Economic Help Has Arrived

[Ed Reiss]

OK guys...decided to invest in Oz's economic woes, and this will undoubtedly be the turning point to your country's prosperity :2tsup: ....have actually bought one whole jar of EEE and one bottle of Shellawax!!!:U:roll:

...now that we have the important economic news out of the way, does anyone have a tip or two to using the products - will be using on bowls primarily and am planning to do a vessel using walnut first.

Tnx

[Pat]

Ed, less is more for these two fine products, especially the EEE (http://www.ubeaut.com.au/eee.htm). Here is the fact sheet for the Shellawax (http://www.ubeaut.com.au/cream.html), again you do not need to flood the piece. Neil does a good job explaining their uses. Next you need to get his book
A Polishers Handbook (http://www.ubeaut.com.au/book.html) - by Neil Ellis as it is very good.

[ElizaLeahy]

I almost got some EEE the other day, but I ran out of money and the dust-be-gone was more urgent at the time.

Let me know what you think of it?

I love the Shellawax and the Glow.

[artme]

Ed, just follow Neil's instructions to the letter.

I always use a cotton cloth (only ), I get plenty of heat into the act via friction, and leave for a few hours between coats.

[rsser]

Ed, if you don't get the results you expect, there's a Shellawax problem solving page on the Ubeaut website.

And to add, for bowls I understand that you should be using Shellawax Cream.

[Ed Reiss]

Good suggestions all...will do a lot of reading before trying. Would hate like hell to waste any of that high priced ($$$$$$) product by using it the wrong way.

Thanks guys.

[ElizaLeahy]

Ed, just follow Neil's instructions to the letter.

I always use a cotton cloth (only ), I get plenty of heat into the act via friction, and leave for a few hours between coats.

I only use 600 thread count egyptian cotton.

So far Zoe hasn't noticed that our good sheets are missing!

:D

[rsser]

Cotton flannel is best for the Shellawax.

[tea lady]

I now use white t-shirts as the red one put a red cast on my huon pine lid.:doh:

[joe greiner]

Good suggestions all...will do a lot of reading before trying. Would hate like hell to waste any of that high priced ($$$$$$) product by using it the wrong way.

Thanks guys.
The wrong way sometimes works (t=88995, #10).:D

Cheers,
Joe

[Ed Reiss]

Took some time today to chunk up a piece of sycamore in order to test out the EEE and Shellawax.

Whacked out a simple dowel and sanded to 220, then went straight to the EEE using a flannel cloth...worked great.
Buffed off the excess wax then put on a thin layer of Shellawax (a little bit goes a long way!!)...it took to the sycamore very well, got a nice sheen and the finish feels nice to the touch.

Next piece is going to be the walnut bowl.

[RETIRED]

Sand up to #400 and really knock your socks off.:D

[ElizaLeahy]

I bought a tub too. I have 180, 320, 400 and 600, but I usually leave out either the 180 or the 400.

I like the smell of it too.

[tea lady]

I bought a tub too. I have 180, 320, 400 and 600, but I usually leave out either the 180 or the 400.

I like the smell of it too.works best if you do all the gritsteps. Although I must admit I leave out some if the sandpaper gets lost.

[Skew ChiDAMN!!]

I love the smell of hot Shellawax in the morning. :2tsup:

The problem is the stuff is addictive... it gets to the point where you have tins of other products, such as Danish oil or carnauba wax compounds that may be better suited to the project you're actually turning but are ignored 'cos Shellawax goes on so damned simply, easily and quickly! :-

[Pat]

I second the notice of sanding all the grits. Even for rough stuff I sand to 600 before applying Shellawax. On the outsides of bowls I will also wet done the sanded surface with Sanding sealer and allow to dry, roughly 10 minutes, time to have a drink and pay the shed dogs some attention:U. I so this to raise the "nap", usually at 240 and 400. Sounds anal but to me and MBGitW it works. For the inside of a bowl I'll add another step at at 800 before sanding up to 1500, then attacking with Micromesh to 12000.

Of course having the Rotary sander (http://www.ubeaut.com.au/rotary1.htm) with all the grits (http://www.ubeaut.com.au/disks.htm) and the Micromesh (http://www.thesandpaperman.com.au/) mixed pack helps

[robyn2839]

how much do you guys pay for shellawax and eee around the country? be interesting to know.bob

[Burnsy]

how much do you guys pay for shellawax and eee around the country? be interesting to know.bob

Everyone pays the same if they buy it straight from Neil:2tsup:

[Ed Reiss]

how much do you guys pay for shellawax and eee around the country? be interesting to know.bob

Don't know about other parts of the U.S., but I paid $16.95 each for 250mls of the EEE and the Shellawax. This is probably a hell of a lot more than you guys pay in Australia.:C

Went across the river to MLCS/Penn State Industries showroom just outside Philadelphia to buy the items.

