Help needed with natural edge bowl.

[thefixer]

G'day all

I'm hoping someone out there in woody world can help me with this quandary I seem to have gotten myself into. This bowl is causing me much consternation but I feel it will be worth the effort to get it finished.

Q. Is the wall thin enough? I don't want to leave it too chunky and unfiished looking, but then again I don't wish to lose the natural edge look.
Any advice and opinions appreciated.

Q. What is the best method of sanding it. I have tried ( with much clenching of the bum cheeks) to just sand it on the lathe but there are two problems here. 1: It keeps trying to break my fingers and 2: it is as hard as diamond. 120 grit paper just puts a shine on it and doesn't go anywhere near removing the tool marks. Should I get a power sander? I have never used one yet.

Q. If by some miracle I do manage to get it sanded to my satisfaction what finish should I use? Up til now all I have ever used is friction polishes. I.E. Our sponsors magnificent products such as s**t hot wax sticks and shellawax glo. But I don't reckon this would be the appropriate finish in this case.

Any advice, criticism and opinions will be taken on board.

Cheers
Shorty

[artme]

:o:oWow. A VC is in order for that effort.:2tsup:

If you are still game I would make the wall thinner using VERY sharp tools and a light touch.
You might lokk at sanding with A Vermec bowl sander or something similar.
Wouldn't go past present products as a finish. Stick to products that give lustre rather than gloss, Application will be your biggest problem. It will probably pay to have it sprayed if you are not confident to go ahead any other way.

[tea lady]

Look at those worm holes.:oo: Looks good as is, but would also look good thinner I'm sure. What sort of wood is it? Shella wax glow would be easier to apply than wax stix wouldn't it? Doesn't need as much rubbing in. But maybe the worm holes could be filled with epoxy or something. Might lose a cherry tomatoe down there.:rolleyes::D No suggestions for sanding though, Maybe a bigger bit of sandpaper. :shrug:

[orraloon]

A bit thinner would look good but you may not get away with it so I would just leave it as is. As for sanding a small sanding pad in a hand held drill with the lathe on slow speed. That looks like it would eat knuckles. Finish with a hand sand and the lathe stopped. An oil finish would be the easiest. Will be a good looking piece.
Regards
John

[thefixer]

Here's a better pic of those worm holes from the outside. I would prefer not to fill them at all. That is why I don't want to use a wax type finish. Maybe danish oil or something similar. Your thoughts please anyone.

Cheers
Shorty

[TTIT]

It can't see any cracks in it in your pictures Shorty so it should be strong enough to go thinner (which I reckon it needs). Just the grub holes on their own won't make it dangerous to turn.
Power sand it for sure - with so many holes, hand sanding will just end up rounding one side of each hole etc.
Oil finish is your best bet - easy to apply and I reckon any sort of gloss would look SO wrong on that.
Just where I would go with it - now back to my cupboard :B

[Jim Carroll]

Go thinner at the moment it is still a chunk of wood 5-6mm would be a nice wall thickness.

You can use the rotary sander for most of the bowl but may need to do some of the outer parts with a power sander. This helps stop getting rapped finger.
http://www.cws.au.com/persistent/catalogue_images/products/sandloose2.jpg (http://www.cws.au.com/cgi/index.cgi/shopfront/view_product_details?category_id=1107144919&product_id=1107452087)http://www.cws.au.com/persistent/catalogue_images/categories/sandingpads.gif

Finish of with a danish oil to bring out any color and feature in the timber.

You always have to challange the timber to get the best results out of it, keep away from chunks of wood. Not a good look.

The holes in the side will give you a good indication of an even wall thickness.

[Chumley]

Please excuse a silly question, but when you talk about a 'power sander' in the context of sanding a bowl on a lathe, what kind of sander are you talking about?

Also should you use this power sander with the lathe spinning or not?

Confused (and a bit new to turning),
Adam

[Jim Carroll]

If you look at the post above you will see 2 types of sanders

The one on the left is the rotary sander which uses the speed of the lathe to rotate the head.

The other picture shows 3 different power sanding heads 30mm 50mm & 75mm.
These are powered by a cordless drill, power drill or right angle drill.

Usually used with the lathe stopped but I have seen guys use them with the lathe running and generating a lot of dust.

Ideal with shapes like this with the lathe stopped and you are able to focus on the one area.

Helps to stop the knuckles getting rapped.

[barnsey]

Believe you have to go thinner - Thats hard I know coz you are going to have those cheeks clamped tight for a bit longer hoping it doesn't break.

Go to your smallest bowl gouge and keep it sharp. I sometimes leave the grinder running next to the lathe so I can do it easily. You need gentle hands and light cuts just to get it right. The sharp tools and gentleness will reduce the amount of tool marks. Then you might use a rounded bowl scraper to finish it even finer - must be sharp!! You will feel it come off it's edge and notice a change in the shavings.

Patience & persistence.

