The BIL mill (WIP)

[BobL]

I had started this WIP in this thread (http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showthread.php?t=43925) but thought I'd better move it here as that's what this forum is for.

I've decided to call the new mill I'm working on the BIL mill after my brother-in-law who did all the ally welding.

First photo shows where it's up to with the 42" bar place to give you an idea of scale. The Ally is not all yet cosmetically finished and will undergo some spit and polish once its all done. Not all the bolts and nuts are final and I will change these according to what I have in my bolt drawers, the occasional whim, and as needed once I use the mill.

The all thread height adjusters (See Photo 4) are done and work great. The allthreads maintain the actual height but to clamp the vertical pipes to the mill to stop the rattles I'm going to try a beefy set of steel cams (1 2/5" diam with 3/8" through bolt). See Photo 2.

The cams are an experiment and if they continually vibrate loose, I will just replace them with 3/8" bolts. The cams are easily adjustable (thanks TTIT for the inspiration) to get serious torque on the locking mechanism and are designed to self lock by going over centre by a couple of poofteenths. They seem to work really well so far but until I try cutting and do a proper vibe test I won't know. The cam seats are made of HDPP and are replaceable and the cams can be easily retensioned by tweaking the big goldy coloured nuts (shown in Photo 3) attached to the locking arms. If there is going to be a vibe problem it might be with these nuts so I might add an extra (locking) nut to these. One problem I still have to fix is the PVC bushes (inside the vertical tube locking mechanism) tend to ride out of their seats and need locking bolts to hold them in place.

More pics in the next post.

[BobL]

Photo 1 shows the outboard end clamp with the single down tube and the same cam style clamping mechanism as the inboard. Also you can just see the full length ally tube handle that runs down the middle of the mill. This is locked/held in place by supports in the middle and at the end . The middle and outboard supports are adjustable. To avoid the locking screw marking the ally tube I added a brass locking plate so the locking screw bites into the brass rather than the tube.

I messed around with a couple of different outboard guards made of expanded ally mesh and they just looked clumsy and ugly. I then found a piece of lexan (same stuff as used in MC helmet visors) in the scraps bin at work. Lexan is fantastic stuff to work with as it's very flexible, you can can cut it easily with a saw or even tin snips, bend it a fair bit even cold, and yet it remains quite tough, and it's transparent too! So Photo 2 is what I came up with.

Photo 3 shows a back view of the guard. I reckon my single tube nose-end-clamp is inherently safer than regular alaskans as the main part of the clamp is outside the nose bar - which also maximises cut capacity. Of course it only works with hardnoses. I just added this guard to make sure someone doesn't acciedntally stick their finger in the vicinity.

Still to do!
- make the inboard clutch cover.
- Auxilliary Oiler.
- try it out !!

Once I'm happy it works
- loctite all none-adjustable screws
- descratch, spit and polish.
- Take pics

Start on the next design (No, No, No, No, No - not for a while anyway)!

Cheers

[goodwoody]

Doesn't that look sweet!!!!!!!!!:2tsup:

[martrix]

The BIL Mill gets the :2tsup: from me.

Very nice looking unit Bob. Will have to take some time to digest it all, lots going on in there.

I assume the central bar (supporting the handle)is adjustable so you can move it to the centre of the board you are ripping so you have something to rest/stabilise the mill on when entering and exiting a cut? IE, to stop the mill dipping on exit.

Call me stupid but I cant work out how the cam applies tension to the uprights?:-

I originally thought that the single clamp on the nose end might be dangerous because on such a long bar it may vibrate off, meaning the bar can swing separately from the mill and head towards you!:C But assuming the mill itself is rigid, the mill will always stay in the same plane as the bar because it is fixed with the 2 bar mounting studs.

I guess you will have to drill a hole in that lexan guard to fit the Aux oiler?

[DJ’s Timber]

Nice setup Bob, looking forward to seeing some pics of it in action :2tsup:.

Martrix, this post (http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showpost.php?p=518578&postcount=147) shows and explains the cam on the uprights

[martrix]

Nice setup Bob, looking forward to seeing some pics of it in action :2tsup:.

Martrix, this post (http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showpost.php?p=518578&postcount=147) shows and explains the cam on the uprights

:doh:
I didn't notice that those cuts were only half-way. I only looked at one side which looked like three separate outer tubes and was baffled.

Crystal now.:rolleyes:

If they have enough tension I think they should hold quite well with the vibes. As you say Bob they are really only there to stop any rattling as the height is locked by the all thread.

Do you have any other pics of how you made the cams?
Someone on AS mentioned using a quick release style like in a vice where the threaded block disengages with the thread rod. I might look into that style.

Greenie for you DJ so I can then fire one off for Bob.:2tsup:

[BobL]

Thanks Guys - I keep wanting to take it out for a run but keep thinking of things to add to it.


Will have to take some time to digest it all, lots going on in there.
Yeah - maybe it's the product of too much time in planning, and not enough in the shed.


I assume the central bar (supporting the handle)is adjustable so you can move it to the centre of the board you are ripping so you have something to rest/stabilise the mill on when entering and exiting a cut? IE, to stop the mill dipping on exit.
Correct, undo 4 nuts and the long handle screw clamp and the middle bar slides up and down. Might replace the nuts with a coupla cams ??


Call me stupid but I cant work out how the cam applies tension to the uprights?:-
Check out the picture.


But assuming the mill itself is rigid, the mill will always stay in the same plane as the bar because it is fixed with the 2 bar mounting studs.
Yep - the main purpose of the outboard is vertical position fixing of the nose, there is very little need for horizontal positioning.


