Saw Buck for cutting logs into turning blanks

[Cliff Rogers]

I built this a while ago & I though I had posted some pics but I can't find them so I'll start a new thread.

One sheet of 12mm (1/2") ply ripped down the middle & across the halves to make 8 equal (roughly) 600mm (2') squares.

One piece is the top (or bottom if you must)
6 pieces become the 'legs' with a triangle cut out at 200mm (8") in from each edge & down the centre line.

The last square is cut into 5 strips for the spacers, I made the middle one wider.
You work out the dimensions for yourself & don't forget to subtract the thickness of the ply.

I put mine together with 12 x 600mm (2') 20mm (3/4") cleats glued & bradded.
You have to build from the centre out so you can get the nails (or screws) in.
I used very fine brads & just enough to hold it while the glue set so I don't have to worry about bugg'rin up a chain if I happen to hit one.

The whole thing has 2 x 610mm (2'1/2") pieces of threaded rod & 24 nuts & washers clamping it together for extra strength.

I slapped a couple of coats of undercoat on it but is has had heaps of use & could use another couple of coats now.

It also doubles as a saw maintenance table on the job. IE, adjustments, fuel, oil, chain replace or sharpen etc.

[Brendan1152]

Hi Cliff,

Good one, :2tsup: quick and easy to build from the look of it - will get some ply tomorrow and knock one up so I can start on the timber - of course I should have thought of all these things before getting the timber :-

Regards

Brendan

[Cliff Rogers]

When you get the ply, don't forget to get the cleat material, it is actually 7.2M total.
I used 3 x 2.4M lengths.

[TTIT]

Bloody good idea Cliff :2tsup: I've been looking for something different and that solves some of the issues I have with more traditional 'bucks' (is that a yank term or what!!!:;)

[Cliff Rogers]

....traditional 'bucks' (is that a yank term or what!!!)

Sure is Buckaroo. :2tsup:

I really don't know what else to call it, :shrug: saw horse & saw table already mean something else.

Saw platform. :think: :no:

Saw stand. :rolleyes: :no:

How about a termite mound? :D

[Cliff Rogers]

I remember where I got the idea from now. :2tsup:

It is called a Sawing Platform for the Chainsaw (http://www.laymar-crafts.co.uk/tip33.htm) by Richard Stapley of LaymarCrafts Wodturning.

[hughie]

nah, never mind the name. It look a good'n to me. :2tsup:

[Ed Reiss]

Good design, Cliff.

Looks like it adds a fair amount of safety to the job of cutting:2tsup:

Cheers,
Ed :D

[dhurrang]

I had made something to do .... sort of ... the same thing. Much better idea than mine Cliff :2tsup: and I'm off to the shed .............................. ahhh any copyright or residuals on that design Cliff :no:

[robutacion]

Hi everybody,

I also agree on Cliff's "chainsaw log stand" Oops, my version of possible name:D, if you like it Cliff, use it:wink:.
Interestingly, I have never seen this stand from Cliff, but I've seen through my working life, various versions of the some principle. They work very well on logs, the strap is a good safety option, but I did found difficult on some preparation blanks, with much damage done to the stand itself (cutting stand everywhere), and impossible to use on smaller and uniformed shapes. This is mostly due to the piece not to be firmly fixed to the stand. I started with one of these stands (different construction materials, same principle), and use it for a long time, but I was not satisfied with the safety aspects and dangerous chainsaw positions to obtain certain cuts. This is what made me think about some other way, better, safer, quicker way to get the logs processed into round/square/other turning blanks, which resulted on the making of the JV Log Vice. There is no doubt, of how important is to have a stand to work your logs, Cliff's, mine and many others built with whatever is available to each one but following the same stand principal in the end. My timber stand frame is now a dedicated firewood small log, branches cutter, and my goodness, how well it works...!:U

The JV Log Vice (steel arms helper - old name), is just something else all together, If I may say so. Not because I got the original idea, which is nice...!:B but the fact is that it is 100% safe, efficient, easy to operate and most importantly, very inexpensive to built/make. I've done mine in one afternoon, and cost me nothing, because I had all the bits necessary. If I was to put a price on the materials necessary to built one, I would say $40 would probably get you some change. Mine was built out of a road sign post, that was bent (damaged), replaced and left on the side of the road (grass).
Cost wise, for someone buying all materials for either one, (timber/MDF/ply frame Vs steel vice), the first one it will cost 3 to 5 times more, and the time necessary to built works pretty much in the same way. I am not very good with welding (actually, terrible), and I've built it in less than 4 hours, I remember well, my timber log frame took me all day (long day) to cut everything and put it all together.:doh::no:.
I can understand why some people is sceptical about accepting and trying this idea (tool), I'm not going there, nor is it necessary but, the reality of it all is that, is just no other tool out there (that I know off) that can assist and facilitate the production of timber turning blanks (any shape) from tree logs as this tool JV Log Vice does.:)

At the time this tools was introduced for the first time here (forum), it did trigger lots of comments and commercial possibilities about the Patent of such innovative idea. What some forgot was that, if I didn't want people to see it or know about it, I wouldn't have done what I done so, and after all this time, if the idea or design was patented or not, is no issue here, I mentioned various times since that anyone that copy and make some for themselves and friends if they so wish. I could have made hundreds and sell them myself, I've made the decision of not to.:?

The truth is, I much more prefer people out there to realise how cheaply they can built one of these, and how much safer and effective they are to work with, compared with the common practises people use to cut timber with a chainsaw. Indeed, and I can prove it at any time to anyone, one of this JV Log Vices and a small petrol/electric chainsaw, is all one needs to cut and prepare any timber log into turning blanks, of any size or shape. This don't mean that other tools shouldn't be used, not at all, but for (particularly but not only), someone starting, this is indeed the most economical and safe way to produce turning blanks (but not only). With some luck and a little work, relying on second hand stuff, one can have a second hand electric chainsaw and the JV Log Vice ready for use for about $50 and that, in anyones language, is a good investment, allowing this savings to go toward the lathe and other tools.
This is not a case of "mine is bigger then yours...!" it would be a mistake to put it in that way, and I'm pretty certain that some forum members have indeed made one up from the very beginning of this issue on this forum (couple of years ago), and never said anything, being concern about Copyrights and similar issues, so if you can read this, please come forward and share your version of the original idea, and tell us what you think of it, I would be very thankful.:roll:

For anyone with an interest in give it a go, all the making info, sizes, etc, has been provided on this forum and should the in the forums archives somewhere, or you can have a look on my web site, for info and pics. I've got hundreds of pics of this JV Log Vice in use, but I've been thinking in produce a small video, just to show how easy, safe and effective this thing is.:o

If you have any questions about it, or want to see some other pics, just let me know.

Take care, be safe.

Cheers:2tsup:
RBTCO

[dai sensei]

Interesting idea Cliff, and yours too RBTCO.

:hijacked:I was actually thinking of a fold-away version similar to RBCTO, but it didn't present a solution to the 3 main cuts I do at home freehand:

Cut end off log - either Cliff's or RBTCO's ideas will do
Cut blank to round - RBTCO's clamp works, Cliff's would work, but high likelihood of damage to the jig.
Rip-cut forks down - Both Cliff & RBTCO jigs would work, but doesn't secure the fork and poses risk to jig. RBTCO's clamp would work, but there is a risk of hitting metal with the chainsaw.

I currently just use other logs to brace, my Triton Superjaws, or my slabbing rig, but there has to be a better way.

Any other ideas guys?

Cheers

[rsser]

Better than a foot on the log :- but I'm slack when it comes to this.

With square bowl blanks I cut them round and that leaves four 'chocks' which I lay out on the grass for chunking logs down with the Husky. They go into the fire when hacked too much.

[joe greiner]

Any other ideas guys?

