Thread: My works

Interesting looking work Hamedgg. Is it actually timber or something that a 3dD printer has made?.
Oh yeah, welcome to the forum too. Not many folk from Iran on here so good luck to you.

I really like your classic lines and shapes

Well it has little to do with woodcarving but I suppose it might demonstrate 3D digital design to those who are unfamiliar with it.
To answer artful bodgers question "Is it actually timber or something that a 3dD printer has made?. " - Neither ! it's a 2D picture that is made within a computer programme which is able to be rotated & viewed from any angle . However you could send to a 3D printer & it could print it from this - is this the future of all sculpture ? - very possibly.
Mike

Originally Posted by Mike the knife

Well it has little to do with woodcarving but I suppose it might demonstrate 3D digital design to those who are unfamiliar with it.
To answer artful bodgers question "Is it actually timber or something that a 3dD printer has made?. " - Neither ! it's a 2D picture that is made within a computer programme which is able to be rotated & viewed from any angle . However you could send to a 3D printer & it could print it from this - is this the future of all sculpture ? - very possibly.
Mike

Thanks for clearing that one up Mike. If that is the future of all sculpture, then I don't like it. Bit like saying the future of sport is playing it on a computer game.

Not quite as simple as that... It can also be used to generate 3D patterns of just about anything that can be viewed from all sides. VERY useful to someone like myself who appreciates having on 3D object to refer to during a project than any number of 2D perspectives.

Realistically, you'd have to think that the chances of this being the future of 'all' sculpture are similar to the chances of ebooks spelling the end of printed books.
There are some fantastic images on the zbrush web site along with some wonderful flights of fancy. A good spot to go looking for outlandish wood carving inspiration!

Originally Posted by Whittling

Not quite as simple as that... It can also be used to generate 3D patterns of just about anything that can be viewed from all sides. VERY useful to someone like myself who appreciates having on 3D object to refer to during a project than any number of 2D perspectives.

Well it seems very attractive doesn't it - having a uncomparable amount of quality reference but you must first make it in "sculptris" or where ever. That can take a good while , then supposing you've got your "perfect" 3-D model now , all of the artitic & aesthetic decisions have already been made , all that remains is to slavishly copy the 3D pattern .
The excitement & anticipation of the journey completely removed - the decisions completely gone , with no judgment being exercised along the journey of creation , merely mechanical copying is left . Why not just feed the design into into aCNC. carving machine & be done with that drudgery ?

With some hand finishing with edge tools - Hey there you have it!


Yet you don't really, do you , not at all. Is not the journey of sculpiting a wood carving the thing of inestimatable value in the whole process ?
From being a 2D drawing - a vauge idea slowly evolves , grows & refines in front of your eyes, being ever open to new ideas & subtle changes of nuance which engauge , enthrawl & lend joy & meaning to the journey that each sculpture is both for the carver & the viewer of the finished piece.

The very time that is inherent in the process allows for deep absorbtion in the aesthetics of the whole outcome at a very basic & human level.
That is the creative art process which is unique to woodcarving , if you were coldly copying an exact pattern in the infinite detail that 3D. programmes allow - then the time spent carving it is artistically sterile - leaden CRAFT drudgery ( a machines role).

Why bother continuing to carve at all if you remove the very heart of it ?
No ! I for one will continue to ride the roller coaster of uncertainty & not knowing for 1. the excitement of the ride! 2. the value derived from living dangerously ! 3. Oh yes I nearly forgot, the deep human qualities apparent in the final work made in this way.

Mike

Horse doovers!

Every piece has its own idiosyncrasy. 90% percent of the expression comes with the execution... not the model. For instance, if I wanted to carve an eagle at rest, my ideal would be a real eagle at rest to refer to. Since that's not going to happen, I have to find as many photos of a real eagle in a pose as close to the one I want as I can find. I know from experience that I won't find enough. Having a 3D model to refer to as you go is a wonderful advantage. It doesn't dictate my final choices... more like prevents me from going places that I don't want to go. And it doesn't ever have to be more than a computer image... as long as it can be rotated or manipulated at will.

If you seriously think our carving 'forefathers' wouldn't have used some of these modern tools, techniques and advantages if they had had them available to them, you're living in a dream world.

Originally Posted by Whittling

Horse doovers!


If you seriously think our carving 'forefathers' wouldn't have used some of these modern tools, techniques and advantages if they had had them available to them, you're living in a dream world.