I guess you will have to drill a hole in that lexan guard to fit the Aux oiler?
Actually I'm thinking of coming in from underneath :oo: - more about that later.

[martrix]

Actually I'm thinking of coming in from underneath :oo: - more about that later.


oh, oh. I'm having visions of batteries and mini-motorized pumps.....http://www.arboristsite.com/images/smilies/popcorn.gif

[BobL]

oh, oh. I'm having visions of batteries and mini-motorized pumps.....http://www.arboristsite.com/images/smilies/popcorn.gif

Not quite :D , but I have found found a smick looking chrome plated brass needle valve in the odds'n'sods box at work. The idea of coming in from underneath is to allow the chain to be easily removed without removing the whole CS from the mill. If the oil line comes into the top of the bar it prevents this. Still no luck in finding a suitable aux oil tank. I was thinking of an old car windscreen or radiator overflow water tank but no luck in tracking anything suitable down.

[weisyboy]

looking good bob now i get what you mean about the center rail.

[BobL]

Busy time at the day job so not much shed time this week or weekend.

The few hours spare I've had, I've been mainly doing cosmetic things like replacing the scummy looking main 10mm galavnized nuts with some shmick looking brass dome nuts. Sanded down the whole thing with 180 then 400 grit and the ran the whole thing past the buff. That grey, and then white ally buffing compound sure does the trick. I could have made it all mirror finish but don't have time.

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=48600&stc=1&d=1182084444

I've also made a change to the main central cross piece locking mechanisms and added a vertical central handle.
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=48601&stc=1&d=1182084444

The locking mechanisms were just bolts but are now cams. It's taken quite a long time to make these cams and If I'd known it was going to take this long I would not have bothered although I can now turn out this style of cam out pretty quickly now if I had to.

The handle is an ally bicycle handlebar stem (inverted) with a mountain bike handlebar grip pushed onto it. I tried putting a cam on the allen locking bolt for the handle but at 6mm its pretty hard to get enough pressure to lock tight enough and I've snapped two locking mechanism pins in trying. I have a plan to start with a 10 mm high tensile steel bolt and work from there.

Here's a view of the handle etc from the other side.

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=48602&stc=1&d=1182084444

Here's a close up of the cross piece locking cams.
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=48603&stc=1&d=1182084444

The cam holding force can be adjusted by releasing the cam and turning the dome nuts by hand. When the cam locks into place the dome nuts are very tight. It will be interesting to see if they vibrate loose with the CS operating. If they do I can tweak the cam to lock even harder or just lock the dome nuts down with a spanner - the cam will still work but the adjustment will require a spanner.

Finally heres a close up of the vertical position locking cams all polished up and look fancy.
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=48604&stc=1&d=1182084444
My wife thinks I'm building a strange piece of surgical equipment and my son says it looks like a "trepanning instrument for giants".

To do:
1) Aux Oil tank - I have all the pieces except the tank. I found a reasonable and cheap ($6) brass air tap at Bunnys, it uses 1/4" BSP fittings, and I have connected that to a brass needle valve (7/16 UNF). After hunting around for the right taps and dies I couldn't find what I needed so I made my own 1/4" BSP and 7/16" UNF taps from 1/2" bolts and the respective dies.
2) Clutch guard: Still thinking about that.

Cheers

[givusabrake]

Well Bob, you most certainly take a lot of pride in your work

Its nice, good to see true craftsmanship

[TTIT]

Mate this thing is lookin' way too flash to use for bush slabbin' - needs to be on a showroom floor somewhere. :2tsup::2tsup:
I really don't think you'll have a problem with the cam-locks. Because you built adjustment into them, they are easily tuned to stay put. Damn nice job on the whole thing!:U

[BobL]

Thanks guys, the attention to cosmetics is mainly a result of only multiple short periods of time available to work in the shed and no big slab of time time to go millin' :D . It will, as Martrix points, at the emd of the day out help with cleaning etc. I will mainly use the mill in BILs workyard where several logs await my attention. Unfortunately SWMBO has recently had hand surgery and muggins here is doing all the chores (only real food allowed so cannot just keep ordering takeaway). To add to that day job has been busy as. Maybe saturday?

TTIT; I haven't forgotten your wood . . . .

BobL

[weisyboy]

is it a mill or an ornament,

how long will it stay shiny once it is attached to your saw and flying down the middle of the log.

[BobL]

is it a mill or an ornament,

how long will it stay shiny once it is attached to your saw and flying down the middle of the log.

I'm not fussed, it's already lost some of its shine since the weekend and got a few dings and scratches from connecting the saw to the mill and attatching the bar and chain to it this evening.

For the BIL mill I turned up 50 mm longer bar bolts so the mill can bolt straight onto the powerhead. I made them from 14 mm diameter tensile steel bolts. They have the same 14mm diameter bar collars as regular bar bolts

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=48811&stc=1&d=1182354106

Here's a shot from further back so you can see how it all connects.

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=48812&stc=1&d=1182354106

And from the other end with the bar and chain connected up for the first time.
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=48813&stc=1&d=1182354106

I demonstrated I could put the chain on and take the chain off without removing the CS from the mill! :oo:

The benefits of connecting direct to the bar bolts instead of the bar at the powerhead end is fully realized by finally getting to measure the real cutting length of 39.5" from the 42" bar - could probably squeeze another 1/2" out of it if I had to.