[ElizaLeahy]

I want a rotary sander!

Do I need one? NO!. :)

I want an electric buffing device.

[Ozkaban]

I've used EEE, trad wax, shellawax cream and shellawax glow on different turning. The glow is normally for pens, and the rest of other things I mangle on the lathe.

I use paper towel to apply it and I was always of the opinion that using a cloth made of threads in your hands to apply pressure to a spinning item, you're bound to get it caught sooner or later and your fingers are going to spin at the same 1000rpm as the wood :o, whereas the paper towel would just tear... Or am I being overly cautious?

Love the finish that comes up though. Smells nice, fells nice, nice shine and still feels like wood! Very fast, too!

Another question I have is about multiple coats of shellawax. Artme, you mention that you leave it a few hours between coats. Is there any reason for this? I thought that the shellawax didn't build up separate layers (just one thick one). Would recoating straight away have any impact on the finish?

Cheers,
Dave

[TTIT]

I want a rotary sander!

Do I need one? NO!. :)

I want an electric buffing device.You already have one of each:o - a cotton buffing mop on the end of a piece of rod can be gripped in your standard chuck on the lathe - that's all I've got for buffing and you can do the same for sanding. (I'm at work at the moment but can get pics later if you want them :shrug: )

[artme]

Dave, I don't know what thery says but I always do at least 2 coats. The reason for leaving time between coats is the second coat seems to take better and give the same beautiful lustre. I began doing this after noticing that several pieces I had recoated immediately were a little dull.

[TTIT]

........ you're bound to get it caught sooner or later and your fingers are going to spin at the same 1000rpm as the wood :o, whereas the paper towel would just tear... Or am I being overly cautious?Yes! :shrug: I've been using cloth (old flannie sheets) for years at 3000rpm and never had a snag (yet). If I'm working near jagged or natural edges I use a buff as in the last post.


......Another question I have is about multiple coats of shellawax. Artme, you mention that you leave it a few hours between coats. Is there any reason for this? I thought that the shellawax didn't build up separate layers (just one thick one). Would recoating straight away have any impact on the finish?I've always recoated straight away :shrug:. Occasionally have problems if I go for a 3rd coat - must get too thick and start to lift - or it could have just been the type of timber. Might try leaving it a few hours next time to see if it helps.

[Ozkaban]

I've always recoated straight away :shrug:. Occasionally have problems if I go for a 3rd coat - must get too thick and start to lift - or it could have just been the type of timber. Might try leaving it a few hours next time to see if it helps.

hmm. When doing pens, i've done several coats of shellawax glow back to back (up to 3 or possibly 5 if I'm not happy with it). I have to be careful with it until it cools down or you can muck the finish up pretty badly, but I don;t know if I'm just wasting my time and/or the shellawax...

Time for a bit of experimenting, methinks :D

Cheers,
Dave

[tea lady]

I don't know about multiple coatings. I think less is more. On a bowl today I was having trouble getting rid of a smeary blob and ended up cutting it back with eee to get it smooth. The next one I just put less on and it was great.

[ubeaut]

Don't know about other parts of the U.S., but I paid $16.95 each for 250mls of the EEE and the Shellawax. This is probably a hell of a lot more than you guys pay in Australia.:C

Those prices are pretty much the same as here EEE $18, Shellawax 250ml $25. What you paid is excellent value for money considering it costs around AU$5,000 to get it to PA The price may fluxuate slightly there from time to time because we deal solely in AU$ not US the alst lot of EEE was really expensive for PSI as the AU$ was almost 1 / 1 with the greenback.

Prices will go up dramatically at other places in the US mostly due to the prohibative cost of inland freight on Dangerous Goods. Around 70% of our freight costs are down to US inland freight.


Ozkaban[/b]]........ you're bound to get it caught sooner or later and your fingers are going to spin at the same 1000rpm as the wood :o, whereas the paper towel would just tear... Or am I being overly cautious?If you're silly enough to leave a tail of rag dangling to get caught in a chuck then I guess you deserve what you get. A rag like any other impliment used for woodturning is a tool and as such should be used correctly and safely as you would any other tool. Paper can be more dangerous than a rag, but also acts as an abrasive. Having said that, a friend and demonstrator of our products, swears by McDonalds paper napkins and grabs handulls whenever he gets a chance.

