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robhosailor
13th August 2008, 07:56 AM
Howdy Boatmik and All !!!

Sorry for OFF TOPIC than this boat are not designed by Boatmik! Whenever it would be interresting for you I think so.

Two weeks ago we (my friend Janusz Ostrowski and me)
have finished our short (125 Nm) proa Baltic trip.
There is a short summary of this trip (in Polish):

http://www.kulinski.gdanskmarinecenter.com/art.php?id=870&st=0&fload=1

and there is a link to this site automatically translated by google:

http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.kulinski.gdanskmarinecenter.com%2Fart.php%3Fid%3D870%26st%3D0%26fload%3D1&hl=en&ie=UTF8&sl=pl&tl=en

This is not perfect English ;-))) This is for photos!!!

http://www.kulinski.gdanskmarinecenter.com/k_admin/userfiles/Image/PJOAzalogant.jpg



This proa (classic shunting proa*) PJOA was designed and build (modelled
on old photos and drawings of historic Polinesian proas from books and
museums) by my friend Janusz Ostrowski. Vaka (hull - 6.8 m LOA, weight
ca. 75 kg) was build from 4 mm plywood and pine timbers and glassed with
epoxy (tiny layers). Aka (platform) was made from few aluminium tubes
and few pine lumbers lashed together. Ama (float outrigger) was build
from 4 mm plywood and few pine timbers. Vaka, aka and ama are lashed
together before cruise (deassembled for trailer). Crab claw sail (16.5
sqm) is made from polytarp. This proa was designed for wind Force 5
maximum! The best wind for it is Force 2-4. This proa was designed not
for sea cruising - she was designed and build as a model for study of
crab claw sail only!!! She is perfect - in my opinion!

http://www.kulinski.gdanskmarinecenter.com/k_admin/userfiles/Image/PJOAspeed.jpg

Comfort? Our cruises were for few (4-5) hours per day - it was enough
for us. Especially for windy days. 10 knots (and more) of speed of tiny
multihull
are wet and to cold ...on Latitude over 50. :-)

Janusz consider new design of his proa - for more seaworthness and more
comfort for crew.

http://www.kulinski.gdanskmarinecenter.com/k_admin/userfiles/Image/PJOAmapaq.JPG

Short summary from Janusz about our trip is below:

"This year we wanted to close the trip along sandy shores of Polish
Baltic coast, started in 2006 and was suspended last year near
Gdańsk (known for Solidarity struggle:)

July 19 - we drove to the YachtClub "Neptun" in Górki Zachodnie
(number 1 on the map) and lashed together ama, aka and vaka to one
piece: proa PJOA.

July 20 - few hours of training for new crew (Robert Hoffman) on 2
miles of Vistula estuary called Wisła Śmiała. Windfroce 4B. We left
also behind wavebreakers once Robert get used to shunting. There was
some rush in nearby marina due to the unconventional vessel
passing at high speed there and backwards. It was good piece of PR
job.

July 21 - Górki Zachodnie(1) to Sopot (3) (a beach near the pier),
there was wind 2-3 B and storm clouds building over the shore.
According to the forecast, clouds were expected to stay above land
so we decided to take short route NW more in the sea. Suddenly, when
we were in (2), the cumulonimbus behind us decided to leave the land
and the one in front of us seemed to do the same.
Pushing under thunderstorm wasn't reasonable to both of us so we've
changed plans :), turned toward the beach few miles SW and landed
near the pier, at the nice beach restaurant. It was good place for
hot meal and shelter from the wind for the tent, where we've spent
the night. Weather was not stable enough to continue this day.

July 22 - Sopot(3) to Kuznica (6), we started in 2B of wind making
nice 4 knots. Quite an effort was planned to get to NW part of the
Harbour as wind was expected to die in 3 hours.
It has happened so in point (4). Fortunately wind came from other
direction together with sun and quickly grown to force 4B. After few
tacks (5) we've got warm welcome from vahina's who expected us in
Kuznica.

