Thread: Another beginner question - planes

It really depends on what sort of work you do, what your methods are and what sort of timber you're likely to be working on.

For me, I work mostly with hardwood, I have a jointer and a thicknesser, and I mainly do cabinet and box work. So for me, the two most handy planes to have are a smoother and a block plane.

I have several smoothers but I reckon you can't go wrong with a Stanley #4 or similar as a first plane. You can buy a second hand one for around $30 (and most people will tell you to steer clear of the new ones anyway) and you can fix them up quite easily with reference to the information on the subject that you will find here.

The block plane I have is a Veritas low angle block. I think this is the most handy and versatile plane I've got. It will work as a small smoother and you can also buy an extension handle kit for it to make it more like a smoother to use. It's great for end grain work, handles highly figured grain well, and you can use it to chamfer edges and other odd jobs. It's definitely worth buying one of these new, but they are basically a copy of the Stanley #60 1/2, which can be had for about half the price (but again, buy second hand, not new).

I started with a #4, but now that I've had the low angle block for a couple of years, I think I would buy that one first if I was starting again.

However, all the above notwithstanding, if you don't have access to machines and you have to dimension by hand, then a #5 might be your best friend. Or a #7 and a #4. You'll probably find you need more than one.

There are also the woodies - HNT Gordon is a highly recommended plane for Australian hardwoods. I don't have one, but I hear they are worth the money. There are also cheaper Asian imports, like the Mujingfang if you can get your hands on one. I do have one of them and they are top value for the price. Some people find the blade adjustment a bit of a knack, so maybe not the best for a beginner - but then it's not that hard to learn.

Good luck deciding.

No one plane will do everything you are likely to throw at it, Steve, but a few questions can help the guys here advise you:

1. can you already sharpen a plane blade so it shaves hair off your skin or are you gojng to have to learn?
2. what are you going to build - bookcases, fine chairs, picture frames, boxes?
3. are you going to use mainly Aussie hardwood or softwood, or mdf or what?
4. are you going to dress your timber with hand tools or are you going to joint and thickness using power tools?
5. are you one of the people (like me) who gets a real buzz out of making your own tool (or restoring a tool that used not to work so that it works as well as it ever could) or do you prefer to buy the tool so it works out of the box?

Finally there is the question of price. But we can discuss that once we know what you are doing.

Originally Posted by jmk89

No one plane will do everything you are likely to throw at it, Steve, but a few questions can help the guys here advise you:

1. can you already sharpen a plane blade so it shaves hair off your skin or are you gojng to have to learn?
2. what are you going to build - bookcases, fine chairs, picture frames, boxes?
3. are you going to use mainly Aussie hardwood or softwood, or mdf or what?
4. are you going to dress your timber with hand tools or are you going to joint and thickness using power tools?
5. are you one of the people (like me) who gets a real buzz out of making your own tool (or restoring a tool that used not to work so that it works as well as it ever could) or do you prefer to buy the tool so it works out of the box?

Finally there is the question of price. But we can discuss that once we know what you are doing.

hiya, thanks for yr reply, in short:
1 = no, will have to learn
2 = bookcases/coffee tables/chairs
3 = hardwoods and softwoods (playing with pine at the moment until i get more experienced)
4 = hand tools
5 = at this stage, until my knowledge base broadens, probably out of the box/ready to use

cheers
Steve

With what is said above. Now you will have to bone up on sharpening and that is a whole new field.
If I had the finances I would duck down to Lismore an have atalk to Terry Gordon and I would, personally buy one of his planes. ( Just so I could sit it in adisplay cabinet and admire it )

Originally Posted by SteveAdelaide

hiya, thanks for yr reply, in short:
1 = no, will have to learn
cheers
Steve

Steve,
Can be a world unto itself; sharpening Planes and Chisels.

Have a search for the Sharpening Day we had at Toowoomba,
for me, that was an Eye opening, Jaw Dropper.

Most thoroughly enjoyed,
and LEARNT lots that Day.

Originally Posted by SteveAdelaide

Hi all,
have been researching the site re the best plane for an absolute beginner, for versatility and price...is the LV LA Jack it?
And the really basic (some might say dumb!) question: what's the difference between the types of planes and their uses
How much should second-hand ones cost? or better off buying new??
Am seeking versatility above all else, just something to get me started.
cheers
Steve

All my planes are second hand Stanleys except for my Stanley 601/2 block plane which I bought new.
I have a # 3 ,#4 ,#5 and a #7 jointer and the 601/2 block plane and have just bought a very nice 9 1/2 block plane second hand.
I also have a large woodie jointer and a small smoother which I use occasionally.
I find with good sharpening methods I can do just about any planing required .
I use the scary sharp method.

