sq m? And is it then a matter of finding a builder who will do it in that range?
Thanks
Phil

[Sir Stinkalot]

The builder wouldn't really draw up the plans. I would suggest for intial drawings contact your local Tafe or University and try and find a final year student in drafting or architecture to draw up the plans for you from what you have done. You cannot use these drawings for you building permit but for town planning and building quotes they will be fine. A final year student trying to get some experience will cost around $15-$20 per hour and it will most likely take them about a week or so to work off your sketches. From my experience drafting by the hour is around $60-$70 and architects $90-$140. Experienced workers should get it done in about 2 days and the drawings will be of a higher standard than a student and will be used for the basis of the building permit drawings.

I would agree with Mick .... asking a builder to quote from hand (or cheap drafting packages) sketched plans is asking for trouble, the builder is likely to look at the uncertanty and see trouble ahead and adjust the price accordingly, always up. You are most likely paying for a quote because the drawings presented are of a low standard (no offense intended), the money you save on the quotes could be spent on getting them drafted. It is a good idea however to have a go yourself as the designer/architect has a better idea of what you are after and can get the work done in a timely fashion.

Stinky

[Phil Jennings]

Hi Mick and Stinky,
the essence of using a bulletin board is to recognise when you've got good advice. And we both agree that you blokes have given it to us. We will put into practice your recommendations and hopefully we'll be able to post a picture of our weekender by the end of next year.
Many thanks.
Cheerio
Phil

[soundman]

if you are thinking of corigated iron.

have you thaught of freezer panel.

its very strong well insulated and goes up fast.

a bit unconventional & expect a few blank looks.

have a chat to them who designs cold stores.


jut a wierd thaught.

[journeyman Mick]

Freezer panel is not a silly idea, a bit expensive perhaps, but not silly. The convention centre in Cairns was basically built out of freezer panels amongst other things and it won all sorts of awards for, amongst other things, energy efficiency.

Mick

[Phil Jennings]

Keep the weird ideas coming guys - it sounds good to me but you haven't got any good ideas for keeping the cost down do you?That's why Im going for colourbond walls, although prefer klip-lok rather than corrugated.

Thanks
Phil:)

[RETIRED]

Gooday.

My brother built his place out of colourbond Corrugated iron sheets laid sideways. Very cheap and easy to erect.

[journeyman Mick]

While colorbond is cheap to buy (I think I paid about $7 a lineal metre and it covers 760mm thus $7 for .76M2- you do the maths) and fast to fit, it gets a bit more expensive to finish off. They'll need to fold up custom flashings for all the external corners, and around all openings. These can't usually be pressed up ahead of time as you've got to get all the sheeting up to see where all the crests and valleys fall to get your flashing dimensions. It's hard to say what's cheapest to build in as there are regional variations. A starting point might be to poll some of the local builders with the location (terrain, access, need for cranes/backhoes) and approximate M2, tell them your getting plans drawn and ask them what construction type/materials would be their choice for economy. The whole pricing bit is the hardest part of the building game and I've yet to see an architect or draughtsman that could give an accurate $/M2 projection for their plans. The cheapest local builder here does pole homes, generally clad in WRC or Cyprus, neither of which are local or the cheapest materials available. However he is generally the cheapest because of his modus operandi, which is: use semi skilled labourers instead of tradesman, and work hard and fast with only lip service paid to safety. His work is also somewhat rough, not structurally inadequate, just rough. So although the materials he uses aren't the cheapest, his houses are. Sorry, this post was no help at all! Just muddied the waters somewhat:confused:

Mick

[Pulpo]

I'm trying to build something that’s cheap on cost but not in quality, for a weekender.

Goulburn area

I'm sketching some plans up in the next month then dropping them off to a local drafts person to draw them up properly with an engineer to sign off. If feasible my end, council will get a copy.

I will be making my intentions clear to the draughts person, that I will be building the structure and require the cheapest material available.

I have looked at different materials for the walls.

Hebel, colourbond, timber, cement fibre sheeting.

I will probably go with blue board. cement sheeting. I believe this will be the cheapest.

Try www.tradeconnect.com.au

I will probably go with a steel frame.

Not sure to build on a concrete slab or on footings.

I imagine the cabin retreat will be around 80m2.

If times on your side, mud bricks may be an option if dirt is available, also straw bale, maybe even my favourite rammed earth.

Although I have researched all of them to some extent I do not have the time required not to mention expertise.

I'm no builder but enjoy this sort of project, I have tried to get builders and I'm sick of their little games they play.

My experience with builders/trades people where supervision is not possible, hold your breath and hope for the best, I've just had too many bad experience with this situation.

I have not actually budgeted exactly as yet.

I think a kit home about this size was around $27,000 [not sure]
Plus the builders cost.

If they can do it I'm hoping to beat their price.

I like your brothers house very impressive.

Cheers

Pulpo



www.tradeconnect.com.au (http://) www.tradeconnect.com.au (http://www.tradeconnect.com.au)

[Sir Stinkalot]

I love the idea of mub brick, rammed earth and straw bale homes but the truth is that they aren't much cheaper than standard brick construction, and in fact can cost more. There would be savings if you wanted to do it yourself but there is lots of work and the materials need to be available on site, if they need to be imported the price goes even higher again.

Stinky.

[soundman]

The big advantages of freezer panel are

colourbond finish. no painting required inside or out.

much nicer profile than corigated iron. Can be painted with a roler if you want.

already insulated. choose your thickness.

requires no stud frame or bracing . essentialy self supporting & bracing.

Requires no custom made flashings. there is a whole suite of extrusions designed for it.

I have not heard of anything that eats it or makes a home in it.

It goes up soooo fast.

So by the time you cost it out it looks better & better.

What do they make mining camps out of???


Say there is a thaught. See if you can buy a couple of mining camp modules. Either new or at auction.

Tow them out there & stick em on stumps.

HMMMMM.

[journeyman Mick]

Metroll (a plumbing supplier in Qld, don't know about anywhere else) carry a range of "freezer panel" type panels. They are specifically designed for dwelling rather than freezer construction and come with a range of trim profiles and I think thay are available in more colours than the coldroom stuff. They also have from the same manufacturer a roofing system consisting of a 1M wide sheet of custom orb (corrugated in lay man's terms) with a choice of three different thicknesses of foam insulation and a sheet of white, flat colorbond bonded to the bottom. These have a pretty wide span, about 3.5M in a cat2 cyclone area, you may be able to span more in non cyclonic. All this stuff is pretty expensive though and you still need to get drawings and engineering done. Just as a by the by, a builder mate of mine is just finishing a 2 bedroom cottage in colorbond, basically two little pavillions with a roofed deck inbetween, all for $66,000. That's including drawings, insurance, council fees etc. etc. Mind you he's still young and works like a trojan but in fifteen years time he'll feel like me :( and be flat out building anything!

[brewsta42]

I'm new here and from Victoria. I am now getting quotes to build a house at Drouin doind some myself and subcontracting the rest out. The house is 53 square under roof which includes 18 square workshop connected to the house under the roof line and 14 square of verandah. Brick veneer and sheet roof and so far I estimate about $400 per square metre cost. That doesn't include connections or plans or permits but they will be about $5000 tops.I don't know how you got those prices per square metre but the big home builders here are building houses for about 600 a square metre which includes everything. Then again I might get caught out bigtime, shop around if you have the time and subby it out yourself as ownerbuilder. Brew