July 23 - Kuznica(6) to Chalupy(7) and back to Kuznica(6) - due
to "promised" wind force 6B we resigned from regular microcrusing
this day and arranged short social trip for our friends instead.
Under close cover of Hel Peninsula, in force 4 B it became nice
sunny resting day, before what was to come.

July 24 - Kuznica (6) to Swarzewo (8), we started at noon, beam
reaching in force 3B then 4B and after one hour of wet sailing (in
19 deg Celsius) we stopped to get warmed in Swarzewo(8). It took us
1.5 hr and two hot teas:) to decide to continue. This time we've put
on some serious clothes, so next 3.5 hours we covered whole distance
from Swarzewo(8) to our base in Yacht Club " Neptun"(1). Sailing on
beam reach, reaching, sometimes running on nicely built waves was an
exciting experience. Major challenge was riding from crests which in
second part of trip interfered with the other ones coming around
peninsula from open sea. Almost at the end we've met also waves
deflected from huge breakwater of Port Północny, together with
windforce 6B, which together thrown plenty of water inside Pjoa (we
have no drainage), so constant bailing was a must. It was happy
sailing reefed "on the cucumber", at average 7 knots speed (max 14
knots) .

July 25 - we've been sailing in estuary of Wisła Smiala and posed
for photos, due to forecast promising "wind up to 6 degrees in the
Beaufort scale", where PJOA, had been desined up to ofrce 5B. ,
calculated on the fly when wind power up to a maximum of 5 B .
Besides, a little rest and some PR rides along zrowded marinas was a
good idea :)

July 26 - (YC "Neptun") to Krynica Morska (11) - Close to the wind,
against force 3 then 4B and quicly buuilding waves we've been
duinfng average 4 knots, so in 5 hours we achieved our target city
and spent night there. Stranding in 1m high shorebrake was not a
problem and completely safe, when arranged carefully. Beautiful
sunny weather. Same time, near place from where we've started this
day the tragedy has happened. Small yacht crashed breakwaters of
Port Polnocny and one of crew died and skipper was wounded.

July 27 - Krynica Morska (11) back to YC "Neptun"(1) ? we've got
some interesting talk in the morning to "beach master" about our
rights to land so close to the city where people are on the
beach? :-) it lasted too long, seemed to be bureaucracy so we've
just sailed away. At the beginning, wind was 2B from behind but
halfway it grown to force 4B, for some time close to the wind in a
beautiful, sunny weather. After about 5 hours our journey this year
has been finished. In YC "Neptun" PJOA was disassembled and loading
on the trailer. By midniht we were back to Warsaw with beautiful
memories (who cares about the traffic ;)."

"Long Story" of our trip (current PDF file with more photos is 3,7 MB - to large for attachement for this forum :no:) will be publish soon there:
http://www.otwieramy-wybrzeze.port21.pl/
At present there are archiv infos and articles about last year and earlier trips and films there are also.

Aloha!

Robert

*) Classic shunting proa with crab claw sail - This is only 1 boat of this kind of boats in Poland and whole Europe!

Boatmik
13th August 2008, 09:39 AM
Howdy Robert,

Glad you put this up here ... it is fantastic!!! Since I heard of what you had done and just how interesting the boat was, I hoped that I could add it to my interesting links thread.

However ... this is MUCH better because you have some extra commentary!

Thanks so much Robert!

Michael

robhosailor
13th August 2008, 10:17 AM
Glad you put this up here ... it is fantastic!!! Since I heard of what you had done and just how interesting the boat was, I hoped that I could add it to my interesting links thread.

However ... this is MUCH better because you have some extra commentary!

Thanks so much Robert!

Michael,

Thank you,
I will be glad to answer for any questions of this trip and this boat (if my English will be good enaugh)

Aloha! :)

Robert

Fair Dink
13th August 2008, 10:45 AM
This is fantastic, Robert

I love all things PROA and you have again proven their ability to sail unlikely open water distances at speeds that amazed Cook and other european explorers with truly minimalist construction.

