Problems with full dove tail jig

[kieran_shanley]

Hi there,

I am looking to hear from anyone who has purchased a Eurojig FD300 jig and FD3170 full dovetail template. I haven't had any problems with the half dovetail template that comes with the base jig but I have experienced a whole world of pain with the full dovetail template. I purchased the gear from a leading brisbane supplier of woodworking equipment who I won't name in this forum - all I can say is that I am less than impressed with their after sales service. I purchased this equipment after reading an article in Australian Woodworking Review that gave the Eurojig system a good review.

Here is a brief outline of the problem I have encountered.

* as the review pointed out the instructions supplied with the kit are fairly minimal.

* the system consists of a base that you attach to your router, a collar that attaches to the base and is used to protect the router blade from striking the high desity polymer template. To attach the base to your router you fit one of the collars to the base and use a guide bush which fits into the chuck of the router. The guide bush is used to centre the collar.

Problem 1: The is some free play between guide bush and the base with the collar attached which means that it is not easy to mount the base exactly centred.

When you use the 15.8mm collar with the half dove tail template this small variation doesn't seem to cause a problem. However in working with the full template kit you are required to use the 11 mm collar - this means that with the 8mm router blade there is a maximum of 1.5 mm between the collar and the blade tip. Any deviation from centre means that the chance of the blade coming into contact with the collar is increased - unfortunately for me I have destroyed two 8mm router blades and collars ; )

I think the issues is made worse by the thickness of the material I have been working with. I am attempting to join two piece of 19mm timber - I have the depth of cut set on my router so that there is 19mm protruding below the edge of the collar. I guess this creates a longer lever arm so that the pressure of using the router against the jig is enough to cause the blade to make contact with the collar.

Is any of this making sense ??? It is hard to describe the problem without pictures.

I have been trying to resolve this problem with the supplier for almost two months to no avail - in their last communication with me they claim that they have sold more than 100 similar units and I am the only one with a problem and therefore I am a complete spaz.

This issue is driving me mad with frustration. I have now outlaid considerable funds and wasted a lot of time and effort for no result. Well if I am trying to remain positive I think my skills at creating dovetails by hand have improved but as I am sure you all know it is a slow and painstaking process.

Please help me out ! If anyone outthere has any idea what I could be doing wrong or has had similar problems please reply. If you don't want to post to this forum please feel free to contact me directly at my hotmail email account : [email protected]


Once again - thanks for listening to my tails of woe and please let me know if you have any ideas at all.

Cheers,

Kieran

[journeyman Mick]

Kieran,
as you're in Brisbane perhaps if you take the whole lot down there and show them the problem and ask them the demonstrate exactly how it should work. This should either show you what you've been doing wrong or them what's wrong with the jig and bush.

Mick

[Bob Willson]

Also, there is no need to be coy with their name. The purpose of this forum is to share all the problems that we encounter and advise each other of places to not go to if the place is a problem. IE %^*(%$%$%^ Bunnings!!!

[kieran_shanley]

Thanks for the replies guys.

Firstly the crowd I have been dealing with is Carba-Tec in Brisbane. I think the main problem is one of communication - I have been dealing with counter staff that haven't used the gear themselves and I have always been at arms length from someone who has had personal experience. It would have been absolutely fantastic if I could have got someone to spend the time and show me where I have been going wrong but that hasn't happened.

I am particularly disappointed with what I perceive to have been the confrontational way Carabtec brisbane has dealt with my complaint. I am also very disappointed that they didn't do one of two things:

1. Not take the time to walk me through fitting and using the jig. The staff were immediately on the defensive and have told me verbally and in writing that the problem lies with my lack of "mechanical and or motor skills" rather than the equipment. Absuing the customer - Always a good start to a friendly discussion ; )

2. After more than three return visits to the store, when were still not able to resolve the problem, they still refused to return my money. I would of thought that in the interests of maintaining good customer relations they would have gladly handed back the money. I have spent approx $3500 there in the last 12 months. If the matter had been handled in this fashion I would not have hesitated to spend more money at the store.

Can someone recommend an alternate supplier with a more customer friendly dispute resolution process and returns policy ?

On a positive note I received a very helpful email from the guys in Carbatec WA - they gave me some pointers to what could have been the cause of the problem. If anyone is still interested I will post a detailed update complete with some digital pictures - I don't think I will get a chance to get to it for a couple of weeks though.

Its just a pity that I didn't get this level of assistance back in April as my experience has somewhat posioned my mind against the jig. Maybe after a few more hours of chiselling I will change my mind and give it another go.

Cheers,

Kieran

[sandman]

I recently posted a piece on this BB about this particular piece of c%#P!
If you really want to solve your dramas, contact Tony at MIK international and get the Leigh jig.
Yep it costs more but, take into account all the frustrations of such inferior jigs and it has just paid for itself!
Regards Sandman.