Cheers

[Wild Dingo]

mmmm thinking thinking... how do I get Bill to appreciate that I REALLY need him to make me one?... mmmm wonder where I get the big bar an chain from?... mmmm wonder if a big one like that will go onto the FarmBoss in the shed?... mmmm wonder if Bill will let me drop my CS plus new soon to be gotten bigga bar and chain off at his place for a month? (I'll just kidnap one of the FSILs from his shed for awhile :; )

Looking real good Bob... reckon there could be a nice little sideline earner in this for you eh? :;

sooo how much were you chargin? :2tsup:

[BobL]

Looking real good Bob... reckon there could be a nice little sideline earner in this for you eh? :;

sooo how much were you chargin? :2tsup:

Oh I think we can come a mutual arrangement - I'll PM you.

RE: using a FarmBoss in a mill, Heres what Lakeside53 says (http://www.arboristsite.com/showpost.php?p=693454&postcount=5) on Arborist about doing this

[BobL]

In keeping with the "over the top" theme on this one, here is the Aux Oiler tank.

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=48910&stc=1&d=1182528034

The tank is made from 3mm thick 100 mm diameter ally pipe capped with 4mm thick ally plate. It looks small but it holds a litre of fluid. The top refill cap and pipe are standard brass plumbing fittings from my plumbing scraps box. The clear PVC tubing is to see the oil level in the tank.

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=48907&stc=1&d=1182527350

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=48908&stc=1&d=1182527350

The T-piece and stopcock tap are standard air handling fittings from Bunnings. The needle valve I found in the odds'n'sods box at work.
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=48909&stc=1&d=1182527350

Minimum zero resistance flow rate (tank almost empty) to the blade is 44 mL/min with a 7 cm head. Of course that will be reduced using the needle valve.

Cheers

[Munga]

Bob,
Thats quite an outfit you've got there keep up the WIP :2tsup: and the photo's are very clear. Might do a bit of idea pilfering.:D

Cheers Arch.

[DJ’s Timber]

Gees Bob, that's a top of the line rolls royce tank, looks great :2tsup:

[BobL]

Bob,
Thats quite an outfit you've got there keep up the WIP :2tsup: and the photo's are very clear. Might do a bit of idea pilfering.:D

Cheers Arch.

Go for it Arch!

[weisyboy]

looking great bob.

do you realy need an auxillary oiler on that sthill?

and how much has it cost you?

[BobL]

looking great bob.

do you realy need an auxillary oiler on that sthill?

and how much has it cost you?

For a 42" bar it has been recommended I use an Aux Oiler.

Cost?
The mill itself cost about $250 (mainly the cost of the ally and cartons for BIL!), but I used a lot of bits and pieces (nuts, bolts, brass, steel, plastic) that I already had. The 42" bar and 3/8 skip chain has cost me about $270, so all up about $520.

The closest commercial available comparable package are the bigger Granberg mills (http://onlinestore.forestindustry.com/scripts/granbergint/scan/MM=18d2794b4caf32a83daf9f620d7c2eba:5:7:5?mv_session_id=Ww5WMuLJ&mv_pc=21&mv_more_ip=1&mv_nextpage=results) which cost about a grand. Although I reckon mine is significantly superior to these mills in many ways.

If I just used steel and a simple clamping mechanism for height adjustment I reckon I could have made it for under $100 + bar plus chain.

I've probably spent about 40 hours working on it so if one wanted to be hardnosed about it I've been working for about $12 an hour. However I don't worry too much about my costs in these situations because I really like designing and making tools, so the voyage is as much fun for me as the arrival - and when I arrive I will have a highly functional tool.

When I started building this mill my main concern was I wouldn't have access to any logs to mill but right now I have access to way more logs than I ever hoped I would. Just today an arborist offered me a big camphor laurel and part of a sheoak!

[BobL]

Since the mill mounts directly onto extended bar bolts, my plan here was to buy a new cover and butcher the old one to fit the mill. However, the butchering required was so significant I thought I would just make one from scratch out of ally. BIL said he would help but that it would be better to make a cardboard mock up first. Instead of using cardboard I used some 1 mm thick galv plate and some 1 mm polycarbonate sheeting and here's what resulted. I think it's going to be pretty serviceable as it is.

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=49043&stc=1&d=1182681595

Here's a closeup.

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=49044&stc=1&d=1182681595

The 2 large headed, 6 mm brassplated allen bolts are all that is needed to attach/remove the cover - they thread into existing threaded holes on the CS. These bolts also pass through some 1/2" ally tube to brace the cover internally onto the CS housing The large hole through the polycarbonate is so the bar nuts can be loosened to adjust the chain. I may add one more bolt in the lower RH corner threaded direct onto the mill base to stop that bit flapping around.

It was really easy to make. If it works out OK and does a good job of shedding the sawdust , WIGRTI, I will remove the rivets, unfold it all and lay it out on some 3mm ally plate, mark around it, cut out the bits, weld joints, drill holes, and I'll an even more robust cover. I'm keeping the transparent cover though.

To help the mill skid over the logs I added 6mm thick UHMWPE skids to the underneath of the rails.
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=49046&stc=1&d=1182681687
If they get mangled I can replace them instead of the relatively more expensive ally unistrut.

It's nearly there - just have to finish locktiting all the unadjustable nuts, fiddle the faddle, and tuneup the fandangler. Nah . . . . I bet I'll find at least one more doohickey to add yet!

Cheers

[TTIT]

This thing is starting to look like something from a custom bike show!!! A 'pimped' CS mill :2tsup: awesome.:U

One question though Bob - breather for the oiler tank? Cos' I have to stand mine on edge to start it, I also had to arrange it so the oil didn't run out the breather when tipped up - can you start yours on it's side? OK so thats 2 questions - but on the same topic! :shrug:

[Wild Dingo]

For a 42" bar it has been recommended I use an Aux Oiler.

