Frames and panels

[Mark Woodward]

Hi all,
I'm making a blanket box/chest/come coffee table using frames and panels. I'm hoping someone can help me out.

1. How deep should the groove around the inside of the frame be. I've got a slot cutter that cuts about 12mm into the frame. This looks a bit too deep. Especially where I have to cut both sides of the frame. The middle of both sides ( there's 2 panels on each side), the middle stile? of the frame is about 40mm wide. So cutting 24mm into the centre of this leaves about 16mm! Is that too little?

2. How far should the panel recess into the frame?

3. Should the bit of the panel that fits into the frame taper or can it be flat? I thought I'd just rebate the outside of the panel as I dont own a panel raising bit. But then I thought if the panel was perpendicular to the groove only a whisker smaller, whats to stop the panel dropping into the frame so theres a large gap at the top and none at the bottom? I read somewhere that you can pack the groove with something like cork to stop this. Wouldn't that just sag over time? What about tapping a couple of flat head brads into the bottom of the groove, sitting up as bit, for the panel to sit on?

4. Having just reread these questions, it's basically the in's and out's of frame and panel construction!! http://ubb.ubeaut.com.au/ubb/smile.gif
thanks,
Mark




[This message has been edited by Mark Woodward (edited 05 June 2000).]

[Richard]

Hi Mark !! I remember when I first started to make a few more complex pieces of furniture Frames & Panels were a challenge to learn. Especially the right joinery that would make it last and look good.I am only guessing as to what machinery you have based on your questions but will try to help.
In my humble opinion, panels should always be built into the rails and stiles not just recessed into the rear. It takes a bit more work but the results are much better looking every time.
Are you using solid timber for the panels or thinner ply? If ply, then to raise the panel would show the different layers of timber giving away the fact that it is ply so, leaving them flat might be a good idea. If however they are solid timber a jig can be made (very easy) to use on your table saw that will raise the panels!! Or simply measure - mark - and cut them with your plane. They better be sharp to handle the end grain!!

The slot cutter, I presume is attached to a router? Great ! Use the routers fence to cut your slot approx 6-8mm deep.(The depth of the slot can be preportioned to the size of the panel) The slot cutter will cut a groove about what, 4-6 mm wide? The panel should be approx .5mm +/- thinner than your slot in the rails and stiles with the same as clearence all around. The panel should fit snugly without moving around on its own. (so doors won't chatter when opened & closed or when the piece is moved around.
The middle stile - as long as there is enough material left after slotting to give stability. (Will this piece be movable or will it be locked in with joinery? Short pieces of timber - even softwoods have remarkable strength.)
The edge of the panel which fits into the rails and stile can be either tapered or flat depending on how you want it to look. If you want to simply rebate the edge - then make a wide rebate so that when the panel is inserted (Remember the .5mm clearance) the movement will not show without using a ruler.
Fitting them in this way you should have to use any kind of "fillers" in the slots.
In case you are fitting the panels into the rear of R & S's the same still applies, just lock the panels in with small brads(perpendicular to the panels) so they don't show.
The mag "Fine woodworking" has some good articles on Frame and Panel construction. The library should have a few good books, too! There are probobly specifications for all this possibly stated in percentages or something.

If you should want the plans for my jig, would be glad to email them. Just ask. Hope this has helped. Good Luck!!!
Richard

[Mark Woodward]

Hi Richard,
I forgot to say what I'd be using tool wise. I ended up using a Carbitool 4 wing slot cutter with a bearing and just ran it along the inside of each frame (Dry clamped). I hope the middle stile will be OK ( I think it will!) there's approx. 3cm x 1.5cm of timber ( meranti) still left! It's fixed in between the top and bottom rails so we'll see how it goes http://ubb.ubeaut.com.au/ubb/smile.gif
I intend to rebate the panel edges (probably with the same bit) and leave just a whisker between the frame and the panel. (Probably a mm or just over). In a book I've got ( Gary Rogowsky - Router Joinery) he uses alot of this idea for a subtle, understated look. I tend to like it as well as the shaker idea of turning the panel around! It really reminds me of furniture my grandparents had. I couldn't find any reference to the groove dimensions in the book but guess what, they are there. I found them the other night after attacking the box. He says about 1/2" and mine are 14.5mm (close enough http://ubb.ubeaut.com.au/ubb/smile.gif ).
Thanks for all your help and hope alls well,
Mark