Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 23
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Forest Range, SA
    Posts
    118

    Default Advice on biscuit usage

    I'm making some small frames that will be doors on the front of a bathroom vanity unit that will have leadlight panels in them, with the frames being milled out of very old oregon roof beams to make sides of only 32x21mm and the top & bottoms 60x21mm.

    To make it easy I'm thinking of using my biscuit joiner machine to cut out slots either side and then assembling the joint with PVA glue and a standard 50mm biscuit. Hard to picture I know, but in essence, is using biscuits a crappy way to join frame corners instead of either dowells or mortice&tenon?

  2. # ADS
    Google Adsense Advertisement
    Join Date
    Always
    Location
    Advertising world
    Posts
    Many





     
  3. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Melbourne
    Age
    29
    Posts
    5,031

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jabell View Post
    but in essence, is using biscuits a crappy way to join frame corners instead of either dowells or mortice&tenon?
    In short, yes.

    Biscuits are good for aligning boards when you're gluing up a table top and that's about it.

  4. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    South Australia
    Posts
    3,442

    Default

    When using biscuits you need to take into account that they are only a alignment aid, they do not add strength.

  5. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 1999
    Location
    Westleigh, Sydney
    Age
    73
    Posts
    8,939

    Default

    When using biscuits you need to take into account that they are only a alignment aid, they do not add strength.
    While this is true for long grain to long grain joints, which should be strong enough on their own, they do indeed add strength to mitre or end-grain joints. Biscuits provide long grain contact on both sides, so as well as helping to align the joints, they do add strength.
    Visit my website
    Website
    Facebook

  6. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Forest Range, SA
    Posts
    118

    Default

    Thanks all, I'll do dowells instead. Some years ago I got a biscuit joiner machine from Aldi, and it is fantastic, I love it, so easy to set up and use, hence my desire for any excuse to use it, but I take your consensus that it has its place, and this ain't one of them.

  7. #6
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Kilmore, near Melbourne, Australia
    Age
    62
    Posts
    1,895

    Default

    If the biscuit ends up only 5-8mm under each surface, the gluing process 'may' result in the joint swelling. We found this when doing a number of jobs at Dattner, even on jarrah and messmate.
    Steve
    Kilmore (Melbourne-ish)
    Australia

    ....catchy phrase here

  8. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Melb
    Posts
    911

    Default

    While it's a popular belief that biscuits don't hold their weights. My experience has been to the contrary. For example, I extended the height of a children's bunk bed to an adult size one with biscuits 17 years ago using biscuits joints on the posts and rungs. It is used everyday and is still solid as ever.

    In terms of stress analysis, the common stress failure of timber are tension, compression and shear. Compression stress is well taken care of by the timbers being joined, and glued biscuits are surprisingly strong in resisting the joints being pull apart. Shear stress as well as twisting on the joint is dependent on cross sectional area and as long as there are enough biscuits, they should do as well as other joining methods.

    Biscuits are still widely available and if they were as weak as some would believe. They would have been improved, for example, by being made thicker or disappeared from use altogether. But they are still here and widely used.

    Finally, there is the Rockler's take on the comparsion of dowels vs biscuits: Doweling vs. Biscuit Joints / Rockler How-to

    Quote Originally Posted by jabell View Post
    Some years ago I got a biscuit joiner machine from Aldi, and it is fantastic, I love it, so easy to set up and use, hence my desire for any excuse to use it, but I take your consensus that it has its place, and this ain't one of them.
    How much shear strength do you need from a vanity unit door frame? Not much I suspect. .... Also a misaligned doweled door looks pretty ordinary.

  9. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Forest Range, SA
    Posts
    118

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by justonething View Post
    How much shear strength do you need from a vanity unit door frame? Not much I suspect. .... Also a misaligned doweled door looks pretty ordinary.
    Well aint that the truth! It was my past history of lousy dowel and m&t joints that steered me towards the biscuit joiner, given it has repeatedly had good results for me. Well bugger it, it's only a bit of wood that I can replace, I'm going to biscuit join it and see what happens!

  10. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    used to live in Sydney, now it's Canada
    Age
    64
    Posts
    10,895

    Default

    Some years ago -- before the advent if the Domino -- Fine Woodworking tested several methods for constructing cabinet doors.

    From memory, biscuits wee strong enough for a typical kitchen door.
    regards from Canada

    ian

  11. #10
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    South Australia
    Posts
    79

    Default

    Go with the biscuit joiner mate. If your concerned about strength cut two slots in each joint and use a pair of biscuits.
    Honestly, since the Domino came out there has been an awful lot rubbish written about previous tools and techniques ( most of it cork sniffing).
    Cheers

  12. #11
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Melbourne
    Age
    29
    Posts
    5,031

    Default

    I'll have you know I've been writing rubbish since long before the Domino

  13. #12
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    South Australia
    Posts
    79

    Default

    EJ, wasn't directed at you in particular, hats off to you responding in good humour

  14. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Forest Range, SA
    Posts
    118

    Default

    'scuse igorance - what is domino?

  15. #14
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Kilmore, near Melbourne, Australia
    Age
    62
    Posts
    1,895

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jabell View Post
    'scuse igorance - what is domino?
    It's how they join the segments of their pizzas for transport.
    Steve
    Kilmore (Melbourne-ish)
    Australia

    ....catchy phrase here

  16. #15
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Little River
    Age
    73
    Posts
    888

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jabell View Post
    'scuse igorance - what is domino?

    Have a look at this

    http://www.festool.com.au/epages/too...roducts/574328

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Advice for biscuit slots attachment
    By danielr in forum WOODWORK - GENERAL
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 25th Apr 2013, 08:32 AM
  2. Triton Biscuit Joiner(TC9BJM) Biscuit Question
    By ToolFanatic in forum TRITON / GMC
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 8th Aug 2011, 06:46 PM
  3. biscuit joiners advice
    By Farm boy in forum HAND TOOLS - POWERED
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: 31st Mar 2010, 10:22 AM
  4. Biscuit joint - Advice needed please
    By MarkfUK in forum WOODWORK - GENERAL
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 21st Jan 2008, 03:12 PM
  5. Advice on the Triton Biscuit Joiner
    By hilton in forum TRITON / GMC
    Replies: 25
    Last Post: 25th Jul 2006, 01:44 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •