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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
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    Default Glue lam thru a spindle moulder?

    While I've run plenty of timber thru spindle moulders over the years and across router tables etc - I've never had occasion to run any glue laminated timber thru a spindle moulder.
    Are there any potential traps for the unwary player?
    The glue lamination, is epoxy resin, so I'm hoping the butt glued joints will be stronger than the parent timber either side and thus the spindle molder cutters won't de-laminate the glued joints as they pass!.
    Keen to hear any input from anyone been down this particular path!.

    I have an idea that's a little tricky and I don't really want to spill the beans until I've made it and posted up the photos of the finished piece but I also don't want to fail in spectacular fashion on my first attempt and lose all my onkaparinga's in the process.

    So in that vein, I'm spilling the beans ahead of time, in case there's any words of wisdom anyone would like to impart before I proceed.

    In essence I want to make a jewelery box, out of glue laminated timber....and I want to pass that laminated timber thru a spindle moulder to put a feature curved shape to it, before I miter cut it into the final box shape....

    My plan is to make the 4 timber lengths for the sides of the box in one long piece (and the raised fielded panel lid & bottom panel) out of herringbone parquetry sheoak blocks... and then run it thru the saw to get long boards with a flat edge & then run it past the spindle moulder to put a shape on the outside before I make my miter cuts for the corners to join the sides into a box.
    I guess my concern is if the spindle moulder cutters might tear the epoxied herringbone parquetry pieces apart from each other rather than cut them as I'm hoping. I could always do it a little timber removal at a time in more than one pass...dropping the fence back a fraction at a time each pass until I have the full depth cut.
    I've searched a lot of box work pics on google images...and not seen anything like this - maybe I'll be the first....(or the last)....depending how it works out!
    It should work - just curious if this particular rice paper tail has been walked ahead of me is all and what the potential pitfalls are.

    I've made herringbone parquetry panels before today (imagine what you see on the basketball courts parquetry floors) as tops for coffee tables etc so am reasonably confident I can machine the timber and glue/cramp it up to get a reasonable result...then saw it into a long board/s for the box sides.

    My only worry is will the butt glued joints hold together going past a spindle moulder, when I start removing the timber and each subsequent block meets the cutters at a skewed 45 degree up and down angle of grain direction - to the block before it...

    I have a feeling in my water it might work OK...if I go steady steady.

    I am hoping for the outside appearance, resembling a zebra in front of a crazy mirror in the house of horrors!.

    It might look either great, or way too busy - will have to suck it and see I guess.

    In essence this simple little old Jarrah Box is my inspiration for the spindle moulder aspects - only I'll probably scale it up a bit and maybe a slightly different profile. (not one of mine - its a bit rough in execution - but it conveys the idea well enough for this exercise).



    And I will glue and cramp up then re-saw the board/s I run thru the spindle moulder out of small blocks of WA Sheoak joined in this style of pattern.



    Will probably make a similar herringbone parquet raised fielded panel in a frame for the lid and maybe CNC a light contrasting timber inlay into it... not sure what exact design yet.

    Wish me luck - I've a feeling I'm likely to be needing it.

    If I don't come back you'll all know I'm in hospital getting some or all of the onkaparinga's re - attached.!

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  3. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
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    bilpin
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    Default

    Fingers that have been through a spindle moulder are usually not worth reattaching. Spindle moulders tend to bite one and then chew what they've already got.
    One of the best pieces of kit is a power feeder. It is so much nicer to see a bit of wheel rubber shoot out rather than a piece of your anatomy. That said, the job can be done on a spindle using small cuts. Also be aware of grain direction when glueing up your composite pieces, if the direction reverses piece to piece you will get a rough finish off the moulder.
    IMHO a spindle moulder without a power feeder is not a tool, its a weapon.

  4. #3
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
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    Perth
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    665

    Default I couldn't

    I couldn't agree more Rusty Nail - about a power feed.

    I've been looking for one - even seen one at Carbatech new for about a grand.

    Thing is I've been asking now for a while thru the Robland owners user group - who could recommend a make, model, brand of Power feeder that would go well with my Robland X31 combination machine.

    Do you think I can find anyone who's, done it (installed one) that can give me a recommendation on what they used?

