Thread: Are joints like this really hiding screws ?

Almost certainly. The button gives it away.

Originally Posted by Handyjack

Almost certainly. The button gives it away.

But the guy who makes them insists that he does everything by hand...implys he does it properly.......

what exactly do you mean by a button anyway ?

The 'button' could be the turned end of the cross pieces.

Jake, you would have to suspect they are buttons hiding screw heads. It's unlikely they are dowels going through into the stretchers.

Perhaps they are just decorative flourishes, & there's nothing in there. It seems to me that screws shouldn't be needed, if the stretchers are doing their job. I've always thought of stretchers as pre-tensioning the legs, so that they move very little under the weight of a sitter (how else did they get the name?). There should be very little tendency for them to pull out of their sockets, & if there is, a screw into end grain isn't going to hold them for very long, methinks. I make stretchers so that it's a struggle to get them in, and don't even bother with glue....

Cheers,

Originally Posted by IanW

. It seems to me that screws shouldn't be needed, if the stretchers are doing their job. I've always thought of stretchers as pre-tensioning the legs, so that they move very little under the weight of a sitter (how else did they get the name?).

Thats exactly what I would have thought.....

but, I mean I've been talking to many professionals about this. At the guys display. Talking probably... 20-30 blokes.... with a collective professional experience probably in the 100's of years. PROFESSIONALS ! The real mckoy. Highly successful industry workers. Highly skilled types with persuasive tones.... and they all say in a scoffing manner.... SCREWS.....Say it really loudly too to scare off potential customers , which I don't mind actually, because I too, am intimidated by small time woodworkers who just want to do a good job and survive enough to stay off the dole ().

The bastard. I think in my spare time I'm going to actually going to pay to travel to confront him in person. Maybe bring a mate along, so we can simultaneously puff our chests out and glare at him. Better start practising. Staring without blinking could take some practise.

SCREWS ! .... Found some dirt ! ...another charlatan. Can't wait to tell everyone on facebook.

I apologise for the deception, but I'm not looking forward to another weekend of the same old boring crap.

(just an opinion)
picture 1 and 2 shows the joint.....all it is, like Cliff mentioned, is simple the joint exstending through. Just trace around and rounded over by hand to the line. Actually takes a fair bit of time to do.

For strength in the undercarriage all thats important is the joints in compression. Everything else is just asthetics.

Whats common is when the end grain of a joint is seen, you drive a wedge in so it has that ' wedged no screws' look.
Picture 3 shows that . Industry loves flush surfaces because there so quick to clean up. Just ruffly cut off the wedge proud then roll an orbi over it, then hand sand a bit and its all done in minutes. Wedge isn't really needed. But have to do it because it connects with peoples perseptions of whats 'perfessional' .

I like protruding joints because, it makes the joint look like its exstending through. Bit like a ruff sketch of a chair, with the lines passing one another. The other thing is gets more personal. Some you have to pear after glue up. The only way I feel I can do that is with a pearing knife. A knife you make specifically for that purpose. Takes focus and is far more interesting for me to do than blast it with more ####ing grit.

the other thing I like about rounding the end of the joint is it will compensate some for stepping. Stepping won't be anywhere near as noticeable over a flat sanded surface if it decides to step down the track.

So thats the joke of it.

A screwed buttoned joint is being used to describe it and imply 'cheap and nasty'. (screws are great for outside furniture (lance, Adrian)!) yet the reality of it, is the joints actually the opposite. Time and effort has made it a better joint.....but stupid me, because my head was so into it so much, it didn't even click that it looks like a button, which gave the dirt searching types dirt.

(just an opinion)

What's the point of using a screw into the End grain of the stretcher...not really a great addition to the strength.
All the old chairs I have seen do not go all the way through and rely on the dowel or tenon glued into the mortice.

My first thought was screws, but then I saw the other pics and realised that the 'button' is too small to be hiding a screw of useful size anyway.

I like the look of the wedge - can't tell if it's a 'button' or flush - but it would serve only a cosmetic purpose if it's all made properly, as I'm sure your are. Still, people pay for appearance as well as utility, so if it sells, go for it!

Now you've really confused me! So it's one of your chairs - you lost me with the Ikea bit, which I now take to mean you were wondering if it looked Ikea-ish as protruding buttons? (It does. )

It looks better to me in the wedged incarnation - wedges look more pre-industrial to my eye. As I said above, you shouldn't need to restrain that joint, but it's a neat decorative touch...

Cheers,

Originally Posted by IanW

(It does. )

,

I new it ! ....the bastard. Lets get this fraud. I can tell by the way he writes he's an angry man....mmmm...that must mean for certain that he's abusive to his family. There's an angle to get him.....His poor wife and children. Lets get at him that way, as we know whats best.

Lets activate the legions. We need some strength. Lets talk up some strong men to come in and puff their chests up at him. They'll be keen because that'll be empowering for them. Have them get in close to her to 'save' her from this man. This'll, hopefully, help to enforce our meddling cause, because, understandably it'll make him feel angry. ....And angry men are definetly guilty ! Anger always implys he's been caught out. So that'll fit neatly.

Do it enough to him that when he speaks out he'll look paranoid... That'll also work in well our ideas of Karma.

Enough public pressure in this way will finally drive him out, despite the possibility that he's actually quite stable and very good to his family. and that in meddling is actually going to make things worse.

(thats just joke. uno, just in case, some noisey deadshit wants to meddle some more....)

I wonder how many religious groups will try and 'save' me tomorrow, as the confused are so easily recuitable. A must I suppose if their middle aged.....look I'm confused

(Thats just a joke deidre.... I'm not trying to offend there. Deidre's just my imaginary friend. I quite like the name Deidre. Just gota be careful, as I may offend some dirt searching local whose brother was very fond over his great Aunt whose name just so happened to be Deidre. A lovely lady I would never want to offend.