[kieran_shanley]

Hey sandman,

Carba-Tec have told me that no one else in the country has ever had any problems and therfore I am just a complete moron. I am seriously considering taking the matter to small claims but I can't do that if I can't substantiate my claims and having someone else put their hand up and say that they have had trouble too would be a fantastic help. Would you be prepared to sign an affidavit outlining your experience with the jig ?

Thanks for the tip on the Leigh jig. If my workshop budget ever recovers from the beating it has taken over the Eurojig I might look into the Leigh as an alternative. I think that is one lesson I have learned from this experience - don't skimp on the quality to save a few bucks - you just open a whole world of pain !

Cheers,

Kieran

[kieran_shanley]

Guys,

This is a very basic question but I'll ask it anyway.

With this type of jig that uses a guide collar to protect the bit should the entire cutting surface be projecting through the collar so that the collar is only protecting the shaft of the bit ? I have been just setting the depth of cut I want so that only a portion of the blade is projecting beyond the collar. This means that the router blade is very close to the collar. I received an email from Carba-Tec WA and it made me rethink how I was using the jig. If I put the bit in the router in such away that the cutting surface is no where near the guide collar I could instead adjust the depth of cut that I want by raising or lowering the height of the template above the work piece.

I will feel a bit dumb if this is the cause of two months of hell but I will be releaved if it is something as simple as this. I had better not count my chickens before they hatch but if this is "the" solution one has to wonder why someone at Carba-Tec didn't point this out the very first time I ran into difficulties. I guess I know the reason - the counter staff had no first hand experience of using the gear and so they couldn't offer any guidance - better wait and see what you guys have to say.

Cheers,

Kieran

[Ian Runge]

Kieran,

Bring the jig and anything else you like to Maccas Coorparoo tomorrow (Saturday) ... it will give the woodworking brains trust something to do instead of supersizing ourselves.

IanR

[sandman]

Hi Kieran, I purchased my Euro 300 through MIK as Carbatec have proved in the past, to be no where near the standard of MIK when it comes to service!
If you do a search on dovetail jigs, you should find some details of my saga on there. Carbatec would probably have no knowledge of my unit as I returned it to MIK. However I did contact the Melb store for help and they were totally useless! MIK upon return checked the jig as to my compalint & informed me that the jig was "out". (The guide bush "stop" for aligning timber on the unit was about 1.5mm out of true) Problem it caused was ALL joins were out of plane!
You can inform them of my circumstances to see if they will help you otherwise you should have a claim!
Good luck,
Regards Sandman.

[sandman]

One specific detail Kieran, is that our problems are quite different in specifics, however, I like you was impressed with the AWR dovetail jig reveiws and based upon this decided to purchase. I now take their "reviews" with a "grain of salt"! I do wonder about the "independance" of the persons who perform the reviews as I can't see the AWR doing a Disservice to their major sponsors of advertising!!!! ;)

[Bob Willson]

Surely somebody from Carbatec must read these pages? They will be upsetting quite a large potential consumer base if they do not attend to these matters in a more responsible manner. I like going in to see all the great Veritas tools in Carbatec but if they are going to treat one person in this cavalier fashion then am I going to be next?

You neglect to say what sort of instructions come with the jig Kieran. Are they at all explicit or are they like the 'instructions' for their standard Taiwanese jigs? Ie a load of unintelligible cr@p.

[kieran_shanley]

Hi everyone,

I think Bob's last post must have stired up some action.

I received a call from Carba-Tec asking me to bring in my gear. They will take a look at it and see if there is anything faulty with it and if they can't find anything wrong I they will take the time to look at how I am using it and show me what I am doing wrong.

There may turn out to be nothing wrong with the gear at all and I have cocked something up completely - hopefully they will be able to point me in the right direction.

The instructions that were supplied with the equipment were brief. Like most manuals you need to make some assumptions and that could be where my problems lie. I don't have the instruction booklet too hand as it has been mislayed in all the to-ings and fro-ings. Hopefully I will be able to get another copy next week.

I will be sure to post another article late next week to make everyone aware of the outcome. I want to be able to recommend this unit to others as it is really well priced and with the additional template it can do both half and full dovetails. If it all works I will put up some installation and useage tips on my homepage and let you guys know where to look.

Thanks once again for everyone's input - I'll be sure to post another update soon.

Cheers,

Kieran

[kieran_shanley]

Guys,

I have posted an update on my problems with the eurojig under a new thread - please look at "Problems with Dove tail jig resolved !" for details.

Thanks to everyone for there replies !

Cheers,

Kieran