Cost?
The mill itself cost about $250 (mainly the cost of the ally and cartons for BIL!), but I used a lot of bits and pieces (nuts, bolts, brass, steel, plastic) that I already had. The 42" bar and 3/8 skip chain has cost me about $270, so all up about $520.

The closest commercial available comparable package are the bigger Granberg mills (http://onlinestore.forestindustry.com/scripts/granbergint/scan/MM=18d2794b4caf32a83daf9f620d7c2eba:5:7:5?mv_session_id=Ww5WMuLJ&mv_pc=21&mv_more_ip=1&mv_nextpage=results) which cost about a grand. Although I reckon mine is significantly superior to these mills in many ways.

If I just used steel and a simple clamping mechanism for height adjustment I reckon I could have made it for under $100 + bar plus chain.

I've probably spent about 40 hours working on it so if one wanted to be hardnosed about it I've been working for about $12 an hour. However I don't worry too much about my costs in these situations because I really like designing and making tools, so the voyage is as much fun for me as the arrival - and when I arrive I will have a highly functional tool.

When I started building this mill my main concern was I wouldn't have access to any logs to mill but right now I have access to way more logs than I ever hoped I would. Just today an arborist offered me a big camphor laurel and part of a sheoak!

Sounds good for parts costs... new bar etal shouldnt set me back too much:2tsup: ... but if I make a "BIL mill" and it ends up a dedicated mill Im up for a new chainsaw Im thinking :C can it be made as an attachment Bob?

As for the wood... so you still coming down to have a burl at the logs now up the back yard or dont you need to anymore?.. if so Bloody beauty! just tell me when and I'll sort a barbie if no I'll just mutter buggarbumbastard an meander away :C

[BobL]

This thing is starting to look like something from a custom bike show!!! A 'pimped' CS mill :2tsup: awesome.:U

One question though Bob - breather for the oiler tank? Cos' I have to stand mine on edge to start it, I also had to arrange it so the oil didn't run out the breather when tipped up - can you start yours on it's side? OK so thats 2 questions - but on the same topic! :shrug:

Don't worry a couple of uses and it will start looking like an old tart!

RE: Start up on side.
I dunno if my CS will start on its side. It would be a real pain if one had to pull it out 3/4 of the way through a cut to restart it. I will try it later today. I will have to tip the mill on its side anyway to fuel/oil up and swap chains etc so some sort of switch-offable oil tank breather will be needed. I thought I was done but as usual there is something else to add!

[BobL]

Sounds good for parts costs... new bar etal shouldnt set me back too much:2tsup: ... but if I make a "BIL mill" and it ends up a dedicated mill Im up for a new chainsaw Im thinking :C can it be made as an attachment Bob?

As for the wood... so you still coming down to have a burl at the logs now up the back yard or dont you need to anymore?.. if so Bloody beauty! just tell me when and I'll sort a barbie if no I'll just mutter buggarbumbastard an meander away :C

If you're making your own mill for the first time I'd suggest starting with a simple design such as the basic mills shown in this (http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showthread.php?t=50111) thread. The double clamp mills (ie one clamp at power head - one clamp at the bar nose will work on virtually any CS. The BIL MIL is designed specifically for my CS. While the fittings to the bar are standard for most saws, some bits of the powerhead on other saws may physically get in the way of the BILL mill. If/when I get another saw some adaption will be required.

In terms of design the most difficult bit to make on the BIL Mill was the dual column vertical adjustment at the powerhead end. This requires some pretty close tolerance welding and a lot of farting around with shims - I reckon this bit took 5/6 hours alone to smooth enough for my liking. The vertical adjustment would also be a lot simpler with bolt clamps instead of cam clamps.

RE: do I want to mill your wood. Sure do - at least some of it anyway - I'll be down sometime.

[Burnsy]

Bob, just wondering if you have fired up the new mill yet? I for one am keen to see some pics of it in action:2tsup: .

Cheers,
Burnsy

[BobL]

Bob, just wondering if you have fired up the new mill yet? I for one am keen to see some pics of it in action:2tsup: .


Me too!!!:2tsup:

Have been slumming it in Italy for the last 4 weeks and have another week to go. Despite the food, wine, sights, kultcha etc, I'm feeling very woodworking/timber/milling deprived at the moment, despite several visits to relatives in northern Italy with the serious 100k+ euro ww machines. The kind of thing you feed 12 x 12" rs roofing timber into a slot and it pops out trimmed to length, dressed, all boltholes drilled and every joint precut to 0.1mm. Then they bundle it all up into 500kg pack and helicopter it up to a mountain pasture and assemble a hiking hut lego style in 3 hours - amazing! I have only been to one hardware store in 4 weeks :oo: :oo: :oo: Serious therapy will be needed when I get back.

Cheers

[weisyboy]

luv ya pimped mill

wating to see it in action.

[martrix]

Good to here your surviving lowly, uninteresting Italia Bob:rolleyes: :D .

Hows the coffee?

[BobL]

Good to here your surviving lowly, uninteresting Italia Bob:rolleyes: :D .

Hows the coffee?