NASA tests have proven the amazing efficiency of the 'crabclaw rig'

I was just wondering about the traditional sticking point of shunting proas- what steering set-up didf you use- rudder(s), or oar?

Steve.

robhosailor
13th August 2008, 06:37 PM
I love all things PROA and you have again proven their ability to sail unlikely open water distances at speeds that amazed Cook and other european explorers with truly minimalist construction.

NASA tests have proven the amazing efficiency of the 'crabclaw rig'

I was just wondering about the traditional sticking point of shunting proas- what steering set-up didf you use- rudder(s), or oar?

Steve,

It's a magic indeed :;.
On most of courses proa sailing without touching steering oar. She is steered by setting up sail and position of crew and helmsman.
You can see it and shunting there:YouTube - Pjoa robi zwrot... (http://pl.youtube.com/watch?v=EDR2g6Vq4kg&feature=related)

Crabclaw sail is perfect indeed and it's very cheap: crabclaw sail is absolutelly flat and made from polytarp. Janusz was attached many small idicators (pieces of recording tape) on sail surface (both sides of his sail). We observed "sticked" flow of wind on both sides of sail in wide range of angles of attach. In my opinion this kind of sail is better than most of contemporary hi-tech bermudian sails - more efficiency from $.
See it there: http://pl.youtube.com/watch?v=nvtWmQ6FIZI

Disadvantages?
1. Flat platform (aka) - beams made from strait alloy tubes. For future it requairing to change them to bowed (curved) glued wooden beams.
2. This boat was designed as a practical model for study of crabclaw sail (not for sea beachcruising) and she haven't self draining cocpits.

Probably those problems will be eliminate in next design of Janusz's proa.

Speed?
in wind force 1-2 speed of this small proa is 4-5 knots without making waves
in wind force 3-4 speed is circa 7-10 knots and more without tautening muscle on trapeeze crew is sitting on bank of platform.
Max speed of this unconventional boat was 14 knots.

Aloha!!! :)

b.o.a.t.
13th August 2008, 10:04 PM
Thanks for posting this Robert.
You do us much honour in taking the time & trouble to translate for us.
Looks like you had a week to remember.
cheers
AJ

robhosailor
14th August 2008, 06:05 AM
Thanks for posting this Robert.
You do us much honour in taking the time & trouble to translate for us.
Looks like you had a week to remember.

http://www.siz.org.pl/relacje/pjoa3/Pjoa%20na%20Pucyfiku%20v2.3_pliki/image014.jpg
In Sopot (well known site on Polish Baltic Coast) - our tent near nice beach restaurant and pier. Photo by Janusz Ostrowski.

Hi AJ (b.o.a.t.)

I'm waiting for Janusz's translations of my "long story" - "Pjoa on Pucific (and beyond)" /Pjoa na Pucyfiku (i nie tylko)/
"Pucific" :) is a funny name of Bay of Puck (western, protected part of Bay of Gdansk).
This text is just published in Polish there:

http://www.siz.org.pl/relacje/pjoa3/pjoa3.html

http://www.siz.org.pl/relacje/pjoa3/Pjoa%20na%20Pucyfiku%20v2.3_pliki/image021.jpg
In Kuznica (on Hel Peninsula) Fisherman Harbour. Photo by Anna Becher.

Michael (Boatmik) can use "html abracadabra" for embedd photos here (please!) :)
Michael!!! Thank you very much for it!!! :):):) :2tsup:

http://www.siz.org.pl/relacje/pjoa3/Pjoa%20na%20Pucyfiku%20v2.3_pliki/image041.jpg
Bay of Puck near Kuznica (small Fisherman village on Hel Peninsula). Photo by Anna Becher.

