Thread: 100 tooth vs thin kerf blade

I reckon if both are equally sharp and both wood cutting blades you will be battling to tell the difference.


However, I have both these blades and the Masters blade is a multi material blade which means it cuts plastic, brass and aluminium so its cutting ability is not optimised for wood.
It is also slower than a wood optimised blade.

That Bosch has a Triple Chip grind which is great for non-ferrous metal and laminated board, but not so great for solid timber - the bottom edge can be a bit furry

Of those two, the CMT is the better option but consider these as well
https://www.masters.com.au/product/9...lade-80t-254mm
https://www.masters.com.au/product/9...ade-100t-254mm

Unfortunately, the "better" options (professional grade) don't come smaller than 300mm and start at around double the price of the CMT

I did not see the other 100T bosch blade. I was a little concerned about the TCT grind on the other one but this one looks like a ATB so I think I will go for that one and see how it goes.

Thanks

Let me toss something out here that may initially sound dumb.

The number of teeth do not necessarily equate to the smoothness of the cut.

There are some "General Purpose" (and expensive) blades that are all ATB teeth. (Alternating Top Bevel.) These blades work very well up to about 19mm thick timber. These blades will struggle when used beyond 19mm thick timber. Soft woods tend to make these blades struggle also. These blades give a smooth cut.

A solution for a smooth cut may be easier than one thinks. Use a negative hook angle blade in your table saw. (A negative hook blade should already be in your Sliding Compound Miter Saw.) A negative hook angle blade has the teeth leaning backward or away from a radial line. These blades are sometimes sold as radial arm saw blades. A negative hook angle should always be used in Radial Arm Saws, Chop Saws and Compound Miter saws.

I would go to the home center and ask for a Radial Arm Saw blade. If you get the, as expected, "the lights are on but nobody is home" look, you'll have to open packages and look at the angle of the teeth. A negative hook angle combination blade (groups of 4 ATB and one flat Raker on a large gullet) will give a smooth cut in most timber. These blades (10 inch diameter) come in 40 or 50 tooth varieties with the 50 tooth giving a slightly smoother cut.

BTW - The words Oak and Soft are an oxymoron here. When describing Tasmanian Oak as soft-ish destroyed any understanding that I thought I knew about Tasmanian Oak.

Good luck in your endeavour.

Saw Blades 101 / Rockler How-to may help a little to understand the options available.

I have been trialing a Diablo 60 T 254mm Fine Finish thin kerf blade on my table saw for cross cutting small components that I use in my built up wood turnings. Previously I have been using a range of standard kerf CMT blades. The Diablo is producing very nice cuts in material that is mostly 19 x 19 mm in a vide range of timbers but the TK won't hold up so well with ripping many of them. The TK is easier on the saws limited power but the CMT's produce a better cut ripping.

Another thing to consider is arbor float in your saw, A high quality blade still will not produce a good cut if there is arbor float.

For a lot of the smaller, lower powered saws which many of us own, I've found just going to thin kerf blades makes a huge difference to quality of cut. I have a think kerf 60 tooth Infinity combo that basically lives on the saw - very clean ripping cuts up to 40mm thick or so, and glassy smooth crosscuts. They do have some clever tooth geometry, but a big factor is that the saw doesn't bog down at all during the cut. I also have a standard kerf Freud combo, with way more teeth, that doesn't perform nearly as well.

Combo blades with at least one flat top tooth in each ATB group also have the advantage of giving flat bottoms to your trenching cuts.....

Originally Posted by rrich

The number of teeth do not necessarily equate to the smoothness of the cut.

It's not the only factor, but there is a direct correlation between tooth count and cut quality; much the same way that a 3-flute router bit will give a better finish than a 2-flute assuming all other factors are equal.

There are some "General Purpose" (and expensive) blades that are all ATB teeth. (Alternating Top Bevel.) These blades work very well up to about 19mm thick timber. These blades will struggle when used beyond 19mm thick timber. Soft woods tend to make these blades struggle also.

All our blades at work fall into that category - ATB and over $200 each. They work just as well in softwood as hardwood and thicknesses from 5-100mm. Any struggle is due to there not being enough motor to drive the blade; all our blades have at least 5hp behind them and only slow down under heavy load (thicker than 70mm)

A negative hook angle should always be used in Radial Arm Saws

No, no, no, no. I've had my rant about this in another thread, but in a nutshell: We tried this and it was downright dangerous. They're great in drop saws where you cut on the push stroke, but, in my experience, uncontrollable on a RAS.

Thanks for all the input guys. Lots to think about.

I have two follow up questions;
1 - why would a negative hook angle effect the finish of the cut? I always thought it only effected how the blade, or stock depending on the saw, gets pulled thought.
2 - on the topic of hardness, is the Rockwell scale still used for wood? Tas oak is "soft" next to some red gum ☺

Just for my own enjoyment I might buy 2 - 3 blades and see how I go. It might be a interesting experiment.

Thanks

The hardness scale for wood is called the Janka scale.

Not sure if/how neg rake affects the cut quality. I know it's meant to prevent self feeding of the saw, but my experience with it has been the exact opposite.

Originally Posted by rrich

BTW - The words Oak and Soft are an oxymoron here. When describing Tasmanian Oak as soft-ish destroyed any understanding that I thought I knew about Tasmanian Oak.

The term Tas. Oak is complete tosh and totally misleading. It should be drummed out of usage.

It describes any of 3 different Euc species (from memory Victorian Ash, Silver Ash and Mountain Ash), which to my mind are not even a little bit like oak in any way. These species are comparatively softer than most Euc species (of which there are more than 700 IIRC), but they still rate as hardwoods.

Generally speaking they are as boring as hell (which is why the big chains sell it) unless you want a very pale colour contrast.

In fact the only interesting thing about one of them - Mountain Ash or Euc regnans - is that it's the world's tallest flowering plant.

Originally Posted by FenceFurniture

These species are comparatively softer than most Euc species (of which there are more than 700 IIRC), but they still rate as hardwoods.

"Hardwoods are produced by angiosperm trees that reproduce by flowers, and have broad leaves." - Wikipedia
Balsa is a hardwood as well. It's to do with the botanical characteristics of the tree, not the actual hardness of the wood.

Originally Posted by markdem

1 - why would a negative hook angle effect the finish of the cut?

While I suspect it the angle that the tooth leaves the cut that makes the difference, I will leave that part to someone who knows. My comment is that, I have found it to work much better. In my case because I couldn't be bothered changing what was marked as an Aluminium Blade from the SCMS for a small wood cut and discovering that the negative rake did a great job.

Regards

Bauldy