Cheers

Here ya go, Neil: http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showthread.php?t=47976
Although I admitted there it seemed over-engineered, I've found it very versatile; used it just yesterday and found the adjustability most convenient.

A host of good ideas here. More than one way to skin a cat, eh?

Interesting thing about the terminology, Vern: $10 bills are called "sawbucks" because they once displayed Roman numeral "X" which looks like a real, more primitive perhaps, sawbuck. My dictionary asserts that "buck" for a $1 bill is derived from "buckskin" (from the deer-like critter) which was an early form of currency among native Americans. The coincidence seems too good to be true, but with the English language, you never can tell.

Joe

[Cliff Rogers]

.... Cliff's would work, but high likelihood of damage to the jig....

Rip-cut forks down - Both Cliff & RBTCO jigs would work, but doesn't secure the fork and poses risk to jig. ....
It is a sheet of ply, not a work of art... mine has heaps of dings in it now, gives it character.:D

It actually works like a drum/speaker cone, you know if you hit it with the chain 'cos you can hear it.

I have no problems ripping down forks.
I just drop it in sideways & if it looks like moving, I wedge it with an offcut or 2.
I save heaps of forks for platters 'cos that is where the best features hide. :2tsup:

I'll get some fork ripping demo pics for you in a day or so.

[Cliff Rogers]

OK, heaps more pics.

I didn't have a good fork to demo for you Neil so I just posed a couple of the old ones that were cut a while ago now.

As you can see from the last pic, it is also handy for servicing the saw.

[Cliff Rogers]

Lost of pics demonstrating how I prepare a bowl blank with the saw buck & a chainsaw.

[Alastair]

I remember where I got the idea from now. :2tsup:

It is called a Sawing Platform for the Chainsaw (http://www.laymar-crafts.co.uk/tip33.htm) by Richard Stapley of LaymarCrafts Wodturning.

Reminds me to revisit Richard's site. I have had heaps of great ideas from him over the years.

[Cliff Rogers]

This one is going to be a platter, there is/was heaps of pale sapwood to get rid of & a couple of knots to use as features so I took the back off it first to get a better look at the timber.
Once I had worked out where the good bits were I trimmed it to size.

[Cliff Rogers]

Some more.... this time a couple of tool handles.

[Cliff Rogers]

The blanks that I cut out were then rough turned, pics are in this post (http://www.woodworkforums.com/showpost.php?p=802776&postcount=25).

[robutacion]

Nice pics Cliff,

It does help, when you can see how a tool/jig/frame/vice/saw buck, actually works, or how one does use it, (work it, work it...!:D).

You could nearly make a little video of the whole thing, couldn't you?
I reckon, that would be a neat way to show it in action.
How long does it take you the go from a half log, into a finished round blank (ready for the lathe)? roughly!:?:rolleyes:

I have cut about 30 blanks last week, half pine half olive, and I kept thinking about getting the video camera and record how I use mine, but every time I thought about it, I could see you near impossible would be to find a single position (location) for the tripod, where it would give a good view of all the steps. I came to the conclusion that I would do a much better job buy finding someone that can use the camera and understand where to be at the right time, or some how follow instructions.
If this option fails, then I will do it myself, but I will need to film in lots of different locations/positions and zoom in and out on some aspects for close up view. I know that I will need an hour of recording and a couple of hours to do it in this way, but with lots of cut and past, moving things around with a good editing program, I should be able to end-up with an acceptable 5 minutes demonstration video. I am actually looking forward to be able to put it on film for future references, I really enjoy working with my log vice and make round blanks out of it:D.

I didn't made a video last week but I took some pics, as always, "compulsory procedure step":o:U.
Here it goes,

PS: I would be interested in seen also in action (if possible):D, any other jig or tool made for a similar purpose, but others. Came on..., it should be a few out there, huh?:p:wink:

Cheers:2tsup:
RBTCO

[Frank&Earnest]

No jig to contribute here, sorry, I just went the easy way and bought a bandsaw... Only a comment: for a square section half log, given that it is already symmetrical and does not unbalance the lathe, I am quite happy to just drill a recess for the chuck with a Forstner bit (as Cliff does :wink:), whack it on the lathe initially supporting it with the tailstock and just gouge out the corners. It ensures that there is no unnecessary waste, allows the option of "wings" when the wood is talking and is probably as quick or quicker than rounding the blank beforehand.

