Thread: Tools only sold in USA that you couldn't do without?

Originally Posted by markharrison

The gouging of Australian consumers was, and still is, a hobby of multi-nationals. I've seen it from the inside. I know how it works.

Mark, the goal post just got moved from one supplier to many. I too was in retail and wholesale (automotive) and seen what happens but that is not Festool which seems to be the centre of this off topic debate. Festool don't care, they are the one honest company in Oz that shows it like it is unlike all the others who don't. Then there are the suppliers who will not warranty OS purchases and I can't see anything wrong with that either.

Every country that Festool operates in has the exact same complaints from the retail customers who want to buy their product, every single one of them without exception so Festool has the same policy world wide with no favours to any market. In my experience Festool Oz has had only one true sale that I can recall and that was when they removed Protool from the market place and held a true fire sale of the remaining product they had in stock at pricing that must have been below their wholesale cost or very close to it.

Keep in mind also, Festool's main market is industry and trade not hobby retail customers and the price to a business is not the same as to a retail customer because the business can expense the tools they buy. I simply don't get why people complain about their pricing because apart from a few unique products the same tool can be bought from an alternative source.

Originally Posted by Chris Parks

Festool don't care,

Well, there is something we agree on Corporations are, by their very nature, sociopathic and short term goal oriented.

Originally Posted by Chris Parks

they are the one honest company in Oz that shows it like it is unlike all the others who don't. Then there are the suppliers who will not warranty OS purchases and I can't see anything wrong with that either.

The only honesty is in not attempting to deny what is a stone cold fact. That is still better than the standards of the 45th president of the United States; but that is a very low bar indeed...

Originally Posted by Chris Parks

I simply don't get why people complain about their pricing because apart from a few unique products the same tool can be bought from an alternative source.

And I have bought their one unique product worth owning. I (as well as everyone else that bought one item) knowingly got screwed over on that one item relative to what it can be bought for elsewhere.

I will live with it.

Doesn't make me a happy customer though. Not a business model that has a shelf life longer than when their patents expire.

Originally Posted by markharrison

Festool prices are consistently higher here than elsewhere by about the same margin. See my point earlier about their abrasives lines. There can be no excuse for that except; because they can, so they will. Nobody expects after sales service on a consumable like abrasives.

Mark, respectfully, I'm still not seeing the price difference played out - assuming we're talking about a price difference between Australia and other countries.

Back in my original post, I did (admittedly a non exhaustive) comparison on pricing between Australia and the country of manufacture: Tools only sold in USA that you couldn't do without?

If someone wants to present further comparative evidence I'd be most interested to see it.

You are going to have to take my word for it but I had a detailed reply and the forum ate it. Here are some links and comparison shop for yourselves:

50 x P150 Rubin 2 150mm disks:

Local Festool Store: Rubin Abrasive Disc D150mm 48 hole P150 - 50 Pack

Amazon USA: Robot Check

Woodcraft has the same item at $40USD.

Same product, same part number, made in the same Eastern European factory, and with zero expectation of after sales service.

Draw your own conclusions.

Originally Posted by markharrison

You are going to have to take my word for it but I had a detailed reply and the forum ate it. Here are some links and comparison shop for yourselves:

50 x P150 Rubin 2 150mm disks:

Local Festool Store: Rubin Abrasive Disc D150mm 48 hole P150 - 50 Pack

Amazon USA: Robot Check

Woodcraft has the same item at $40USD.

Same product, same part number, made in the same Eastern European factory, and with zero expectation of after sales service.

Draw your own conclusions.

Sure - and here are my calculations.

Specials occur from time to time in any given location, they are "luck of the draw" and IMO should not form part of a price comparison.

In any case, your Amazon link tells me "This item cannot be shipped to your selected delivery location. Please choose a different delivery location.". I have it set to Australia.

I went to Woodcraft. It also tells me I can't ship to Australia (all discussed previously).

On both of those bases, I will take the normal price. USD$40.00 converted to AUD = AUD$56.06.

