Thread: Gimmick or handy?

yeah tape measure.

I saw these being advertised on FB market place a while ago, and my initial thought was ooh that would be handy.

However giving it some thought i quickly realised its a complete waste of time and money for the following reasons.

- Mitre saws depending on how good of a saw you have, will have a decent amount of flex to them so having a digital readout uncessary
- Most mitre saw cuts that i do are to either break timber down or cut to length for framing purposes, neither require an absolute high deal of accuracy. Think guys on site do this with a tape measure and a circular saw
- Measuring out each piece of timber by sliding it through the wheel would be unbelievably slow, much quicker to measure once and set a stop block
- Don't know about your setup, but the wall that my Mitre saw sits on is about 5m wide, I've set the saw offset from the centre to allow me to get 3m on one side and 2 on the other, using this will mean you'll need a much bigger offset to accomodate the material you're cutting.
- As said above i mostly use Mitre saw to rough cut timber, which means alot of my boards are long and difficult to manage, having something hanging over the bed of the mitre saw is just asking to be smashed.

Other issues would be dependent on the saw as i wouldn't even know how you'll securely attach it to the fence to get accurate reading.

On the other hand, if you're doing one off cuts outside then this thing could come in handy, but then again its not that difficult to get a tape measure out either, which you would have just used to measure how long to cut.

yeah i think it would be good in a production shop or where a heap of repeat cuts are necessary. but as mentioned above, feeding it through every time could take a while compared to a stop block, but breaking long goods in to multiple bits (nesting) i can see it being handy

it really needs to be as close as possible to the blade so you can make small cuts on small bits of wood.

will I trust a $20 gadget to make something that I will charge the client $2000 for? I dont think so...

There is already a product called TigerStop in bigger shop, and they are not cheap.
If I have a lot of repeated cuts, I would use double mitre saw, I had an older Omga double mitre saw, manual slide to the dimension you require, you press the pedal, the double mitre saw will make a chop either simultaneously or sequenced out.

General philosophy:
In woodworking we strive for accuracy but being off by 1/100 or a couple of hundredths is relatively unimportant. If you are off by 0.02 or so it doesn't matter as long as all pieces are off by the same 0.02.

Setting a stop to insure repeatability is far more important than explicit accuracy.

I have seen the Tiger Stop. Yes it is nice, but in a home shop, questionable. It is much better to imbed a "T" track in the bench top and set stops.

Chipsaway have an i Gauging digital tape for a little more than the one in the link, circular and about the size of a standard 8m tape, maybe a bit narrower. Theirs can be set to read imperial (fractional and decimal) and metric. Electronics etc are inside the measuring wheel, so you place the wheel at the end of your material, or a mark that you have made, and roll along to get your size and make another mark, much like measuring with a tape except that you keep the measuring wheel in contact with the material. Most of the comments above would still apply. Big difference is that tapes crack or get cut, these things need batteries that go flat unexpectedly. Suppose they would be a bit like INCRA jigs, where you can get incredible repeatability if you need to match something prepped with it ages ago, and have accurate details of cut lengths etc, but for one off batch cutting, stops would be more time efficient, i.e. measure once, set a stop, and cut batch using the stop for reference.

Originally Posted by havabeer69

yeah i think it would be good in a production shop or where a heap of repeat cuts are necessary. but as mentioned above, feeding it through every time could take a while compared to a stop block, but breaking long goods in to multiple bits (nesting) i can see it being handy

I think I'll disagree on this 'un.

I've found that most production environments I've worked in have both docking saws (when breaking down long lengths) and seperate stations for accurate cuts.

The docking saws tend to be inaccurate (ie. not ideal for finished lengths), but they're robust and have long in/out-feed tables that are typically a roller setup. In use, the operator generally slides the piece away from the fence a bit before sliding the piece along for the next cut. Why? Because it's easier than sliding it along the fence... less friction. It makes a big difference when you're operating a docking saw for any appreciable length of time.

That doodad wouldn't make this any easier. It'd make things fiddlier, if anything.