Coffee quality is mixed. The best coffee I had was in a small village in the mountains south of Napoli. Smooth and creamy. The worst has been in this very fancy hotel I'm staying in here in Turin, no crema and over extracted. Had to work Sat-Sun but now have 2 free days before heading back to WA. I had a couple of hours to look around for hardware shops last friday and had to make do with a very interesting "locks, hinges and handle shop". There is a HUGE market in restoration type stuff here so there is a need for replacements of old fittings. The stuff they make is fantastic, wrought iron, copper, brass and even SS made to look old. The other thing you quickly notice is design style, whatever "it" is the italians have "it" in spades, furniture, buildings, clothes etc. Can't say the same about their TV - not that ours is much to crow about either.
Cheers

[BobL]

Today I managed to get into BIL's yard and use the BIL Mill. There was lots of bolt tightening and retightening and checking and rechecking and even triple checking.

Unfortunately I did not have my own digital camera and had to wait till I was well into it before being able to borrow one for a few shots and very short movie.

The log I tried it out on was a 800mm diameter x 1.2 m long log of liquid amber. I cut 2 x 50 mm thick slabs and 5 x 82mm plus a few experimental cuts

Firstly the rail system.
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=53424&stc=1&d=1187429408

The rails are made from 6ft lengths of 19mm (3/4") SHS steel I picked up out of the skip at work. I converted half the lengths of SHS into channel and welded a length of converted channel to another length of SHS to form 19 x 38 mm thick rails. The rails are held together by all 5/16" all thread and two bits of adjustable steel angle that have tapped holes in which pointy ended bolts a threaded to grip the long at each end as shown here.
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=53425&stc=1&d=1187429408

I arrange about a foot of excess rail to hang over the ends of the log so I can place the mill onto the rails and start the engine.
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=53426&stc=1&d=1187429408

Another view:
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=53427&stc=1&d=1187429408

Some Observations:
1) the mill is still pretty heavy but glides very smoothly on its HDPE runners. Just like any decent mill with a sharp chain, minimal pushing is needed.
2) The vibrations are significant:
- 3 nuts and assorted wasters and a bolt from the mill disappeared into the sawdust during the slabbing - more locktite needed by the look of things
- one hex head exhaust cover bolt worked its way loose.
- the Brass auxillary oiler filler cap (is kept loose to allow the tank to breath) worked its way off and hit the moving chain and ricocheted into my Face Mask making a significant dent in the mask.
3) the cams used to lock the height adjustments worked really well. Obviously more testing is needed but not a sign of these working their way loose. The all thread height adjustment also worked as expected.
4) Aux oiler seems to work OK but my need more flow/pressure when working in dry wood.

All in all, not quite as exhausting as I expected and very very satisfying satisfying. More shots in the next post.

Cheers

[BobL]

As I said there was a lot of mucking about stopping and checking, chain tension, oil flow, etc.

After a couple of slabs I decided to try sloping the log - a method I got from the Aboriste site and in a way similar to FrankandEarnest's idea of a vertical mill.

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=53428&stc=1&d=1187429783

As this picture shows, it's a bit more awkward to start being higher up like that.

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=53429&stc=1&d=1187429783

WOW! it works! The mill slides down the rails on its own at one piont I was only holding the CS trigger with my left hand and not holding back or pushing at all.

As the mill reached the wider part of the trunk the engine bogs down a bit probably because there were too many cutters in the cut. In the end I needed to hold it back - not very comfortable. Conclusion : Some slope is good but not too much.

A short quicktime movie (http://www.arboristsite.com/showpost.php?p=741091&postcount=2) of me and BIL_MILL in action can be viewed at the Arborist site.

Next week, hopefully a sheaok.

Off to celebrate at BILs.
Thanks to his yard proprietor (Jeff) who gave me the logs.

Cheers

[DJ’s Timber]

Fantastic result Bob :2tsup:, video looked good.

Got a close up of the cut on the timber?

[Burnsy]

Great work Bob, love the video. Would be interesting to see the difference with a skip tooth chain, it may stop the bogging and allow you to take the easy route of the sloped log without holding it back. I noticed the Westford guys were using skip tooth on their mills last weekend.

Wil get in touch over the next few weeks and arrange a visit and play:) still interested in seeing your old mill and if possible trying my saw on it to see if it copes before I go building one.

Cheers,
mike

[martrix]

Bob, that is way cool.:cool:

Brilliant to see it in action....Will have a look at vid later and shoot you an email, hitting the town tonight.:D :drink2: :drunk22: :drink:



...................."its aliiive"http://www.arboristsite.com/images/smilies/chainsawguy.gif

[BobL]

Fantastic result Bob :2tsup:, video looked good.
Cheers DJ.


Got a close up of the cut on the timber?

Nah, unfortunately only had the loaner camera from BIL for 5 minutes and he left me with the memory card. BILs yard is about 20k's from my place so a bit far to go back for the camera. Will take one next week.

[BobL]

Yo Mike,


Great work Bob, love the video. Would be interesting to see the difference with a skip tooth chain, it may stop the bogging and allow you to take the easy route of the sloped log without holding it back. I noticed the Westford guys were using skip tooth on their mills last weekend.

I was using full skip chain (3/8 rip profile).


Wil get in touch over the next few weeks and arrange a visit and play:) still interested in seeing your old mill and if possible trying my saw on it to see if it copes before I go building one.

No worries.
Cheers

[reeves]

jeez it looks like a hot rod, great work make and you look like a handsome dude in those shiny red chaps....;-)

[Big Shed]

That is one great looking mill!

I downloaded the video, but I can't seem to play it. Have tried to play it in the 2 video playing programs I use, Windows Media Player and DivX, but they don't want to know about it!

[DJ’s Timber]

That is one great looking mill!

I downloaded the video, but I can't seem to play it. Have tried to play it in the 2 video playing programs I use, Windows Media Player and DivX, but they don't want to know about it!