You might expect that those who went before would use all the tools available. Having served an apprenticeship in a very traditional shop my experience would suggest otherwise. The standard answer to any sort of change was 'all the new ways have been tried'. So in exactly the same way as today the rebels fight against the traditional way and the less rebellious carry as before.

Personally I am happy to include digital images as a source of inspiration. But I won't be putting the carving tools away in the foreseeable future.

It is really good to be having a discussion with differing opinions. Certainly better than constantly patting each other on the back.

Philip.

Welcome to the forum Hamedgg. Your 3D sculptures are quite amazing. It would be interesting to know are you using these for furniture in a 3D world or are they patterns for carving in a real world application?
From what I've heard you have to be an artist to use Maya and zBrush and that it takes years to learn and master. I imagine that is no easy task. Congrats on your beautiful work.
A carver and a 3D artist both must have good spatial awareness and imagination. To turn a 2D image into a 3D object is what we both do. You start with a line on a computer screen, carvers start with a pencil line on a piece of wood.
I hope to see more of your elegant sculptures in the future. Well done.

Hi Whittling,
You say ,"90% percent of the expression comes with the execution... not the model." -Yes I agree, through working with your hands both the conscious & unconscious , the objective & subjective unformed & unclear ideas become a concrete ,solid object before our very eyes.Very often to the suprise of the carver , I didn't know I saw it like that ! he'll say.


You say - "Having a 3D model to refer to as you go is a wonderful advantage. It doesn't dictate my final choices... more like prevents me from going places that I don't want to go." - But the model you have made within a programme MUST necessarily have removed the risk & any repetition of that same journey again is mere replication rather than working in the present moment, leaving those intuitive searching cuts as witness to the journey of discovery - ALL THAT SHOWS in the spirit of the final piece , how you felt when you did it , the 100's of decisions that you make on the spur of the moment, all show.

You say, "If you seriously think our carving 'forefathers' wouldn't have used some of these modern tools, techniques and advantages if they had had them available to them, you're living in a dream world." YES of course ! in fact it was standard practice to work with clay marquettes to work some difficult technical issues out in all traditional carving shops.

However if at the clay stage the piece is taken to any degree of finish at all , it kills both the enjoyment & the spirit of the piece ! this has been proclaimed as a fundamental truth by carvers thoughout the centuries. it is just a plain fact .

Now of course many carvers thoughout the centuties were duplicating set patterns & the scope for interpretation was limited but I kind of assumed that most people here were working for the joy of it & taking an artistic approach , I encourage them to go with their heart & use clay (virtual or real) very sparingly & only to a very limited & indistinct effect.
I am no luddite you know ! I use vector drawing programmes for all technical drawing & hand drawing for my design work - Only to digitise it for the presentation to the client of course !

Yet that simply serves to underline my point art is human , with a human touch , to communicate human subleties to other humans.
I'm old enough of course to have lived pre & post digital age & have always very closely followed it's growth & disscussed it with countless other artists over the years - I'm just pointing out that it might be wise for people to consider carefully , what technology they embrace in their personal artistic journey.
Which modern tools might speed the mechanical processes ie. get the job done faster/remove drudgery (GOOD)& which tools might remove the human touch which I believe to be so very essential in art & merely create psudo pastiches of art without soul.(BAD)
Of course those whose major driving force is making a living from the art they do are very understandably very tempted to embrace any & all technologies which may speed things up regardless of ivory tower art - Hell it's food & a roof etc !
I hear that but then I see a lot of souless crap that's been rushed out all around me everyday I do wonder - I'm talking to woodcarvers whose priority is the joy of exploration .

Cheers Mike

Quote "However if at the clay stage the piece is taken to any degree of finish at all , it kills both the enjoyment & the spirit of the piece ! this has been proclaimed as a fundamental truth by carvers thoughout the centuries. it is just a plain fact ." Unquote... ?

Sorry to hear it.... it doesn't work that way for me. I rarely get a subject exactly the way I want it on the first go. Practice and good modeling certainly help. I don't feel a need to 'suffer' for my art. My satisfaction comes from achieving what I set out to do. Anything that helps me get there is welcome.

While I will concede your right to an opinion like the above... its hardly universal. There is more I could say but the 'exclusivistic mysticism' of this position pushes my buttons so I'm not going to comment further on this one. Leave it that we will have to agree to disagree.

Hamedgg from Iran has gone awful quiet you guys.
On other forums I am on he would be labeled a troll by now. Ten times over.

Even so, as I said previously, It is nice to occasionally have a multi faceted conversation. The idea that we all agree on everything all the time just doesn't feel right. So a few tolls every now and then, fine by me.