Thread: Bass Guitar neck and body

Simon,

With the greatest respect to any luthiers (pro or part-time) who may frequent this forum, I strongly suggest you go to the Music Instrument Makers Forums....... http://www.mimf.com/ ...........there is a wealth of information available from the forum and it's members.

I recall seeing (a couple of years ago), an 8 string bass built by a guy there so some digging around and lateral thinking with the search function may get you some answers.

Cheers histring!

Ill check that out also and see what i can find

Hi Simon,

sorry to hear of you back injury and even more sorry to see the step backwards re the house and the shed:mad:
I remember when I was about your age and I did my back in, couldnt work for ages and it was a financial nightmare and just to add some more fun the wife was pregnant with our first child and had given up work:eek:

I hope you get back on your feet real soon

Good luck with the Guitar making mate

All the best Ian

Hi,

First thing to start, what type of 8 string bass do you want?
1. 8 individual string like those new ERB basses out there? OR
2. a regular 4 string bass with double strings? like on 12 string guitars.

How will I determine the width/length of the neck and where the fretboard will start from on the body.

Most of us usually start by making a full scale plan on paper. Start by buying the bridge and that'll tell you how wide you want your neck based on that plan you'll make.

What australian timbers are best for this project knowing that im after a reddish or coloured body with a light "through" neck.

I've only been here 7 months so I'm still researching this. Have a look at Maton's website, you'll see a bunch of them. You can still find cool stuff like purpleheart, maple and wenge in australia anyway so you don't have to use only native woods.

Being 8string will i need multiple Truss rods due to width of neck and what will be the correct way to install them in the neck (rebate under fretboard or other)

Depends what kind of 8 string you want. On double strings I'd recommend either one truss rod and two carbon fiber rods or two truss rods. On individual strings I'd recommend two truss rods and at least one carbon fiber rod.

Besides MIMF that was already mentioned I'd recommend you go to www.projectguitar.com and read as much as you can from that site and hang out on their forum for a while. You'll learn heaps. I've got a feeling you didn't really research everything on the subject first. you should do that before you start. Buying a book might be good too. A good one is Melvyn Hiscock's Make your own electric guitar, it shows you how to build a neck-through 8 string bass (double strings) amongst others. It's available at Carba-Tec.

Will the finish make a difference to sound? as in french polish of fretboard but oil on the body and such?

That one is still contraversial The general belief is that the thinner the finish the more the woods' tones will come out. Fretboards are usually only oiled, most people will lacquer their instrument's bodies and necks. I personally use nitro-cellulose. It was the norm in the business for decades and is probably the easiest one to do at home (the norm these days in the industry is polyester and thats not really feasible at home) You can oild your bass if you want but then it'll dent easily which is a shame, the lacquer protects a bit better.

The bass below is what im basing mine loosely on, body shape with the neck 1 piece as opposed to the laminated way he has done his with a more rounded diamond headstock. If anyone thinks it doesnt suite an 8string or has ideas of how to change/improve for the better id love to hear them aswell

I design my basses by taking a picture of a bass I like and throw it into coreldraw. I make a copy of it with that bevier tool (or whatever its called) and pull/push and play around with the lines until I like the new form or shape I made. Then I print out the body on four sheets which I tape together and cut out. This is basically my way of making a full scale template of my bodies.

good luck

Thanks Phil!

The bass im designing is the 8string single string, a solo bass ive been told by my muso friend.

I spent a few hours on that MIMF site last night without much luck finding what i was after. found it hard to navigate :P

As for the researching part, thats why im here! Not knowing a great deal about guitar construction ive been talking to people who do know, speaking to the guys at my local music shop. My musician friend was taught by the guy who makes Matons custom acoustics and hes trying to set up a chat over a coffee soon so i should learn alot there hopefully.
While im stuck at home at the moment the internet and these forums are my source of knowledge

Cheers Phil, good info mate

Simon

Gee 8 string bass... you got long fingers then !

Originally Posted by timberpassion

Now for my question!!

Im drawing up plans for an 8string bass based loosely on the body shape of the one below. I have an amazing musician/teacher friend of mine who has been helping wih alot of info about what hardware will get my desired sound but i need structural advice. I have a few questions so ill just list them below and if anyone knows of anything id greatly appreciate the advice.

How will I determine the width/length of the neck and where the fretboard will start from on the body.

What australian timbers are best for this project knowing that im after a reddish or coloured body with a light "through" neck.

Will different timbers create a different sound from my bass?

Being 8string will i need multiple Truss rods due to width of neck and what will be the correct way to install them in the neck (rebate under fretboard or other)

Will the finish make a difference to sound? as in french polish of fretboard but oil on the body and such?


The bass below is what im basing mine loosely on, body shape with the neck 1 piece as opposed to the laminated way he has done his with a more rounded diamond headstock. If anyone thinks it doesnt suite an 8string or has ideas of how to change/improve for the better id love to hear them aswell

Love to hear the valued advice i have always recieved from the wonderful people on this site

To the 3 who sent me the emails....dont bother thanks

Cheers as always!

Simon

Simon,

Some input from a fellow luthier..

1. Width of neck governed my number of strings. Measure up neck width of a standard 4 string electric bass and add in appropriate extra neck width to accommodate 4 extra strings.

2. Pass...havent used alot of Aussie woods on my acoustics. Others in this forum with more expertise in such matters and will be able to offer advice....Paul B?