I'm not sure if splashing out on an expensive plane for the first one is a good idea.
My advice is get a couple of second hand Stanleys and learn with them ,if you like what you are doing and once you get some experience and work out what you want to do then buy something up market .

There is nothing wrong with Stanley planes ,once tuned and sharpened they can do just as good a job as any other.
When you think about it Stanley planes have been around for along time ,most all the others are copies of a Stanley design.
They say that copying is the highest form of flattery ( some thing like that).


Kev.

Steve, as a fellow newbie I'd say you're best off buying a new one from Lie Nielsen, HNT Gordon or Veritas. They all come pre fettled and ready to use.

It is enough of a hassle learning to sharpen without having someone around to show you how without having to fettle or restore a plane as well!

Well I just got 4 stanleys on Ebay for about $100. That's $50 less than a new #4 and about a third of the price of a new Veritas.


Until now I've only had a Stanley #4 and it's been used for everything so I'm going with SilentC and recommending it as a first plane


And you can never have too many planes!

My 2 cents:

1. Since you are going to have to learn on something, I reckon it might be better to get one old Stanley, Record etc #4 or #5 (I would tend to a #5 - it wasn't called a "Jack " plane for nothing - it is a jack of all trades) and set to learning how to sharpen it - the best way is to have someone who knows show you - come one Adelaide Forum members: who will help Steve fettle a Stanely and learn how to sharpen the blade? Otherwise, choose a sharpening technique and master it (I reckon Piric or "scary sharp" is easiest to start with).
2. A jack plane will be a good start for those kinds of project, but you will need a block plane as well pretty soon.
3. OK, but please stay away from the really hard and gnarly stuff - you need high angle planes for them (HNT Gordons typically).
4. Jointing and thicknessing by hand is tough with only one plane. You need one plane to hog off the big bits, then something long to level and then a short one to smooth. That makes 3. You can do it all with a Jack but its tough. What you can do, though is, if you start with a #5, open the mouth up wide for the rough work and the close it down for the levelling and close it up really fine for the smoothing. This is a great way to learn about plane geometry and to understand what your plane can do.
5. This is where LN and Veritas etc have the real advantage. But its a lot to pay when you still don't know how to sharpen!

One final thing, I would invest in a good book on planes and planing. They will tell you how to "fettle" the plane and how to set it up and use it. Either Garrett Hack's The Hand Plane or the old standard, Planecraft, are a good place to start - see if your local library has them.

I'm on side with the budget buyer recommendations. There is so much to learn to get through your first couple of projects. It is easy to blame tool quality, but it is pretty much invariably technique that is the real issue.

Unless of course deep down you have an incipient TOOL COLLECTOR bug waiting to escape. In that case there is no hope and you may as well start rolling out the big bucks from day 1.

Checkout the video from the latest FineWoodworking issue http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworki....aspx?id=29821
You can only really do work like that consistently if you can sharpen a blade.

I had only watched the first video about the suggested basic handplane set when I posted the previous reply. I have since watched all 8 video presentations on the video page and they cover a lot of valuable advise with good demonstrations.

If anybody can work out how to save these videos to disk, please let me know. I have played around with the DownloadManager plugin for Firefox and saving to RealPlayer beta 11, but so far no luck!

Okay everybody I shall tell you how to save internet videos to disk. (using IE)

First step: Go into internet options and delete all the temporary internet files

Step Two: Load the video

Step Three! After the video had loaded, go into internet options - settings -view files and go down the massive list and you should find a video file

Step Futz! Copy that file and paste it wherever you keep your videos

Voila!


It used this method with the www.marleyturned.com videos

Funky C

Firefox has the Video Downloader extension to download videos from the net.

All these replies and no one mentioned the slope

So I'll give a warning first to SteveAdelade after buying your first plane consider yourself at the very top of an endless very steep slope that gets steeper the more planes you buy and consider the advice your getting as a helping hand (PUSH) on to the slope.

The advice given about older Stanley/Record planes is very good advice personally I would advise a Stanley #5 or maybe even a #5 1/2 as a first plane.

This is my 5 1/2 it's older than me, I'm 60 next year



The second plane to buy is a Stanley block 60 1/2


Before buying any more planes the next thing to buy is a Veritas MK11 honing jig and a couple of diamond stones, one fine one medium.

Now your on the slope and no known way of stopping.