This doesn't take into account shipping. I fiddled in the Woodcraft store, and figured out they want a minimum of USD$3.90 for shipping. That works out to AUD$5.47.

This gives us a total AUD price for the product, including shipping to a US address, for a US purchaser, of AUD$61.53.

The Australian product from the Festool store is AUD$72.50, however, that is *including* GST.

If I remove the GST, the price is AUD$65.91. I am also not including shipping, as there is none - Festool will ship at no charge in Australia due to COVID. Thus, the price to an end user in Australia without tax is $65.91.

Before anyone cries foul - the US price does not include US sales tax either. And if we're going to calculate things, we should work exclusive of sales or GST or VAT type taxes (Festool are not responsible for government policy, and as with any manufacturer, tax is added to a finished product).

On the basis of these calculations, we have a price discrepancy between the two countries of AUD$4.38.

I would propose that this does not equate to a meaningful difference, and currency fluctuation alone will easily account for this type of difference over time.

<wisdom learned through fire>
For Festool - second hand IS my friend.

Bargains GALORE.

Most tools if they are not beaten to death by a tradie are essentially unused.
</wisdom learned through fire>


Now, to my point!....

I think everyone is conned into buying the latest whizz-bang doodad regardless of hobby or sport. I don't think there is a person alive that doesnt think "if Only They Had that new pair of shoes/bat/device/pole-vault/camera that they would perform better".

Nope. All a distraction. I think its ultimately part of wanting to belong to a group (wearing the right shirt/jumper, etc).

A good woodworker, I realise now, ONLY needs EXACTLY the right tool for the job and that tool is invariably well used by the hands using it.

I read a book once called (???) The Anarchists Toolchest by Schwartz (sp?) and in it I remember his reminisce of essentially "I bought every last doodad, then sold the lot and did basic handtools, then repeated this whole process 3 more times". I think he was trying to outline the fundamental struggle we all face in adversity.... that is, watching an expert doing dovetails creates an essential desire for us to be the same.... so we emulate. To do so we copy, buy a hand up, and if needed - cheat .

(If ONLY I had that magnetic dovetail gauge... and saw guide.... and the special marking knife... and those special pointy chisels.... I could do that too).....and and and and ..... errr, nope!


Basic tools, well maintained, kept SHARP do a LOT of VERY fine woodworking. Many on this forum I'm in envy of for this.

There are many online instagrammers/youtubers who are the same - they are great - but in my mind the truly great woodworkers are those who just get down and DO IT.

I'll post up a little list, but I'd think they would be:

PaskMakes
tatsu.suga
aklein2303
mekwoodworks
lacabraenlaescalera
https://www.instagram.com/yoshidatategu/
https://www.instagram.com/vaskosotirov/
https://www.instagram.com/pekovichwoodworks/
https://www.instagram.com/tannoworks/
https://www.instagram.com/s.d.woodcraft/
https://www.instagram.com/takekagoya/
https://www.instagram.com/scrollsawscribbler/

and about 20 amazing Aussie examples.... but a BIG call out to https://www.instagram.com/hntgordon/ for HNT Gordon is one of those transcendent woodworkers.....

I'm ultimately attracted to all of them, not because of the TOOLS THEY USE but how they use them. The tools don't define their artistry.

I also don't think (or remember) seeing gimmicky crap in their shots either.

You have to love how some threads just get way off track, but they provoke thoughts and provide info some of may not know.
Going back to the original topic, here is a tape measure that my old mate Paul39 showed me in Asheville Hardware, one of the best country shops you can find and I loved it so much I bought about 15 of them, one on every machine, in every toolbox, even some spares. Doesn't matter which way you point it you don't have to read upside down.
Well, it took a few years but you can buy them here now, such is life.
Rgds,
Crocy.

Originally Posted by Old Croc

......
Going back to the original topic, here is a tape measure that ...... you don't have to read upside down.

Well, it took a few years but you can buy them here now, such is life.
Rgds,
Crocy.