These long lengths are often sized, jointed, moulded, etc. before being trimmed to final lengths at a more accurate station (ie. one where the blade doesn't get banged about as much as at a docking saw and retains accuracy.) These generally don't have in/out-feed tables per se: they're long enough to fit the piece on to make a cut but it doesn't need to be "fed through," so rarely use rollers. Again, adjustable stops are the norm here; I can't see this offering anything new or simplifying the job...


I really can't see it being popular with operators in most commercial shops I've worked... it would be considered just a gimmick by most, I think.


Now, in a home workshop it may be seen differently. Personally I wouldn't use one even if given one, but I can easily see others thinking it's the bee's knees. After all, at home we use a different set of criteria to a production shop and are willing to put up with minor inconveniences for what we perceive as an improvement.

The issue is not whether the method is usable, but whether the Seller is reliable. There is no information who the company is, or where they are based, or any web-based documentation or reviews to be found. Is it a scam?

For those interested, I have a Wixey version on my table saw ...



... and bandsaw ...



Damn useful!

Regards from Perth

Derek

Originally Posted by rrich

General philosophy:
In woodworking we strive for accuracy but being off by 1/100 or a couple of hundredths is relatively unimportant. If you are off by 0.02 or so it doesn't matter as long as all pieces are off by the same 0.02.

Setting a stop to insure repeatability is far more important than explicit accuracy.

I have seen the Tiger Stop. Yes it is nice, but in a home shop, questionable. It is much better to imbed a "T" track in the bench top and set stops.

Repeatability is the key. I've just had to do 13 sets of cuts for my current project, and each set of 4 all have to match 'exactly'. The only way to do it is to mark them out with a story stick and cut them using stops. I can live with 0.1mm inaccuracy, but not that much imprecision.

Mind you, my blind mate has just bought a talking vernier that measures to a precision of 0.01mm.

I'd treat that as a gimmick, certainly not for professional use.

My old work had a lovely Omga docking saw and CNC length stop reading to 0.1mm (punch in the length and hit go, also had more advanced features like incremental travel if you wanted a trench every x mm) which was used both for rough breakdown and for final cuts where convenience/efficiency was more critical than length (no one cares if their chair or sofa frame is out +/- 1mm). It got used pretty hard, but only took 15 seconds to recalibrate when needed and was definitely precise enough to take advantage of the 0.1 resolution.

Anything critical was cut on the panel saw.

Here is a video of my Omga AL129.

Pneumatic hold down so its 100% hands free, except loading/unloading. you press a foot pedal to activate the cut.

I slowed the cutting action down because this is my first cut. you can adjust the cutter head down/up speed to quick/slow with a knob.

and some photos of it.

the bed length is 5m.

omga al129.jpgomga al129a.jpgomga al129b.jpgomga al129c.jpg

Originally Posted by Albert

and some photos of it.

the bed length is 5m.

omga al129.jpgomga al129a.jpgomga al129b.jpgomga al129c.jpg

Impressive looking, but what is it good for?

As for the original thread, if you were building a house the gadget may be useful.

For furniture making, consistently is more important than accuracy so stick with a stop block.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Originally Posted by Damienol

Impressive looking, but what is it good for?

As for the original thread, if you were building a house the gadget may be useful.

For furniture making, consistently is more important than accuracy so stick with a stop block.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I used it to cut thousands of set lengths. health and safety wise your hands are no where near the blade, at one time I hired a part time boy to load/unload timber onto/off the machine.

it can do angular cut on both ends.

These saws are mostly used in metal work, I bought it from a aluminium extrusion company.

Originally Posted by derekcohen

The issue is not whether the method is usable, but whether the Seller is reliable. There is no information who the company is, or where they are based, or any web-based documentation or reviews to be found. Is it a scam?

Derek is on the money. That website is dodgy as all get-out. It's typical of scam websites that list reputable products at ridiculously low prices - they will always make some money due to human greed and stupidity. It's often seen with sites listing De Walt and Milwaukee tools, where every tool listed is less than $100.

In this case, that tool is actually a Reekon M1 Caliber, currently a kick-started project, with an RRP of $US150

M1 Caliber | A Better Way to Measure by REEKON Tools Inc. — Kickstarter

New Reekon M1 Caliber Miter Saw Measuring Tool Looks to Greatly Improve Productivity