    I did find this Utube vid...of someone who's fitted a power feed to his Robland x26

    robland spindle moulder - YouTube

    Trouble is a few things -

    1. I can't read what make, model, brand he's fitted. Edit - silly me - I found out you can enlarge the vid to full screen & it seems to say KUrO as the brand but now I can't even find that on the internet! Some days... I wonder.

    2. If you watch the timber exit the feeder in the video & keep an eye on the verticle support column and horizontal support arm - the feeder has a large amount of movement from it's set downwards clamping pressure...as the timber exits the feed rollers.
    I see that he's attached a small cast square table to the end of his moulder bench and attached the vertical support stem of his power feed to that - which the newer Robland models come fitted with - but mine doesn't have this. When at the WWshow last weekend I went into Beyond Tools exhibit as they are the Robland agents in WA and they had some of the new Robland models on display - including this little square add on cast table, that the power feed bolts too.
    They tell me that I can buy this as a OEM spare part, from Robland Belguim - thru them...and once I have it and bolt it up to my table - then I will have a platform I can attach/bolt a power feeder upright stem to! I suspect the 'movement' that I am seeing in the video - if it's in the attachment of that small square cast power feed support table to the main cast table - then the attaching bolts (or main cast table edge) could fatigue crack with repeated use.

    So I am having trouble deciding just how is the best way to do this.... I am sure I could jury rig something ugly if I was determined enough but that's not my preferred style usually. I'd like to do it right - but finding someone who's done this - to get the exact details....

    I'll get there - like everything...it just takes time...all part of the journey as Bob L advised me so wisely not so long ago.

    In the interim I'll make some feather boards to hold pressure against the cutter head and use a long push stick so fingers don't get anywhere near the moulder head.

    In all those 20 years I've never had a power feed and at this point I still have all 10 fingers and toes - so i am usually pretty careful, and more so around moulders, they literally give me the hebegebe's

    Another consideration - being a combination machine, is ease of removing the power feed....when it would be in the way for another operation... that needs to pass say sheet material over that section of table to get the width of cut I am after off the saw for e.g.

    The hunt for options goes on.

  5. #4
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    Default

    Good to hear you have previous experience with spindle moulders. Your finger board and push stick set up is the way to go in the absence of a power feeder. I have a robland nlx310 with the attachment for a feeder. I have two feeders that I use on the machine, depending on what size the material is. For small stuff I use a carbatech junior feeder and for larger material a carbatech cabinet maker. The junior also get used on router table and works well. These two units are .25hp and .50hp respectively.
    On my previous robland, I fabricated a piece of heavy angle iron and mounted that on the end of the table and bolted the foot of the power feeder to that. Worked fine for many years. The .50hp power feeder is much superior to the smaller model but is also quite heavy, which is a pain when not a permanent fixture. I find the junior a bit short on power and requires "help" to get some material through, but at least it keeps the operator clear of the cutters. I have always expected the poor little chap to die mid way through a job, but to his credit, 10yrs on, he continues to chug away provided I give the necessary assistance as and when required.
    I do have a spare Robland table extension should you require one.

  6. #5
    Join Date
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    Default Pick me - pick me...

    Amazing - I can't thank you enough for that advice...

    I was wondering about the carbatec power feeders and was contemplating a trip out to their showrooms tomorrow, to have a look at them.
    It's nice to hear from someone who has them and has used them and can give first hand feedback.

    Indeed if you have a spare table extension - then yes please - can I put my name on it? (Let me know by PM what you'd like for it and I'll sort it out ASAP).

    I might just start with the junior feeder and if demand eventuates for its big brother - get that at a later stage maybe.

    I saw Carbatec sell some kind of metal table clamp arrangement for their feeders that looks easy / simple enough and as tho it would be easy to install and remove - but I'd prefer a table extension and bolt it to that if possible and you don't mind passing on your spare to a new home?.

    I didn't know you had a Robland - are you a member of the Robland X31 email group on yahoo?

    You're more than welcome to book mark the Facebook Robland X26/X31 owners group page and post up anything you wish there (same goes for anyone else with a Robland machine of the x26 or x31 families, who's reading along).

    This is the link for anyone wants it.

    https://www.facebook.com/RoblandX26X...x_wizard=true#

    Thanks Rusty Nail - you've made my day.

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