3. IMO density of timber in the neck of an electric bass has most influence in the sound of same...predominantly in sustain.

4. Again I havent had alot of experience with 8 string basses...if commercial models use two truss rods then do the same. If not then dont make life unnecessarily complicated. Truss rods are usually installed into a rebate routed into the neck before the fretboard gets glued onto same.

5. Finish will affect sound of an acoustic but has absolutely NO influnence on sound of an electric.......you can take a nice sounding Bass finished in high quality nitro and spray it with British Paints 4 seasons and it will still sound the same.

French polishing your fretboard?......the shellac is going to last about a week if youre an average player. Leave the fretboard unfinished and rub a bit of lemon oil into it.

Cheers Martin

Originally Posted by Phil Mailloux

Hi,

That one is still contraversial The general belief is that the thinner the finish the more the woods' tones will come out. Fretboards are usually only oiled, most people will lacquer their instrument's bodies and necks. I personally use nitro-cellulose. It was the norm in the business for decades and is probably the easiest one to do at home (the norm these days in the industry is polyester and thats not really feasible at home) You can oild your bass if you want but then it'll dent easily which is a shame, the lacquer protects a bit better.

Phil,

IMHO finish has negligible influence on the sound of a solid body electric guitar.....density of wood in the neck and electronics are main controls on sound of such instruments.

Cheers Martin

Simon,

Post your questions on following forum:

http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/default2.asp

Cheers Martin

Gday again guys
thanks kiwi and phil for great info

French polishing the fretboard was a typo Was reading some stuf on antiques while i was typing and there ya go
Once typed my mum asking me for a coffee into a resume once haha!

So I now understand how to calculate the width of my neck and fretboard.
I found some good links on www.projectguitar.com about the truss rods and installation.

Kiwigeo u mentioned that finish will have no effect on the sound but i gather that the choice of timber will??
If I use 1 solid slab for the body will that have a different sound to a 2piece butt-jointed body? Or even a layered body as to get different wood contrasts when scalloping out the cutaways?? Ive been told that using too many pieces in body will lower sound quality and to get the best tone i want to use 1 solid piece, not knowing myself i dont know wether to rely on that info.

Will the fretboard itself need to be made out of a certain wood or can i use something with a nice figure in it? Alot of sites ive been on say Ebony is the best, but again i dunno


Gonna be popping these Q's on http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/default2.asp thanks Kiwi. But if anyone else wants to add every idea and thought helps thanks guys

Cheers again

Simon

Originally Posted by timberpassion

Kiwigeo u mentioned that finish will have no effect on the sound but i gather that the choice of timber will??
If I use 1 solid slab for the body will that have a different sound to a 2piece butt-jointed body? Or even a layered body as to get different wood contrasts when scalloping out the cutaways?? Ive been told that using too many pieces in body will lower sound quality and to get the best tone i want to use 1 solid piece, not knowing myself i dont know wether to rely on that info.

It won't really make a difference, most of the sound comes from the pickups. You DO get different tones with different woods but on an electric the wood acts more like a filter. In other words, if you put in jazz bass pickups in it, it'll sound like a jazz bass!

Plenty of people build basses with multiple plys and woods in basses these days and there's nothing detrimental in the sound whatsoever.

May I plug my website and say, "have a look at my 6 string fretless"?

www.geocities.com/philmailloux

Phil,

IMHO finish has negligible influence on the sound of a solid body electric guitar.....density of wood in the neck and electronics are main controls on sound of such instruments.

Cheers Martin

Thats what i meant by controversial some swear there's a difference, others don't. There's a big thing going on these days with high end basses where the builders will finish the bass in oil to "release" the tones of the basses. Whether it sounds better or not is up to your own ears (perception). I personally agree with you on this one Martin.

I forgot to add...

Simon, basses like you want to build are usually called "extended range basses" or ERB's for short. You can find out more about them and even see a couple of progress shots of them being built on www.talkbass.com the "luthier's corner" section of that forum is also very helpful for learning about bass building

Originally Posted by timberpassion

Kiwigeo u mentioned that finish will have no effect on the sound but i gather that the choice of timber will??
If I use 1 solid slab for the body will that have a different sound to a 2piece butt-jointed body? Or even a layered body as to get different wood contrasts when scalloping out the cutaways?? Ive been told that using too many pieces in body will lower sound quality and to get the best tone i want to use 1 solid piece, not knowing myself i dont know wether to rely on that info.

Will the fretboard itself need to be made out of a certain wood or can i use something with a nice figure in it? Alot of sites ive been on say Ebony is the best, but again i dunno

Simon,

I'm not a bass builder (yet) but used to play electric bass in my younger days. Choice of wood will affect sound of your bass to some degree..like I said the density of the wood in the neck has an effect on sustain (same on an acoustic). IMO the type of wood in the body has less of an effect. One thing I have noted is that basses where the neck runs through the body have longer sustain than instruments where neck is simply bolted onto a one piece body.

Choice of wood for fretboards.....has to be stable and able to withstand constant handling and exposure to skin oils etc and if you really dont care alot about your instrument....jam, vegemite and other food items. if your neck wood is hard enough then you can go without a fretboard (eg maple).....can be a pain if you have to a refret though. The two most common choices of wood for fretboards are ebony and rosewood. Be warned....big pieces of high quality ebony are expensive.

Cheers Martin

Simon, I have found these people to be reliable suppliers.


http://www.giletguitars.com.au


Have a look see

Regards Mike