BS you need to use Quicktime to play the vid

[BobL]

jeez it looks like a hot rod, great work make and you look like a handsome dude in those shiny red chaps....;-)

I think it feels more like a sports car than a hot rod :wink:

RE: Shiny red chaps:
Once I have gathered some more "milling-cred" I plan to make a real spectacle of myself by matching them with some bright orange Stihl braces.:D

[Big Shed]

BS you need to use Quicktime to play the vid

Thanks DJ, did that and it did the trick. How many b***dy video player programs are there?

I had 4 different ones on my puter and none would play this video. So now I have 5!:rolleyes:

Looks good Bob, seems to cut very nicely, that slope does the trick.

Have you thought about getting one of those Stihl or Husqvarna helmets with the earmuffs and mesh face shield. That plastic one seems to attract a lot of dust.
They would also match the chaps better:D

[TEEJAY]

Looks good Bob. :2tsup:

I did wonder about the nuts and bolts - quite a few - bugger to find in a pile of sawdust - gone - know the feeling. Would nylock nuts work better?

Great to read the adjuster works fine. I don't mean to be critical but I prefer something with least amount of moving parts possible cuz when you are way out west the most basic is the most reliable.

I did find the milling of timber on a 15-25 degree slope worked pretty good - very little effort just let it poke along - you could tell cuz if I pushed it the saw laboured a bit and the cut was slower and if it fed itself the revs were high and the sawdust was abundant.

The only other thing I found a real factor was wind direction - made a huge difference being upwind to the dust and exhaust as opposed to down wind - big time :p

What would you say is the weight of your mill - on it's own? Might just weigh my Westford - be interesting.

I like your rails. I just use an aluminium scaffold board - they are stable and light and won't twist at all. Also when out there they make a handy work top or table for setting up and servicing etc. In the bush put something down turn around a few times and be sure it has jumped under a leaf or piece of tree or sawdust and gone - and if it is critical - damn frustrating looking about for it in the heat with flies all over you. Will keep my timber collecting to cooler months in future.

[Ramps]

Good effort Bob :2tsup:

Good to see that it works as well as it looks

I think my first will be a lot simpler ... bit like your first

Talk soon

[BobL]

Have you thought about getting one of those Stihl or Husqvarna helmets with the earmuffs and mesh face shield. That plastic one seems to attract a lot of dust.
They would also match the chaps better:D

Yes I have seen the units you refer to and they look pretty good.

The plastic visor I use in the video looks much worse than it really is and just needs a good clean. I was very glad to have it on when the chunky brass Aux oiler cap hit me full on yesterday. Someone suggested I change it for a plastic one.

When using a CS (not on a mill) I usually use a Triton helmet/muffs/visor, without the cloth shroud and battery pack. The visor is crystal clear and only fogs around the mouth area in cold weather (we don't get too much of that here in WA). I sometimes use the full shroud and battery pack if the timber is dry (ie generates a lot of dust) and it is not too hot.

For straight milling I don't think a helmet is as critical. I am pretty religious about swapping PPE as required no matter what I am doing. ie need to trim off a branch, pop on the Triton helmet etc. Where the CS engine is running continuously for 5+ minutes at a time, I prefer using my Peltor H10 muffs which are amongst the best in the business (significantly better than the muffs on the Triton Helmet). I have tried using the Peltor muffs with goggles but I find goggles a bit too uncomfortable since I also wear glasses.

I also wear gloves with soft palm and finger pads and the main handle on my mills have soft-rubber mountain bike handle bar grips on them. This really helps to keep vibe effects to a minimum.

I like the idea of a mesh face shield especially when it is hot so I might give just the shield a go some time.

Cheers

[BobL]

Thanks Teejay,



Would nylock nuts work better?

I have a few nylocks on my mill but the problem is I put it together and pulled it apart so many times that all the nylocks lost a significant bit of their locking ability. In the end I put brand new nylocks with spring washers on where I could. They all stayed put. The nuts that I lost were either UNFs or Dome nuts that I could not find nylocks for. I used loctite on these but clearly not enough. The bolts that I lost were from the CS exhaust cover.


Great to read the adjuster works fine. I don't mean to be critical but I prefer something with least amount of moving parts possible cuz when you are way out west the most basic is the most reliable.

Sure I understand - horses for courses.


The only other thing I found a real factor was wind direction - made a huge difference being upwind to the dust and exhaust as opposed to down wind - big time :p

Agree 100%. I also don't like milling when there is no wind at all and the exhaust and dust hang around in the vicinity of the mill.



What would you say is the weight of your mill - on it's own? Might just weigh my Westford - be interesting.

It's 13.7 kg which from memory is about the same as the big Grandberg mills. I estimate at least 3 kg of this weight is in the over engineering such as the, all thread height adjustment, locking cams etc, and in the pretty fruit eg brass nuts, the Ally Aux oil tank, etc.

Also keep in mind that BIL
- is designed to cope with blades up to 52" long
- can cut a 20" thick slab
- has a substantial amount of metal in the direct bar bolt mounting mechanism making it very strong. The blade cannot turn and cut the bar clamps - it has only one bar clamp.
- up to 39.5" of width cut from a 42" blade
- is a touch more difficult to mount the engine to, but the chain can be easily removed without removing the engine from the mill. This is VERY useful.



I like your rails. I just use an aluminium scaffold board - they are stable and light and won't twist at all. Also when out there they make a handy work top or table for setting up and servicing etc. In the bush put something down turn around a few times and be sure it has jumped under a leaf or piece of tree or sawdust and gone - and if it is critical - damn frustrating looking about for it in the heat with flies all over you. Will keep my timber collecting to cooler months in future.

