Thread: Decent Woodwork Plans

I used to have touch-sensitive dreams


but my mum walked in the room

Seriph1
You really asked for this.
nah, I can't pay out on someone's mum.
Your mum probably has enough to worry about with your touch sensitive dreams to clean up.
You shouldn't take advantage of a bloke's honesty and turn it into a smutty joke, that's Al's job.

between this and the hand care forum

OBOY!!

Be nice now Kiddies

Originally Posted by

Be nice now Kiddies

I was nice, you should have seen what I'd written before I thought of you and softened it to "nah, I can't...."

Has anybody stopped to consider that by using the "Mr" title it may have been used in politeness by a young member who has been taught and absorbed good manners. Yeah I know they would be a minority; but if this is the case they should be welcomed, not abused.

hey presto; one young ex member.


Ken

OK OK OK, this has gone way to far. In the first place all I was trying to do was steer people in the direction of a site that won't cosct you anything for plans, just plain and simply, trying to help out and what do I get in return nothing but grief> I have already stated I think it is OK to sell plans, just not techniques and if you guys such as Mr Rocker or should I say Rocker( how dare I call somebody Mr.) want to sell plans for something as detailed as a rocking chair for a good price, as he has stated well he deserves the money. It is these corporations trying to make money out of us that I don't like, but if the individual bloke wants to sell them then so be it. I stated in my first thread that I was not meaning to offend Mr. Ozwinner cuase I knew he was just trying to help out, but I thought I had something more to offer. Anyway Mr. Hovo Mr. Sturdee and Mr. Different just slow down and realise I was not having a go at any of you for selling plans and I am definately not using Mr. to be condesending, but purely out of respect. Thank you Mr. Brslee Mr. Bob Wilson and Mr. Toggy for being understanding, I do have respect for my elders, especially elders in the WW game, because I realise they know more then I do. Having said that I am nearly 34 years old and am hardly a spring chicken and I have nearly 20 years experience myself, just because I am new to this site doesn't mean I am new to WW. Anyway 816 people have loggede onto my thread and only a handful have had a winge and the numbers keep growing everyday, so I think I have done the right thing, I rest my case.

Anyway I think I have figured out who to and who not to ask for advice in the future. I love you all.
MR. Hellacopter1

and a nice, inlaid mahogany case it is too



appreciate the response ....and that you realise people are doing all they can to assist and contibute to the fun of others

Mr Helacopter, (Do you mind if I call you Chopper, it's a bit less formal?)

Sadly I've been away on and off for a week or so and missed this stoush, but I'll just wade in anyway.

I have in the past made a living from SELLING my designs for LOTS of money, but of course they cost even MORE money to produce than you can imagine, so was lucky that I didnt go broke in the process.

I have a very firmly held belief that Free plans are mostly worth what you pay for them, but the real benefit is that you don't have much of a fight getting your money back when you aren't happy.

To my mind, free plans are just a starting point, a few are wonderfully detailed and works of art, most are, to use your words crappola.

If you feel so strongly about our right to free intellectual property, why not start a collection and distribution website of your own, collecting all the free plans on the web, and allowing free downloads for everyone.

Don't knock those doing it their way, start a proper FREE site!! Then you'll find out how much FREE really costs, and my develop some sympathy for others providing a service at nominal cost.

Cheers (the three pages late 'cos he's been dreamin'),
Mr P
(Midge to his mates).

Originally Posted by Rocker

Bob,

When there was a thread on copyright recently, I did a litlle research on the matter. As I understand it, (and I am not a lawyer, so this is just my summary of what I have read), you cannot claim copyright to a style, only to a particular design, which you must register, if you want to claim it as yours. Thus, for instance, Sam Maloof cannot sue me for making a rocker which is reminiscent of his design, since, in detail, my design is radically different from his, using different joinery and having an upholstered seat, rather than a solid-wood one. If you made a table which was a copy made from memory, you would merely be copying a style, not a design.

My feeling is that it would be very hard to sucessfully sue someone for breach of copyright in relation to a piece of furniture unless it could be established that it was an exact copy. Even if the design owner managed to establish that, I doubt if he would be able to recover sufficient damages to make such a prosecution worthwhile.

Rocker

Rocker, as I understand it, your understanding is heading in the correct direction. In essence, one can't patent an idea; one can only patent the expression of an idea. For example, let us assume that you and I invented the chair; we then manufactured and sold them. Other people then wanted to manufacture and sell chairs. We could not stop them from making chairs -- the idea of the chair is not patentable. However, the expression of the idea is patenable (in most circumstances); and hence, that is the intellectual property that people try to protect. If my memory serves me well, such protection expires after a period. Hence, you could hold a concert and play Mozart without penalty, but not the music, of say, The Rolling Stones. The justification of allowing Intellectual Property is the same for allowing the protection of any property right. Such justification includes the acceptance of Locke's Labour Theory, which in essence says that a person is entitled to the reward of his efforts.

Hellacopter 1,

Welcome to the board, they're not always this crabby, must be the time of month or something , they're usually big enough to give you a second chance and sometimes an apology so hang around 'cause they know what they're talking about when it comes to woodwork, you just need to tread carefully around the personalities.

My 2c, If it's free why pay for it, what would be nice would be to be able to see what you're getting before you part with the hard earned, because as mentioned you could get crapolla and many sites will be looking to turn a quick buck this way. Unfortunatley the net isn't like a shop where you can have a quick look at the entire contents and then decide whether to buy.

Maybe we should get off our arses and get off the net and go to a shop and have a browse, where's that plan shop again...?:confused:

HH.

Originally Posted by HappyHammer

Hellacopter 1,

Welcome to the board, they're not always this crabby, must be the time of month or something , they're usually big enough to give you a second chance and sometimes an apology so hang around 'cause they know what they're talking about when it comes to woodwork, you just need to tread carefully around the personalities.

It's all about the Phases of the Moooooon I think, and if you would kindly plot the above responses against a moon-chart you'd see what I mean!!

On the other hand, don't DARE tread carefully....no one else does!!

Cheers,

P

Thanx to Bitingidge ( I'll stop saying Mr. if you remember that I spell Hellacopter1 with 2 L's) Happyhammer and others I have already thanked for seeing things from my point of view> For the third time though I think it is great that individual guys can make some cash out of plans that are worthy of the money that you pay for them. It is these corporate types that I don't like, you all have to realise that thiat and nobody has commented on selling techniques, which I personally think hould be passed around among us and from generation to generation for the good of the craft and so we can all do a better job and enjoy it more as well. How about one of the 900 plus people who have given this thread the thumbs up telling us about what they think of the free plans and if they have decided to make anything. Once again I will admit that there is some crappola there, but you're bound to find something decent out of 21700 plans. As far as sites that charge for plans I subscribe to a site called plans now, which some of you will already now about and yes there plans are worth the money, they are very detailed and the type of furhiture they have drawn definately needs a plan to go by.
Anyway, I'll get of the soapbox, don't forget to tell us about the good plans you have found at the site.
Hellacopter1

Hellacopter1.

Thank you for your explanation in referring to board members as Mr. To me it seemed sarcastic and my apologies if I misconstrued your intentions. BTW I prefer to be addressed as Peter or Sturdee. not Mr.

However what caused me to critize your post was the inference on whether Rocker paid for plans or not. This BB is very friendly and such questions are not appropriate. I accept that it was not intended the way it read and as such I apologize.

I agree with the concept and desire for free plans, all my jigs etc are free, but if someone wished to charge for their plans that should also be respected.


Peter.