I swear by rotary sanders as Jim mentioned, not a big fan of power sanding least of all with the lathe stopped. Much too hard to keep all the shape as it should be. Good quality 80 grit is all you use till your tool marks are gone. Keep the pressure light - too hard and you will distort the hole areas. Short cutting only makes you go back to the 80. Good quality because its harder than a rampant. Again Jim's rotary and discs are as good as you'll get.

Great job by the way, nice stock selection - what is it?

And yes I've wound up with a fine piece in multiple bits on more occasions than I care to remember (fills the barb-b fuel box!!) but like you I prefer to leave the holes, knots etc there. Gives character to the piece - if you are silly enough to put cherry tomatoes in what is obviously a decorative or at best a fruit bowl then that is your decision.

Whatever finish you use must be liquid. I love shellawax (all payments to be made to my address on the detail page) but to my mind in general the finish needs to match the style of the piece. The finer, the shinier - more chunky, a duller one. See where you end up. All other previous suggestions apply as to what that might be. I have used a rotary dremel to just clean holes where the finish might have accumulated - one of the felt ones or a brass one very lightly if I think the felt will molt!! SWMBO's cotton buds sometimes too.

Good Luck - Many Happy Turns

Jamie

[rsser]

Yup.

Power sanding for sure then an oil finish.

+1 to going (much) thinner. A few wraps of duct tape around the outside will give you some insurance but I don't think you'll need it.

Added: Jim and I must hang out in very different circles ... power sanding with bowl spinning was what I was taught. Just don't have your drill or bowl running fast since the paper just skips over the surface and generates too much heat.

For the nat edge part of the sanding, try Cliff's idea of paper on the back of a thong. You're looking not to round over the nat edge facets.

[Calm]

I did a burl bowl very similar with holes, uneven edge etc and found power sanding with cordless drill and 50mm sanding pad with the lathe running was very succesful.

Be careful to have the leading edge of the sanding pad higher than the back to ensure no catches. Keeps the heart pumping but after some time it doesnt seem that bad. I would run the lathe at about 500 - 600 rpm and the cordless drill flat out.

Good luck and cant wait to see the result.

Like Jim i think it needs to be thinner as well.

Hope that helps

Cheers

[thefixer]

G'day all

First off I'd like to thank everyone for their helpful advice on this most difficult project. As you can see from the pics I managed to turn it a lot thinner (down to 5 mm).
Thanks Ern for the trick on using duct tape around the outside. As you said, probably didn't need it but it made me feel more comfortable.
Barnsey, I ended up using a home made bedan type tool which has a plate over the top of the cutter so I can adjust the depth of cut. I set this to about half a mm and kept it very sharp. Got a nice smooth even finish on the inside and not much sanding required.(yeah right) As to the type of timber, dunno, found it my brother in laws firewood pile.
Jim, I ended up sanding the inside by hand with the the lathe motionless. It has only taken 5 hours so far just to get down 400 grit so as soon as I get the OK from the minister for fun, recreation and finances I will take trip down to Drysedale and see about getting a power sander.
Anyway, thanks again all and here are the progress pics so far. Will add the rest when sanding and finishing are complete.

Cheers
Shorty

[Terry B]

Looking very nice.:2tsup:

[artme]

Now that's looking like it will be something special.:2tsup::2tsup:

[Jim Carroll]

That does look better.

Do you think you could have gone thinner or was the heart rate up too high.

5 hours for sanding,:oo: must have been a quiet day.

[thefixer]

That does look better.

Do you think you could have gone thinner or was the heart rate up too high.

5 hours for sanding,:oo: must have been a quiet day.

More than thin enough for for my nervous system:C I guess 15 years as an automotive spray painter taught me the patience to sand for long periods. It was not out of the ordinary in the days acryllic paint to spend a full 8 hour day sanding back a resprayed car with 1200 wet and dry.:~

Cheers
Shorty

[wheelinround]

More than thin enough for for my nervous system:C I guess 15 years as an automotive spray painter taught me the patience to sand for long periods. It was not out of the ordinary in the days acryllic paint to spend a full 8 hour day sanding back a resprayed car with 1200 wet and dry.:~

Cheers
Shorty

Spending 8 hrs is that all try doing it to a bus or coach then complain 3 to 4 days thank goodness this was for only one pedantic owner with a fleet of 8 :~

[HazzaB]

Hey Shorty,

Great looking Bowl, I love that sort of thing, Really sharp tool on the final cut and a bit of hand sanding and it will be the best, what is it going to used as?? fruit bowl just oil finish, Show off piece Satin finish poly I reckon.

Great Job, I'm jealous I can't get lumps like that.

HazzaB

[thefixer]

Hey Shorty,

Great looking Bowl, I love that sort of thing, Really sharp tool on the final cut and a bit of hand sanding and it will be the best, what is it going to used as?? fruit bowl just oil finish, Show off piece Satin finish poly I reckon.

Great Job, I'm jealous I can't get lumps like that.

HazzaB

I thought I might donate it to the local church. They could use it for their holey water:D

Sorry, couldn't resist it:oo:

Cheers
Shorty

[ficfac]

Ha ha nice joke, and nicer bowl. Top stuff!:2tsup: