Thread: Essential tools: have your say!

Originally Posted by Chris Parks

The problem with sharpening is that until you have experience or someone to set you on the right path the new user does not recognise what sharp is and invariably goes through several sometimes (usually) expensive stages to get there as their awareness of what sharp is grows. If you can find someone who shows you what sharp is it saves a lot of angst and money spent for no good reason. I would hesitate to dob anyone in but I know of several people in Brisbane who could show you what sharp is supposed to be. I regret all the money and time it took me to learn how to sharpen and I could have saved many many hundreds of dollars along the way.

You're spot on Chris, but I actually think that's almost a microcosm of the problem with the whole hobby! eg, what Bench do I need, with what vices? These router thingys seem to do everything - should i grab a nice dovetail jig? The internet has fundamentally changed a lot of the initial learning curve, but not always for the good.

Personally, I'm the grandson of a pattern maker who still uses some of his hand made beech planes, which I've resoled in cherry. I think one of the best routes is making an awful lot of your initial, simple tools. There's a lot of more or less adequate, but expensive, gadgets out there that are unnecessary... A carpenter's mallet is not a scary proposition, or expensive if you stuff it up, but there are some subtleties to getting it right. A hardwood straightedge, beveled and finished to minimise movement, using a plane and a pencil/knife to guarantee absolute straightness is a lesson in simple geometry and appreciation of wood movement...Purchased feather boards or push sticks as opposed to making them? Give me a break! The list goes on, but we are digressing into other areas...

My take is probably a little different to some.

One good square. A Colin Clinton 150mm ideally.
2 good chisels. A little one, say 6 or 10mm, and a medium one, 19 or 25.

a couple of Japanese saws. One rip, one crosscut.

a bench of some sort. A hollow core door on a couple of decent saw horses will suffice.

a vice. Even a metalworkers vice will do.

a tape. Buy a good one and look after it. Don’t let the thing slam shut.

a 150 and a 300 stainless rule.

a good .7mm clutch pencil and a pack of 2b leads.

thats about it.

Ive seen far too many folk working with chisels that will never take a decent edge, let alone a good edge. Spend well on those two and learn to sharpen. A couple of diamond plates is a relatively economic and long lasting solution there. You don’t have to worry about flattening stones and your edges will be ok to use. If you get proficient with those things then you can add to the toolkit as needs arise.

buy the best quality tools you can afford, buy a little more than you can afford if you can. Look second hand, be patient. It is quite surprising what comes up on e bay and gumtree.

Buy few, buy good quality. You don’t need a set of anything.

best
b

For a hobbyist who needs a paying job, time is not infinite: he/she won't necessarily enjoy the 'zen' learning to hand craft each joint etc etc, if he just wants to get a table made for the kitchen...

This line of thought may force me to acknowledge that Phil is right: if you ditched the thicknesser and jointer, you could go DAR. Maybe ditch the table saw as well initially, and use some of the saved cash on a tracksaw?

I'd even forgotten what i'd used 40years ago when i started working with any wood.

I wouldn't even bother with a track saw... a basic circular saw with a shop built guide can accurately cut sheet goods to finished sizes with just a little care ... still do it to this day, but 40yrs ago didn't even have the circular saw. starting out you could use a jigsaw for a lot of things and despite it rarely being mentioned on this forum probably goes into the starter set.
I built a few speaker cabinet sets for my DJ work back then with some saw horses, old style MDF a jig saw, pencil, tap measure, drill and a screw driver, oh and some glue. 40yrs on and a pair of those with 18" subs still are as solid as the day they got built They are square and not gaps etc.

A drop saw for cutting stuff to length makes life easier.

There is of course great reasons to suggest people start with things like marking knives.

The reason i steered away from the basic table saw it that you either go right to the bottom of the pile and you will be forever fighting with it as a newbie, even some of the mid range stuff needs experience/knowledge to tune up or you are cashed up and the world is good.... i still use an old Ryobi TS bought from bunnings and it now cuts square and works fine but that took tuning and lots of work to get it right, something a newbie will likely not be up to nor have the tools like dial gauges etc to do it. I'm in the market for something better but it's lower on the list to a jointer and a better drill press.

Maybe this should be next forum challenge; make a simple piece of furniture using the cheapest tooling and materials you can acquire BUT it must be replicable by a novice. You know; just like we all were once...

So, like a small side table or bookcase. Built on a B&D workmate/kitchen table using DAR and a mix of tools; 2nd hand from a market stall, the cheaper end of the tool brands and homemade.

The cheapest sharpening kit and one that actually works is some Carburundum powder and a flat piece of cast iron followed by some green honing paste on a piece of MDF. The whole lot would not cost more than $50 and you will get VERY sharp tools and if done right it will give a sharpness that is equal to any other method. If you choose the hollow grind method with mini bevel a CBN grinding wheel is necessary but that is required for hollow grinding no matter what stones are used. Shapton do have a powder somewhat like Carburundum powder which works the same way and is available from Japan Tools in Sydney. Save money on sharpening and all the latest gizmos and buy something else.

