Thread: Skillion or Gable...That is the question?

G'day Bill.
If I was you, I'd get hold of a copy of the timber framing span tables for your state.
A 8x4 Metre area is bloody huge for a skillion.

As to timber floor for the flight. I would use reject rail sleepers laid edge to edge. That way they could be hosed off.
Or.. lay a bed of sand and lay pavers. Once the pavers are down, pour on a runny cement and sand mix to fill the gaps and lock the pavers in place.

No timber flooring that I know of would stand up to the hose off.

Hope this helps.
Hooroo.
Regards, Trevor
Grafton

Bill,

Concrete first. It's the way the best timber to use!!!

If you can't afford concrete, you probably can't afford to buy timber which will be suitable (and really isn't suitable anyway).

All you are looking for is a vermin proof finish that you can hose out, rather than a lump of structure.

If you are able to hire a mixer, one way round your problem is to build 600 square "tiles" in situ. You really only need 50 mm thick, and do it in small grabs.

Why not level some bedding sand, sprinkle cement over it and give it a gentle sprinkle?

Cheers,

P

G'day Trevor and P,

Thanks for your quick response, I now know I'll build the bird-room with a Gable roof. As you so rightly point out Trevor, an 8m X 4m skillion roof is a large SOB and it will be easier for me to do as a gable roof.
Your idea of using railway sleepers in the flights is a good idea, as is your sand bed with pavers on top but I know...as P has pointed out...concrete is the only real way to go.

And by the way P...the reason I say the concreting was too expensive...I object strongly to doing all the formwork, then paying three blokes 26 hundred dollars for two to three hours work and paying for the concrete on top...I have been in the construction game in many parts of the world for a lot of years...the last job I and my little mob did in the building game? I built the car parks in front of the Corio Bay Roadhouse...I closed my business after that...but I believe I can still see when some jokers are trying to screw me!

So I think I'll do the actual bird-room in timber with yellow tongue or 3/4" marine ply flooring? then tile it.

I'll do a 50mm concrete floor for the 4m X 2m flights which will be on the North facing side of the structure. The flight floors should only take about .4 of a cubic metre and busted back or not...I can handle that.
I'm not suposed to lift any more that 10kg...but what the doc' don't know won't hurt him .

Once again Thanks for your ideas on this, they're much apprecated.

Cheers for now,

Bill...kando
Geelong

Bill

Span tables would be the way to go and you will probably need then whether you build a skillion or a a gable roof. It sounds as though you will need building approval and your best bet may be to consult your local building inspector. He will give the go ahead for your project so if he has advised timber sizes you know they will be approved. Generally it pays to keep onside with them and they can be very helpful. It is after all part of why you have to pay the council a fee.

Conversely they get really difficult if you try and pull a fast one.

You don't have to lose your rainwater off the rear of a gable roof. Collect from that gutter and bring it back along the side into the downpipe at the front of your shed. That seems too simple, I am wondering if I missed something there.

On the flooring problem I can see some issues. Hosing creates a potential mess. Mud etc if the floor is not sealed. You definitely need provision to clear away the water even if you end up with concrete. Suggest a very slight fall to the floor and chanels outside to drain water away.

Regards

Paul

G'day Paul,

The concern is not about "loosing" rainwater into my neighbours property...my concern is that it's against the law to dispose of rain water, or any other water, onto a neighbour’s property.

In our area of Geelong it is also against the rules to have a window on the shed/building wall that will sit on the fence line...unless the council have changed the rules since I last built a shed anyway I’ll check-up with one of our local building/by-laws inspectors.
I have no worries about the plans…I’m still in touch with the construction engineer I used in the past…so I’ll have Adrian do the plans for me.
It was just that I was pretty set on a skillion roof but after some consideration I, or rather the birds, should be happier in a shed with a gable roof…it will be cooler for one thing (I’ll also have a whirly bird hot air removal fan, maybe 2, on the roof) and I’ll be able to cut and handle all the materials on my own…I do have brothers nephews and a few mates but!...Try getting anyone to help!…It’s funny how people always have other plans when I want a helping hand! Brothers, Nephews, Mates! They “all” suddenly have too much on their plate or have another excuse for not giving a helping hand!
My nephew, who lives just round the corner, was “supposed” to help me with doing-up my backyard, front-yard and this new bird-room, well; that was seven months back!
I have finished my front-yard and most of my backyard, now I want to start on my new bird-room/shed and finish the back of my backyard and my nephew is still on about “leave it till next weekend Uncle Bill and I’ll come help you then” That has been his war-cry from the start…had I waited till “his” next weekend…nothing would have got done!

Okay Paul, thanks for the input, it’s much appreciated mate but as I said, I’ll have my engineering mate draw-up the plans before I do anything, that way all "should" go smoothly.

Cheers,

Bill…kando
Geelong

Kando

Using steel purlins will span 4 metres no problem as rafters in a skillion. I have a program that can design an 8 x 4 metre structure using steel.

If you like I can run it through the program and sent it to you if you PM your e-mail to me.

Just a couple of things though. Is it freestanding or attached to a building.

Steel is a lot lighter to handle than timber and this structure would come as a kit and would only take 2 people to put it up and would come with steel posts. to support it. You could give it to your engineer to check it out.

G'day Barry,

Thanks a lot for your kind offer mate but I feel that I "need" to go with a timber shed for the sake of the birds...I have been breeding show canaries for a lot of years.

I already have a steel colour-bond shed/bird-room of 4.5m L x 2.8m W x 2.2m H with a skillion roof and I used C purlins for that shed.
Unfortunately my steel shed generates a lot of heat on hot days...even with the door and windows open.
About two years back we had a day when the temp' in the shade got to over 50, I was doing a job on a friends PC down the cost but I raced home when I realised just how hot it was getting...I was to late...all my poor birds but three, had met a dreadful death from thirst and heat! The water in the bird’s glass drinkers was so hot I could not handle the bottles without first putting on gloves!
I lost all but three of my beautiful show winning birds, adults, chicks of all ages and those that were still in the shell...all perished on that one hot day!
Years of work all gone in one day...but No creature should die like that.
I swore I would never let any animal in my care die like that again if I could possibly help it...and so I believe I need to build a timber building...with proper ventilation and insulation...and a sprinkler system on the roof (to help cool down the shed on those one-off extremely hot days).

I have been informed that timber buildings do not heat-up as much as a tin sheds and the environment within a timber shed is easier to control...don't know how true that is but it sounds like a true statement to me.
I will take down my old steel colour bond bird-room and a large fernery that stands along side of it and replace them with a new timber bird-room and flights; so the structure will be free standing.

I am at present waiting for a set of plans that may be suitable for a largish timber shed. They are coming from a mate in the states, I have also discussed things by phone with my civil engineering mate, now I'll wait till I receive the plans from my mate in the states, see if I can alter them to suit my needs, draw up some drawing of what I have in mind...then take the lot over to my engineering mate and see if we can make it all come together!

My American mate lives in Michigan, if you have not had the pleasure of visiting Michigan in winter when it's snowing...let me tell you, it gets real cold and it snows real hard...it's nothing to see 3, 4, 5, or 6 ft of snow and the timber buildings the yanks build stand-up to and handle all that snow and all other kind of weather...no problem! So if it's good and strong enough for the yanks...and all that snow…it's good enough for me...the same timber building should stand-up to our much milder weather here in Geelong, Vic!

Once again Barry; thanks a lot for your kind offer but I think I'll go with timber for this project...unless someone can convince me going with steel would be better and after that one bad day when I lost my birds…that will not be easy.

Best regards,

Bill...kando
Geelong