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Ed Reiss
31st August 2008, 12:44 PM
Hi All...

Just out of curiosity (ain't that something that kills cats?), how many of you use some kind of jig to get a good grind on your gouges and scrapers, or do you freehand it?

Whichever way, are you satisfied by the results?

I've been freehanding it for the past 26 years...maybe the grinds ain't pretty but they sure do cut! I am very satisfied doing it this way.

Cheers,
Ed :D

DJ’s Timber
31st August 2008, 01:11 PM
Freehand with or without the toolrest for me

Toasty
31st August 2008, 01:24 PM
Jig, very satisfied.

Gil Jones
31st August 2008, 01:26 PM
I use the Oneway Wolverine system, and the Vari-grind jig for fingernail grinds.
It works well for me, and it is very repeatable.
http://www.oneway.ca/sharpening/grind_jig.htm
http://www.oneway.ca/sharpening/vari-grind.htm

Hickory
31st August 2008, 01:46 PM
Freehand, but by all means, with the toolrest...

derekcohen
31st August 2008, 03:04 PM
Hi Ed

Freehand on a disk sander. 120 grit and you are sharp enough. Touch up on 240 grits and it can shave hair. The high speed is safe with HSS steel.

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a262/Derek50/Sharpening/Honinglathechisel.jpg

If you are getting good results, why change?

Regards from Perth

Derek

Ad de Crom
31st August 2008, 07:30 PM
Ed, freehand grinding of all my tools. I build my own disc grinder and it works for me very well, and more important very safe.

Ad

Skew ChiDAMN!!
31st August 2008, 07:36 PM
Freehand.

I do prefer to use a tool-rest though - purely for the safety factor. There's a lot of distractions around here and having a toolrest gives the tool somewhere to safely slam into besides jamming between the wheel and guard... :-

Also... there are some tools that really need to be jig ground to achieve maximum performance. But those are tools I usually class in the "gimmick" category and haven't bothered buying anyway. :rolleyes:

bowl-basher
31st August 2008, 07:47 PM
:banghead:

I use a TRUGRIND jig mainly for the reason that my freehand is not good enugh........ I dips me lid to you people that can grind a gouge by eye mabey in twenty or so years I might just learn till then its the jig for me
Bowl-Basher

funkychicken
31st August 2008, 08:40 PM
I hardly ever grind my chisels, I just give em a touch up with an oilstone. It saves alot of steel

China
31st August 2008, 10:50 PM
38 years freehand on toolrest, I don't use any type of jig, yes I am satisfied with the result

hughie
31st August 2008, 10:55 PM
freehand, have been meaning to get a tool rest setup....one of these days :U

Ed Reiss
1st September 2008, 12:44 PM
Well now....I'm actually quite surprised that so many are doing it freehand! Thought for sure that the jig users would be in the majority.

I like the idea that Derek and Ad use disk sanders in lieu of grinders...the method seems to work well....might have a go at it. Derek, thanks for posting the pic along with the text.

A Note: my 6 inch grinder ran rough, replaced the wheels, still rough. Took off the right hand wheel completley, now the unit runs smooth...been running that one arm bandit like that for several years!:2tsup:

Cheers,
Ed :D

Cliff Rogers
1st September 2008, 05:11 PM
Jig for my gouges, I can do it free hand but I choose not to.

I also have a sliding guide for my skew.

The scrapers are done on a toolrest set at the required angle.

Toasty
1st September 2008, 07:55 PM
I like the idea that Derek and Ad use disk sanders in lieu of grinders...the method seems to work well....might have a go at it. Derek, thanks for posting the pic along with the text.


Saw this (http://www.robert-sorby.co.uk/proedge.htm) on the back of a UK woodturning magazine recently.


http://www.robert-sorby.co.uk/images/proedge3.jpg

thefixer
1st September 2008, 08:32 PM
Definately freehand. I was taught at a very early age to sharpen drill bits as small as 3mm to almost perfection :rolleyes: so a gouge or scraper is not that difficult for me.

Cheers
Shorty

joe greiner
1st September 2008, 11:24 PM
Freehand, with a little help from a toolrest. Not a very good toolrest, at that. A proper jig is on my "bucket list," but so is viewing the movie.:-:(

Joe

mpax356
2nd September 2008, 01:41 AM
I have been using a Oneway Wolverine system, and the Vari-grind jig since I started turning a little over a year ago. That said, I just attended a two day class with Stuart Batty who is a strong advocate of free hand sharpening. We all learned to free hand and no jigs were used during his class.

He maintains that free hand (using a platform) gives a better grind since you get the same bevel on the front as well as sides. He favors a more traditional grind without the the swept back wings of an Irish grind. Free hand is definitely faster than a jig, but it takes a little practise. I am now committed to that practice. Stuart advocates a 40 degree bevel on all gouges - both spindle and bowl - except for one about 55 degrees for the bottom of a bowl.

I was amazed at how much better my Spindle Roughing Gouge performed with a 40 degree bevel than when I had it at about 50 or 55 degrees as many recommend Putting 40 degrees on all of your gouges makes it easier to have a more consistent cut. No matter which gouge you pick up you position it the same way to the wood making it easier to shift from one gouge to another.

RETIRED
2nd September 2008, 08:02 AM
Definately freehand. I was taught at a very early age to sharpen drill bits as small as 3mm to almost perfection :rolleyes: so a gouge or scraper is not that difficult for me.