All Good points, I also looked at using an Ally scaffold board but new they are a bit too exy for me so am keeping my eye out for any second hand ones. The BIL mill has 3 brass feet so if I do have to place it on the ground the blade/chain don't sit in the dirt. I also generally take a pair of low and medium saw horses with me when I'm milling and set one pair up as a table to be able to attend to the mill as required.

Cheers

[Big Shed]

Yes I have seen the units you refer to and they look pretty good.

The plastic visor I use in the video looks much worse than it really is and just needs a good clean. I was very glad to have it on when the chunky brass Aux oiler cap hit me full on yesterday. Someone suggested I change it for a plastic one.

When using a CS (not on a mill) I usually use a Triton helmet/muffs/visor, without the cloth shroud and battery pack. The visor is crystal clear and only fogs around the mouth area in cold weather (we don't get too much of that here in WA). I sometimes use the full shroud and battery pack if the timber is dry (ie generates a lot of dust) and it is not too hot.

For straight milling I don't think a helmet is as critical. I am pretty religious about swapping PPE as required no matter what I am doing. ie need to trim off a branch, pop on the Triton helmet etc. Where the CS engine is running continuously for 5+ minutes at a time, I prefer using my Peltor H10 muffs which are amongst the best in the business (significantly better than the muffs on the Triton Helmet). I have tried using the Peltor muffs with goggles but I find goggles a bit too uncomfortable since I also wear glasses.

I also wear gloves with soft palm and finger pads and the main handle on my mills have soft-rubber mountain bike handle bar grips on them. This really helps to keep vibe effects to a minimum.

I like the idea of a mesh face shield especially when it is hot so I might give just the shield a go some time.

Cheers


Bob, I have the Husqvarna helmet/muffs/mesh shield combination, as well as the Triton helmet/respirator.

For outside use with the chainsaw I much prefer the helmet/muffs/mesh combination, it is surprising how strong the mesh shield is. At one stage had a branch kick up and hit it and it didn't even dent!
The mesh shield is also very easy to flip up if required and visibility with it down is extremely good. Think I paid $75 for mine.

[BobL]

Not much time for milling today, chores to attend to and spent about an hour rebuilding the rails to suit a a longer log.

Nevertheless managed to get to BILs work and here is what was on today's menu
A 7ft long, ~18" diameter Western Australian Sheoak (Casuarina Fraserana)
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=53920&stc=1&d=1188035520
Here was what removing the first 2" showed.
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=53921&stc=1&d=1188035520

Unfortunately the top third has a fungal dry rot - bummer! The rest is OK.

You can get an idea of the coarseness of the cutting by this shot.
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=53923&stc=1&d=1188035520

Second cut - in this shot you can also see the partially extended rails (~10ft long)

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=53922&stc=1&d=1188035520

More pics in the next post.

[BobL]

Here are a few shots of the slabs with water squirted on top.
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=53924&stc=1&d=1188035985

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=53925&stc=1&d=1188035985

Close up of grain.
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=53926&stc=1&d=1188035985

The full set:
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=53927&stc=1&d=1188035985

Next weeks menu.
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=53928&stc=1&d=1188035985

So how did BIL mill perform today?
- No bolts or nuts fell off
- The Aux oiler she'sa working good - one way breather valve has a wee leak.
Setting aside the "knife through hot butter" cutting of the dry rot section, the freshly sharpened chain when through the good part of this relatively hard hardwood ver yeasily probably because it was only 18" in diameter.

Are we having fun yet - YOU BETTCHA!

Sorry no video's, BIL was not around - my camera doesn't do movies and no one was around to take 'em anyway.

[DJ’s Timber]

Great result Bob:2tsup:

Grain in the sheoak looks great and next weeks log looks to be a good test. What is it?

[BobL]

Great result Bob:2tsup:

Grain in the sheoak looks great and next weeks log looks to be a good test. What is it?

Err . . . I was told and am embarassed to say I've forgotten - some sort of gum.

[Wild Dingo]

Bob... pics as per pm... couldnt figure out how to post one in the pm and couldnt be bothered uploading to imagestation or shutterfly dialups bloody slow as today... so thought Id just whack some here

First gives you an idea of the layout... as I said come down drive 3 straight in no probs
Second the area you have... can you bring a semi load of sheoak and that big buggar and drop it off? cheers mate :;
Third... is looking at the pile from the back door of the house
Fourth... is the main stack with the large one at the bottom the pine
Fifth... the ends of the second stack1

Reckon we can do this? :2tsup:

[Wild Dingo]

oh and some of the sleepers I will try to sort for gluts

feel like ol steptoe an son here just now... crap everywhere!! the inlaws offloading something like 100 years of accumulated crap and whatevers as they move to a new home after getting rid of the family home... "oh Shane? theres a stack of gear here if you want it just bits of rubbish old stainless steel sleepers bits of old jarrah an old boat you know junk we are just going to tip" sigh never being one to miss a bargain Im there in a flash! :U So the area INSIDE and around the shed is a hodgepodge of whatevers I will have to go through an sort :2tsup:

[BobL]

oh and some of the sleepers I will try to sort for gluts

feel like ol steptoe an son here just now. , ,

Know how ya feel. Site looks good Shane. Post some more when you drag some of the logs clear so we can see them more clearly.
Cheers

[Wild Dingo]

No worries Bob... give me a few though still moving half the family around and relocating most of their accumulated crap an gunk to the side of the shed... so if the weather decides to stop phissin down I will get them sorted hopefully over the next couple of weeks :2tsup:

[BobL]

I made a few mods during the last week and thought you might like to see some pics of them.