My favorite is new white flannallette sheeting which I buy from Spotlight and cut into roughly 6" x 6" squares big enought to be used many times and small enought to be concealed completely within your hand with nothing trailing to get caught in anything.

Oh yeah and it's soft enough not to pull the third and fourth coats yet tough enough to burn in the first couple of coats and has virtually no weave to be left in the surface.

Think that just about covers it.

:U

[joe greiner]

Having said that, a friend and demonstrator of our products, swears by McDonalds paper napkins and grabs handulls whenever he gets a chance.


Thanks for the reassurance, Neil.:wink:

Joe

[Ed Reiss]

Those prices are pretty much the same as here EEE $18, Shellawax 250ml $25. What you paid is excellent value for money considering it costs around AU$5,000 to get it to PA The price may fluxuate slightly there from time to time because we deal solely in AU$ not US the alst lot of EEE was really expensive for PSI as the AU$ was almost 1 / 1 with the greenback.


I probably should have mentioned that the Shellawax was on sale the day I went to MLCS/PSI showroom. It's normally $24.95 for the 250mls bottle. So, taking into account that it is in the thousands to ship the goods, and the exchange rate, it is good value for the money.

...and might I add a terrific product:2tsup:

[Ozkaban]

If you're silly enough to leave a tail of rag dangling to get caught in a chuck then I guess you deserve what you get. A rag like any other impliment used for woodturning is a tool and as such should be used correctly and safely as you would any other tool. Paper can be more dangerous than a rag, but also acts as an abrasive. Having said that, a friend and demonstrator of our products, swears by McDonalds paper napkins and grabs handulls whenever he gets a chance.

My favorite is new white flannallette sheeting which I buy from Spotlight and cut into roughly 6" x 6" squares big enought to be used many times and small enought to be concealed completely within your hand with nothing trailing to get caught in anything.
the dictator has spoken :D
Actually sounds very sensible. I will try the flannallette sheeting and see how it goes.



Oh yeah and it's soft enough not to pull the third and fourth coats yet tough enough to burn in the first couple of coats and has virtually no weave to be left in the surface.

How many coats are normally recommended? I assume from the above statement that three to four is ok. Do you recommend applying them straight after each other or waiting a while to cool down, etc. I guess on a large platter/bowl there wouldn't be much heat generated but on pens there can be a bit.

Thanks for your help,
Dave

[ubeaut]

The number of coats is far more important on heavily handled or practical pieces than on decorative work.

I.E.: For high-end decorative turnings that aren't going to be handled, one coat will suffice quite well as the finish is basically in the timber as much as it is on the timber. However because it's not really a surface coating it will be more readily damaged with constant handling, water, alcohol, etc.

So for pens wine goblets and anything practical that will be handled or subjected to sweat, alcohol, water, etc, you need to get a surface coating built up. This could be as few as 2 coats or up to 5 or more depending on the timber, the item, and your personal preference.

For pens and pretty well all practical work I would be using Shellawax (liquid) or Glow in preference to Shellawax Cream which is a little less bright in the finish and because of the much higher wax content is slightly easier to damage.

Hope this is of some further help.

Cheers - Neil :U

[Ozkaban]

Thanks for the advice Neil.

I usually do 3-5 coats of shellawax glow on pens and a coat or two of the cream on bowls, etc (not that I've turned a lot of bowls).

Now I've just got to try the flannelette sheets instead of paper. I'll grab some this week...

Cheers,
Dave

[Ed Reiss]

OK guys, here's the walnut bowl that got the EEE and Shellawax treatment.

Sanded to 600, hit it with the trip-E, wiped off the excess, then (just for the fun of it) used a folded up paper towel to apply the Shellawax...worked great:2tsup:

Like I said, the bowl is Black Walnut (pretty common in this area), 177.8mm diameter, 50.8mm high, wall thickness...well, lets just say "pretty thick"!
The rim treatment is tinted (dark red) polyester resin inlaid with 3.175mm slices of palm ivory (Manila Nut) that I cut on the scroll saw (kinda' like re-sawing very small boards).

Check out Gene Doren's site for his terrific palm ivory turnings - http://www.ivorynutpalm.com/

Even though the top view of the bowl looks like the rim is chipped around the edges, it really isn't...it's just the lousy photographer (me....:C) , plus the pics really don't do justice to the finish.

It's going to be fun finding out just what other woods the Shellawax will look good on...it's certainly a winner on walnut! :U

[Ozkaban]

That's a beatuiful bowl, Ed! I think the chunky look suits very well and looks great with the inlays.