Cheers
ShortySame here.

oldiephred
2nd September 2008, 09:10 AM
I believe in the age old adage , If it ain't broke don't fix it. I don't use a jig and it works fine for me but those who use them would not consider going without and it works for them. The only thing that bothers me is those who try to change others over to their method but won't try a new one themselves.

Hickory
2nd September 2008, 12:14 PM
I believe in the age old adage , If it ain't broke don't fix it. I don't use a jig and it works fine for me but those who use them would not consider going without and it works for them. The only thing that bothers me is those who try to change others over to their method but won't try a new one themselves.

that pretty much sparkles what I fill. I does good at what I does.... Ain't no need to fix it... But, a while back.... I have alwayed honed my plane irons by hand, I can feel the bevel under my finger tips and I can stroke a good edge, but I saw one on sale and got it (A honing guage with little rollers and adjusting screws and the like) Man, what a difference.... I can still hone by hand but why bother... quick and easy...

As for Sharpening jigs, I guess they may be easier to accomplish than years of not so perfect angles till you get it right, but where is the skill level is everything is perfect?

hughie
2nd September 2008, 12:41 PM
Hmm, I have been sharpening for years by hand all manner of edges including drill bits. Itty bitty ones at that.

But I find a steady of some sort to assist with the angle is a good idea. I watched Ern at the Turn-a-Thon just quickly touch up the edge on his gouge and it struck me as a damn fine idea. Not doing this for a living, means I grind occasionally, so the skill/time level is not as high.

Time being the only resource I have that can not renew or extend. :U Less grinding ......more time for turning etc

rsser
2nd September 2008, 06:32 PM
The question really is freehand or jig for what application? No?

Freehand on a platform for scrapers, skews, straight grinds for bowl or spindle gouges ain't hard.

But I'd defy anyone 'cept an expert to freehand a bowl gouge with an Irish or Ellsworth grind - damn things near defeat me with a jig :-.

Ed Reiss
3rd September 2008, 01:24 AM
A pat on the back for you guys that sharpen your drill bits freehand...never could get the hang of that!:2tsup:

Invested in a "Drill Doctor" for sharpening the "tons" of bits aquired over the years (but was too cheap to throw them away when they got dull).

Cheers,

Ed :D

OGYT
3rd September 2008, 04:48 AM
Wolverine system for consistency in my bowl gouge grinds. Everything else is sharpened on the converted belt sander (like Toasty's post). It works extremely well for skews, wood chisels, spindle gouges and the like. Very satisfied.

wheelinround
3rd September 2008, 06:04 PM
I have always like a few others done mine freehand small drills down to 1/8 and few smaller those often get replaced rather than sharpened.

Until recently when I saw a jig used :roll: oh how simple for gouges especially for keping angles right

I will be possibly making the move to a jig, my hands are not what they used to be :~

Cliff Rogers
3rd September 2008, 06:38 PM
...I will be possibly making the move to a jig, my hands are not what they used to be :~

That & repeatability of a swept back profile are 2 good reasons for a jig.

Alastair
4th September 2008, 06:02 PM
The question really is freehand or jig for what application? No?

Freehand on a platform for scrapers, skews, straight grinds for bowl or spindle gouges ain't hard.

But I'd defy anyone 'cept an expert to freehand a bowl gouge with an Irish or Ellsworth grind - damn things near defeat me with a jig :-.

Pretty much what Ern does. Scrapers, parting and sizing, skews semi freehand on an expanded toolrest.

Spindle, roughing and bowl on a homemade copy of the unijig. Using setting templates, I can take a tool to grinder in~60 sec the first time, (or different tool).

Returning same tool to grinder, probably 60sec to return to jig, grind, and back to lathe.

In between grinds, quick hone with slipstone from time to time.

Hand tools, use a single roller honing guide for plane and chisel blades, if Im serious. If just hacking with a chsel, will just freehand on a basic oilstone.

Robomanic
7th September 2008, 12:20 AM
I am another that started sharpening drill bits in the begining. I started getting into jigs for keeping up the consistancy on my grinds but having one grinder for plane blades, drills, carpentry, carving and turning chisels defied any jig I was willing to spend money on.

I recomend getting into it freehand, your fingers will learn to control the angles and a quick touch up on the grinder will leave you more time to concentrate on flowing curves.

Can someone tell me more about the 'irish' and other grinds mentioned here. I have put a fingernail grind on my gauges since early days but had not heard of many others before now. Will post pictures if that helps...

Cheers.

Ed Reiss
7th September 2008, 12:46 AM
Robomaniac....

The "Irish" grind takes advantage of the gouge sides as well as the tip. Here is a quote from Craftsupplies:

Artisan Irish Grind Bowl Gouge
The non traditional "swept-back" grind found on these gouges was devised and refined by various professional turners in Ireland and Scotland. Very popular among intermediate and advanced level turners, these gouges are guaranteed to quickly remove large quantities while leaving a smooth finish.

The "Ellsworth Grind" (variation on the irish) is even more drastically swept back.

Hope this helps.

Cheers,

Ed :D

Robomanic
7th September 2008, 11:04 AM
Thanks Ed,

Definitely agree about higher depth of cut. The other advantage I like is that you actually have a longer cutting edge so you can use the full edge and cut for longer between sharpening.

Mine are shown below. Not as far swept back as the Irish example so I might do a bit more experimenting and see what I like on the next hollowing job.

In support of using guides, they will make sure that the grind is symmetrical and that will help things feel balanced when using a left or right hand grip at the lathe.