Aux oiler:
After milling 3 logs and tightening and retightening various nuts and bolts the only things that was not staying tight on the BIL mill were the brass plumbing connections on the aux oiler. The bit that seemed to shake loose the quickest was the brass tap connection to the underside of the tank. One of the reasons is the tank ally is only 4 mm thick so there's not much thread for the 1/4" BSP fittings to grab and I'm concerned about stripping the thread if I really tighten it. A similar problem exists at the opening at the top of the tank. So, to get around this I got BIL to weld an ally pipe stub at each opening into which I could tap a longer thread.
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=55010&stc=1&d=1189116790

While I was at it I wanted an easier way than using standard screw type hose clamps to attach the oil line to to the CS blade since that needs to be regularly removed for maintenance purposes. I wanted something that I could remove easily and quickly with a spanner so I changed the clear PVC tubing oil line for an old chrome plated steel covered shower hose that uses standard 1/2" BSP tap fittings so some adaptation of the plumbing was needed. The hose can now be removed with a couple of turns of the hose end with a spanner.
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=55011&stc=1&d=1189116790

I also changed the bar connection to this elbow setup.
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=55012&stc=1&d=1189117272

Latest addition is an outboard throttle.
Here is the inboard part.
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=55008&stc=1&d=1189116790

And here is the outboard part.
http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=55009&stc=1&d=1189116790

You can still work the regular throttle by hand/finger which is useful when starting because I like to stand over to the side when starting off. once the bar is buried into the log I stand up against the log. The outboard throttle is surprisingly responsive given the number of linkages involved, I would have thought there would be more of a lag.Having the throttle in the middle of the middle allows one to hold the CS wrap bar with the left hand and the centre handle/throttle with the right means ones arms are not quite so spread out so it should be less tiring over the day.

Tomorrow I'll give it a real test milling so I'll see how well it actually holds together over a day's work.
Cheers

[weisyboy]

dose your saw have the safter triger (on top of the handle) that stops the trigger being pulled if the handl is not held firmly:?

if so how did you overcome this with the outdoard trigger:?

[BobL]

dose your saw have the safter triger (on top of the handle) that stops the trigger being pulled if the handl is not held firmly:?

if so how did you overcome this with the outdoard trigger:?

Yes it does have a safety trigger. With the 076 if you hold the safety trigger down and pull on the throttle a couple of mm, at this point you can then release the pressure on the safety trigger and the throttle keeps working until you release the throttle all the way which is when the safety trigger kicks in again and locks the trottle

To stop the safety trigger interfering, when I adjust the cable length for the outboard trigger I make sure the cable is already tight enough so the lever in contact with the trigger has pushed the trigger past the point where the safety trigger is still active. At this point the engine is still idling but the throttle is literally poised for takeoff!

Another way around this is to strap something like a beefy cable tie around the handle that you can slide up and down the handle to hold the safety trigger down for as long as you like.

Cheers

[Ramps]

Weisy have you been out for Friday night drinks?

Bob I know this was well beyond a "mill" before but now I think it officially goes in to the category of "a work of art"

I'll have to swing by and have a demo some day ... or I can line up a couple of logs that you can "test" it on down this way ... maybe some more sheoak to temp you

[BobL]

Bob I know this was well beyond a "mill" before but now I think it officially goes in to the category of "a work of art"

Cheers Ramps!
It's getting a few dings and scratches so it's got more of a working horse look about it now.


I'll have to swing by and have a demo some day ...
Anytime - just give us a call.


or I can line up a couple of logs that you can "test" it on down this way ... maybe some more sheoak to temp you.

RE: Sheoaks: Bring em on!

[DJ’s Timber]

Looks great Bob, I like the solution of using the 1/2" plumbing fittings to get around the hose clamps

[BobL]

BIL got a good workout today.

I used 4.5 litres of fuel, nearly the same of bar&chain lube, cut 8 slabs and generated 120 kgs of sawdust - boy that feels good :) :D :p - sanity restored , well at least till next week :D

For all the grimy details with heaps of pics and 2 movies check this (http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?p=755210&posted=1#post755210) out.

Cheers

[bobsreturn2003]

lovely job ,interested to know how it goes when you are milling . try and cut along the grain [its easier]in stead of square to the end,if you can . good cutting bob

[BobL]

lovely job ,interested to know how it goes when you are milling . try and cut along the grain [its easier]in stead of square to the end,if you can . good cutting bob

Thanks. Yeah, I've done some "along the grain cutting", great swathes of curly whirly sawdust. One is of course limited by the length of the bar in that case.

Cheers

[BobL]

A week or so back I was rummaging through some milling off-cuts that had ended up on the firewood pile and I noticed a badly warped face cut from a Liquid Amber, which was the first log I milled with the BIL Mill. Anyway it looked pretty warped and bent so I cut a bit off and tested it with my moisture tested and it said 15% I threw it in the van and it kept calling me saying it wanted to be a tray so here it is.

http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/attachment.php?attachmentid=62822&stc=1&d=1198064908

The sides are sheoak - milled with my small mill earlier this year. I going to give it as an Xmas gift to my sister (BIL's wife) for putting up with me dropping around all the time to drink beer and chew'n the fat on mills with BIL.

[DJ’s Timber]

Nice one Bob, I am sure the sis will be most impressed with that :2tsup:

[cossi]

it looks great bob turned out really well i'm sure she will love it!:2tsup: i'm glad i'm not the only one that rumages through the firewood pile with excitment! :D