I write the above owning Shapton Glass stones, the three stone series that Stu from Japan Tools in Tokyo used to sell, a Worksharp with more sharpening media than I can jump over and now covered in cobwebs, Veritas Mk2 Jig and accessories, a few diamond plates, oil stones and more and the powder method on cast iron does at least match any of the above. God knows how many dollars are tied up in that lot.

i know not strictly woodworking related, but a good computer.

This allows you to:
- Access the wealth of knowledge on the internet either via youtube, online tutorials, and last but definitely not least Woodwork Forums.
- Design and visualise your ideas via 3d modeling applications
- Looking at other designs/concepts/ideas to get your creative juices flowing
- Display your work to inspire others to take up the craft.
- Document any learnings, develop, share or buy plans.

I have made a few beds over the years and depending on design there is a big difference in skill set and tool requirements. Back in my early woodworking and with a young family I made some bunk beds and a double with DAR pine. There was some glue ups but the construction was mostly screwed together. My tool kit back them was limited. Only power tools were a circular saw, a sander, and a drill. Hand tools were a crosscut saw, a No4 plane, some secondhand chisels, about 6 F clamps, combination square, and of course a screwdriver(hand driven). I did have a bench with vice and saw horses. Those beds saw many years of use and were passed on to other family members.
Many years later I decided on a queen bed in hardwood with M&T joinery. A lot of M&Ts done by hand. By then I had all the gear. Jointer, thicknesser, table saw, bandsaw and more and better hand tools. I then found that I could not get sash clamps long enough so had to make 2 for that job.
What I am getting at is there are many ways to get a result and beginners can do a lot with basic tools. After building up a decent kit of tools some projects can still throw up a challenge.
Regards
John

Originally Posted by Chief Tiff

Maybe this should be next forum challenge; make a simple piece of furniture using the cheapest tooling and materials you can acquire BUT it must be replicable by a novice. You know; just like we all were once...

So, like a small side table or bookcase. Built on a B&D workmate/kitchen table using DAR and a mix of tools; 2nd hand from a market stall, the cheaper end of the tool brands and homemade.

I reckon that's a cracking idea... be really interesting to see what people did.

A new woodworker.
A new what am I going to build? woodworker.
A new 6 months down the road, do I really want to do this?

My advice is to:
Go somewhere they have to tools for the new woodworker to use.
Go somewhere they can teach you.
Go somewhere you can learn SAFETY.
Go somewhere you can build that first project that except for the education is useless.

After that first project you will know:
What tools you need.
What your next project will be.
What further education you need.

Tools and machines do not a woodworker make. Education and safety make a woodworker.
You want to start with ten and finish with ten.

Another early project I did (Aug. 1989) was to make a drying rack. I had been married 2 1/2 years, and just starting to use my under the house workshop. I used a plan in a book, but modified so it would fit under the bathroom bench where it still lives.
Tools I had would have been circular saw, tennon saw, electric drill, screwdrivers and chisels. All the material would have been off the shelf.
This was the first time (and last time) I hand cut tennons for the cross rail. While I was building it I bought a router and rounded over the end of the legs. I cannot remember how I did the cut out in the legs. I am pretty sure the leg/upright join is just a butt joint with a couple of counter sunk slotted head screws put in by hand. I do remember trying to get the six dowels into their holes on the cross arms was a pain, but they are still there today. Finish is just varnish.
This year I had to put a couple of screw in the cross rail as the glue had failed.

Is it fine furniture? No
Would it win any awards? No
Is it practical and useable? Yes! It is still used today to dry clothes and towels.

Originally Posted by rrich

A new woodworker.
A new what am I going to build? woodworker.
A new 6 months down the road, do I really want to do this?

My advice is to:
Go somewhere they have to tools for the new woodworker to use.
Go somewhere they can teach you.
Go somewhere you can learn SAFETY.
Go somewhere you can build that first project that except for the education is useless.

After that first project you will know:
What tools you need.
What your next project will be.
What further education you need.

Tools and machines do not a woodworker make. Education and safety make a woodworker.
You want to start with ten and finish with ten.

I tend to agree somewhat with the above ,I do know people who have done TAFE courses about woodworking understanding tools ,Timber how to use it to the best advantage one example as well.Usually good guidance here from people from the trades or manual arts.If time allows for attendance at these courses then of course the guidance would not go amiss.

Radio

Originally Posted by Chris Parks

The problem with sharpening is that until you have experience or someone to set you on the right path the new user does not recognise what sharp is and invariably goes through several sometimes (usually) expensive stages to get there as their awareness of what sharp is grows. If you can find someone who shows you what sharp is it saves a lot of angst and money spent for no good reason. I would hesitate to dob anyone in but I know of several people in Brisbane who could show you what sharp is supposed to be. I regret all the money and time it took me to learn how to sharpen and I could have saved many many hundreds of dollars along the way.

How true Chris !

The "worst" part about it is to spend an awful lot of time trying to figure out what to do and then, at the "end", not knowing if it is truly sharp or not....

Cheers Yvan

Haven't seen it listed explicitly but I reckon a drill press, even a smallish bench top jobbie, should be one of the early items of 'machinery'.