But it doesn't meet the topic, Crocy - tools that are only sold in USA ....

As you say later, the FastCap tape measure is now stocked in Australia by Timbecom and only $17.90.
https://www.timbecon.com.au/fastcap-...k-tape-measure

All that waffle about alleged gouging by Festool does not meet the topic either. In fact, I do not think any Festool products are made in America or exclusive to America.

Semantics

Originally Posted by GraemeCook

But it doesn't meet the topic, Crocy - tools that are only sold in USA ....

As you say later, the FastCap tape measure is now stocked in Australia by Timbecom and only $17.90.
https://www.timbecon.com.au/fastcap-...k-tape-measure

All that waffle about alleged gouging by Festool does not meet the topic either. In fact, I do not think any Festool products are made in America or exclusive to America.

As per my earlier comment.

Originally Posted by GraemeCook

But it doesn't meet the topic, Crocy - tools that are only sold in USA ....

As you say later, the FastCap tape measure is now stocked in Australia by Timbecom and only $17.90.
https://www.timbecon.com.au/fastcap-...k-tape-measure

All that waffle about alleged gouging by Festool does not meet the topic either. In fact, I do not think any Festool products are made in America or exclusive to America.

Yep, fair enough, but they weren't when I last traveled, I thought it might have been an interest to some, so I will leave the discussion.
Rgds,
Crocy

Originally Posted by Midnight Man

Sure - and here are my calculations.

Specials occur from time to time in any given location, they are "luck of the draw" and IMO should not form part of a price comparison.

In any case, your Amazon link tells me "This item cannot be shipped to your selected delivery location. Please choose a different delivery location.". I have it set to Australia.

I went to Woodcraft. It also tells me I can't ship to Australia (all discussed previously).

On both of those bases, I will take the normal price. USD$40.00 converted to AUD = AUD$56.06.

This doesn't take into account shipping. I fiddled in the Woodcraft store, and figured out they want a minimum of USD$3.90 for shipping. That works out to AUD$5.47.

This gives us a total AUD price for the product, including shipping to a US address, for a US purchaser, of AUD$61.53.

The Australian product from the Festool store is AUD$72.50, however, that is *including* GST.

If I remove the GST, the price is AUD$65.91. I am also not including shipping, as there is none - Festool will ship at no charge in Australia due to COVID. Thus, the price to an end user in Australia without tax is $65.91.

Before anyone cries foul - the US price does not include US sales tax either. And if we're going to calculate things, we should work exclusive of sales or GST or VAT type taxes (Festool are not responsible for government policy, and as with any manufacturer, tax is added to a finished product).

On the basis of these calculations, we have a price discrepancy between the two countries of AUD$4.38.

I would propose that this does not equate to a meaningful difference, and currency fluctuation alone will easily account for this type of difference over time.

That is a very complete answer; to a different question.

The question (as it evolved) is: Are we being charged more for the same Festool item in Australia?

And I think I will leave it there as an exercise for the reader.

I've been giving this some thought. Its a challenging question!

I don't think there is really anything that fits the bill. Everything of importance is sold here... and the rest fall firmly into the Very Nice To Have category, but hardly necessary.

Here is, after 2 days of SOLID Thought, my answer!

.... Bridge City Toolworks, with their FANTASTIC Kerfmaker (Kerfmakers KM-1/ KM-2 – Bridge City Tool Works)


This tool is the absolute Bee Knees. I did a mini group buy to reduce postage years ago and I've used mine as an absolutely indispensable tool for the table saw.

Screenshot_2020-09-30 a3 jpg (WEBP Image, 1755 × 1241 pixels) - Scaled (59%).png

Hi wP,

I bought one of those from BCT in the US and agree it is invaluable. However, the tool (not brand) doesn’t need to come from the US. Knockoffs can be bought from Bangood for $A37:
Drillpro table saw slot adjuster mortise and tenon tool woodworking movable measuring block Sale - Banggood.com