That aside, the holding principle of the two methods presented here appears the same but RBTCO's central clamp looks to me more quick and effective than setting and resetting an F clamp. It needs a fixed support, however, while Cliff's jig is portable. The saw horse would appear to be most useful in the log cutting stage.

[Cliff Rogers]

...
How long does it take you the go from a half log, into a finished round blank (ready for the lathe)? roughly!:?:rolleyes:...

The bowl blank was 10 minutes from the first pic to the last & that included taking the pics.
The platter blank was 11 minutes & that included the photos, a refuel & top up the oil & I was going to tighten the chain but I couldn't find the spanner, I must have left it in the other shed.

Also note: I rarely bother with the clamp, I was just showing how it could be done. :D

[Cliff Rogers]

...: for a square section half log, given that it is already symmetrical and does not unbalance the lathe, I am quite happy to just drill a recess for the chuck with a Forstner bit (as Cliff does :wink:), whack it on the lathe initially supporting it with the tailstock and just gouge out the corners. .....

I do this with dryer timber & stuff that doesn't have big thick lumps of bark & other loose stuff that may hit me in the head.

The Silky Oak & the Hoop Pine that I have been roughing out in the last couple of weeks are both very wet & the sap wood & bark are where most of the moisture & projectiles live.

[WOODY70]

Hey Ciff,

That looks like your lathe stand!!!

[dai sensei]

Great pics Cliff :2tsup: thanks.

Great pile of blanks there RBTCO, should keep you going for quite a while.

[Frank&Earnest]

I do this with dryer timber & stuff that doesn't have big thick lumps of bark & other loose stuff that may hit me in the head.

The Silky Oak & the Hoop Pine that I have been roughing out in the last couple of weeks are both very wet & the sap wood & bark are where most of the moisture & projectiles live.

Forgot to say that if the bark is thick I prefer to lever it off with a chisel beforehand. Given though that with this method the turner is located at about 45 degrees towards the tailstock, in my experience the turner is out of the line of fire when pieces fly off. From my observation the angle of the force resulting from the rotating force and the cutting force from this position IMHO is somewhere between 0 and 20 degrees, can some more technically qualified person confirm or deny? (I never wear a face shield when turning wet...:-)

[joe greiner]

Forgot to say that if the bark is thick I prefer to lever it off with a chisel beforehand. Given though that with this method the turner is located at about 45 degrees towards the tailstock, in my experience the turner is out of the line of fire when pieces fly off. From my observation the angle of the force resulting from the rotating force and the cutting force from this position IMHO is somewhere between 0 and 20 degrees, can some more technically qualified person confirm or deny? (I never wear a face shield when turning wet...:-)

I don't think the cutting force direction can, or should, be calculated very precisely, as long as the pieces don't swat you. And there's no point in dulling the gouge by chipping bark, unless you're after a natural edge; so removing it with a hand chisel (and hammer if necessary) seems better to me too. Also makes for more uniform shavings for the garden.

Joe

[Cliff Rogers]

Hey Ciff,

That looks like your lathe stand!!!

Pay attention Dave, I retired that one more than a year ago. :rolleyes:

Cheey bugger. :D

[BazzaDLB]

Hi Cliff,

In one of the previous posts, the timber you are using for tool handles is Silky Oak.

Is this a good timber to use for say lathe tools?

Maybe a silly question seeing as how you said it was for tool handles!!!

[Cliff Rogers]

Grevillea Robusta certainly makes good tool handles.

I have some turning tool handles made of it that are now 16 years old.

They are not too heavy & have very good grip.

[BazzaDLB]

Thanks Cliff,
Have some of that so will give it a go..