Finish is great too - of course :D

Cheers,
Dave

[ss_11000]

nice bowl:2tsup:

[Ed Reiss]

Thanks for the comments, guys.

[hughie]

[


I
t's going to be fun finding out just what other woods the Shellawax will look good on...it's certainly a winner on walnut! :U
[/QUOTE]

Ed from my point of view it pretty well works on all timber. For me, if it gets stuffed up, its alway been me taking a short cut :doh: or some such.
But like a lot of things preparation is the thing. The more you do the better it gets. :2tsup:

[ubeaut]

It's going to be fun finding out just what other woods the Shellawax will look good on...it's certainly a winner on walnut! :U

It works on most timbers. Some of the more oily timbers may make it dull off due to the oil or moisture content of the wood. Open grained timbers can sometimes look a bit ordinary unless they're grain filled. Shellawax has no real grain filling capability

However.... Pretty much any close grained timber will just about knock tour eyes out with depth of colour and inner beauty not brought out by any other finish. Best of all are timbers that have the ability to (I'm thinking this is the right term) refract the light back out of the timber at you. Some timbers just soak up the light and look sort of dead whilst others shoot the light back out at you and are almost blinding. Bit like a piece of Opal or Tiger Eye stone.

Most fiddleback, quilted and other wild grained timber, will take on another dimension. Even plain old pinus radiata flashes out lights in the timber that are hardly seen with any other finish.

Oh yeah if you do strike a piece of that dead looking or oil timber, etc where the finish is shiny but dead looking. it won't matter how many coats you put on, it won't improve. It's just the nature of the timber. It can however sometimes be enhansed by a hand buffing with Traditional Wax a week or so after it's finished.

For example: A piece of quilted maple will look amazing with lights and movement that'll be almost unbelievable with just one coat. Whilst a piece of, plain maple will look nice and shiny and really good but dead, even with a dozen coats. The quilted stuff will throw the light back out the plain stuff will suck the light in giving that dead look.

OK that's about all I have to offer. Hope it's of some use.

Cheers - Neil :U

[tea lady]

I'm having a bit of trouble getting a 2nd coat to smooth over. I am using Shellawax cream. It is on "larger" (for me) bowls. (over 10 inches diameter in the old money. ) I am using t-shirt material. after EEE that I am pretty sure I have removed properly. Sanded to 800# :shrug: I have the lathe going pretty fast. And it seems to be getting hot. I get this smear in one spot that just doesn't go anywhere. I ended up EEEing the finish again. It looks OK if you don't know were to look but.........I know its there.:C

[TTIT]

............... I get this smear in one spot that just doesn't go anywhere. I ended up EEEing the finish again. It looks OK if you don't know were to look but.........I know its there.:CI've had the same problem and have also cut it right back to start again only to have it show up nearby or in the same spot with the next coat. I put it down to some substance or other coming out of the wood at that point but really don't know for sure - would be nice to find an explanation :shrug:

[Ed Reiss]

It works on most timbers. Some of the more oily timbers may make it dull off due to the oil or moisture content of the wood. Open grained timbers can sometimes look a bit ordinary unless they're grain filled. Shellawax has no real grain filling capability

However.... Pretty much any close grained timber will just about knock tour eyes out with depth of colour and inner beauty not brought out by any other finish. Best of all are timbers that have the ability to (I'm thinking this is the right term) refract the light back out of the timber at you. Some timbers just soak up the light and look sort of dead whilst others shoot the light back out at you and are almost blinding. Bit like a piece of Opal or Tiger Eye stone.

Most fiddleback, quilted and other wild grained timber, will take on another dimension. Even plain old pinus radiata flashes out lights in the timber that are hardly seen with any other finish.

Oh yeah if you do strike a piece of that dead looking or oil timber, etc where the finish is shiny but dead looking. it won't matter how many coats you put on, it won't improve. It's just the nature of the timber. It can however sometimes be enhansed by a hand buffing with Traditional Wax a week or so after it's finished.

For example: A piece of quilted maple will look amazing with lights and movement that'll be almost unbelievable with just one coat. Whilst a piece of, plain maple will look nice and shiny and really good but dead, even with a dozen coats. The quilted stuff will throw the light back out the plain stuff will suck the light in giving that dead look.

OK that's about all I have to offer. Hope it's of some use.

Cheers - Neil :U

Right Neil. Your, of course, talking about the "chatoyance" of woods. In my experience the same will result using oil based finishes (tung, do, etc.)...flat grain will stay flat, figured, quilted, etc. will shimmer and pop.

Thanks for your input on this:U