Aloha! :):):)

coogzilla
16th August 2008, 12:19 PM
Wonderfull Robert. Thank's
Keith

robhosailor
24th August 2008, 03:24 AM
There are two new movies from our journey (Gorki Zachodnie - Gdansk, July20 2008, author: Leszek Wysiecki) on youtube:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K55yF-RR0SE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xW0rFl6jbNc

The first one is on Wisla Smiala in Gorki Zachodnie with wind increasing to Force 4-5 and flat water.
The second one is only 7 sec on Bay of Gdansk near Gorki Zachodnie in wind Force 4 - waves shaking the camera :-)

Aloha!!!

robhosailor
24th August 2008, 05:06 AM
There is 3rd movie, almost 3 minutes. I'm sheeting and Janusz is a helmsman with paddle.
A paddle stroke is there, some more bodyshifting to alter the course
and passing wake of motorboat :)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CWF64ipSfhg

Aloha !!!

Boatmik
7th December 2008, 08:57 AM
Robert just sent me another pic

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3203/3087134069_a4d207db42.jpg

If you want to see the details of this sophisticated boat the full size pic is here
http://www.flickr.com/photos/boatmik/3087134069/sizes/o/in/set-72157594418886318/

MIK

keyhavenpotter
7th December 2008, 09:54 AM
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=J950B3T2c5g&NR=1

Terrific struggle though the shore break. 6 mins 44 sec.

robhosailor
7th December 2008, 07:47 PM
Terrific struggle though the shore break. 6 mins 44 sec.

It was on July 2006 - Janusz Ostrowski and his crew Krzys Mnich have begun their trip in Miedzyzdroje and they have reached to Ustka. When they was on the beach in Ustka the wind has grown to Force 6 and more. Next morning wind blew Force 5-6 and they decided to move proa PJOA to the Ustka Harbour for loading boat on the trailer for end this period of journey. The movie shows their start from Ustka's beach, knock down and reach to Ustka harbour.

robhosailor
7th December 2008, 08:03 PM
Robert just sent me another pic

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3203/3087134069_a4d207db42.jpg


It was photographed near Port Polnocny (North Harbour) Gdansk on July 21 2008 (the day of start of our trip from Gorki Zachodnie/Gdansk) by Jaromir Rowinski from his yacht. It looks as a calm before the storm - the thunder storm and rain was a moment latter.

MiddleAgesMan
8th December 2008, 04:47 PM
In the groove! (with music!)

YouTube - proa "Pjoa" sailing - Robert's first day

keyhavenpotter
8th December 2008, 07:10 PM
What a great way to start my day - thanks for the posting.

How can such an ancient rig look so space age! And cool.

Brian

robhosailor
8th December 2008, 08:32 PM
In the groove! (with music!)

It was july 20 2008 in Gorki Zachodnie/Gdansk - my first proa training on Wisla Smiala and short legs on Bay of Gdansk near Port Polnocny. Wind Force 3-4 (up to 5 in peaks). Speed circa 10 knots (14 in peaks).

This movie was linked by me previously (but embbed nnot work).

m2c1Iw
8th December 2008, 08:45 PM
What a great way to start my day - thanks for the posting.

How can such an ancient rig look so space age! And cool.

Brian

Brian a sailmakers nightmare. I wonder what the zig zag seam in the middle in for perhaps Robert can fill us in on the finer points of the sails design.

Regards
Mike

robhosailor
8th December 2008, 09:02 PM
Brian a sailmakers nightmare.

That's truth :)

Everybody can do it - sailmakers useless are.
Crab claw sail is quite flat whitout any surplus and professional abracadabra. This sail is made from polytarp :) an it is really cheap and easy.

keyhavenpotter
9th December 2008, 09:03 PM
You could do with explaining to sailors how to make a crab claw rig for their Holopuni 30' sailing canoes

http://www.holopunicanoes.com/oc3s.html

http://www.holopunicanoes.com/tahiti2005/images/Huahine.jpg

Brian

m2c1Iw
9th December 2008, 09:19 PM
That's truth :)

Everybody can do it - sailmakers useless are.
Crab claw sail is quite flat whitout any surplus and professional abracadabra. This sail is made from polytarp :) an it is really cheap and easy.

Wow I thought it was Dacron it is very professional looking in both design and sewing.

Mike