Thread: How to do veneering

Originally Posted by Mr Brush

Thanks John - I've watched a few videos on the Roarocket system, and the only weak point seems to be sealing the bag. I have no doubt that the pump arrangement would work just fine.

I've used (someone else's) commercial vacuum press gear, and wonder if the split-pipe/rod seal arrangement could be applied to the Roarocket bag? Belt and braces approach might be to use this AND the sealing tape? I don't like the look of systems that run the pump continuously to maintain vacuum, but the one I used only ran the pump to top-up the vacuum from time to time.

I've found West System epoxy with the slow-curing hardener to work well for veneering (applied thin with a foam roller), but have to admit that I went to this without really exploring what the different PVA formulations could do. Might be time I rethought that one.

I only have a Performax 16/32, but it is a truly wonderful bit of kit - don't know how I ever managed without it. Much better than spending money on a helical head for my jointer/thicky combo ! Weak link in my setup is now definitely the bandsaw, so maybe Santa will cram a new Laguna machine down the chimney this Xmas......we can all dream.

Cheers

I have always been careful to ensure a good seal with the tape, and have had no problems. The destructions say to ensure the tape turns jet black (as opposed to a dark grey). The jet black colour indicates the seal will be good. The first time I used it I rose the next morning, stumbled into the shop and worked the pump. The clicking noise which says there is no air in the bag to extract was heard immediately, so it held a very good vacuum overnight.

The split pipe/rod system is said to work well, but I have no personal experience.

Maybe somehow I have got lucky, but I have had no problems at all, and I love it to death.

Also, the PVA glue is working well for me. Cheap, easy to use and effective ... works for me.

I only have a Taiwanese 14 inch bandsaw. Something like a Laguna would be nice, but ever since I replaced the original crappy guides/rollers with better ones it performs pretty well. My only real bitch is that I'd like to get a bit more tension on the blade sometimes, so maybe investigating a stronger spring is a good idea.

This is developing into a really useful thread. Thanks guys

I find YouTube the best for tuition

veneering panels - YouTube

when i did my own veneering i went out and bought some veneer from trend timbers but before that i watched some youtube videos on veneering. the best site to me that i found was Making a Veneer Compass Rose by P. Michael Henderson as is showed each step in the veneering process. i used a digital angle calculator and then a fine point scalple to cut my veneer like this one X-Blade Precision hobby knife i did find i when through the blades quite quick as once i lost the point it was not really worth using the blade for cutting the veneer as the point did all the work. i found that i could get low tack tape from bunnings and i used that to hold my work together while i worked on it. i used PVA glue to hold the work down to my substrate then put clingwrap over it and then a board over that and some clamps to hold it in place.
Note to self buy some Veneer Tape when you do the next lot of veneering and then i used cabinet scrapers and a sraper blade for the delicate stuff. goodluck and enjoy it. when i did my compass star it was a lot of blood,sweat and tears but i finnished it and am proud of what i did as a self taught inlayist. but i have a long way to improve on it.

Originally Posted by Dengue

Crikey ian, you are not making it sound simple What craftmanship you have done to create this magnificent work , congratulations

The patience you must have to firstly cut and then edge glue thin 0.6mm veneer is amazing. Or was this 2mm veneer you made?

"getting the corners mitred just right was tricky" must be the understatement of the year.

Many thanks for giving us an insight as to how this magic happens, we appreciate the detailed steps.

Hi Dengy

veneering is like most woodworking. In some respects it's pretty easy -- crisp mitred corners on 1mm wide stringing is if anything easier than crisp mitres on 25mm stuff (at least you can cut both bits together) -- other bits require patience, sharp tools, accurate marking out and perseverance.

what I've shown you above and here used 0.6mm thick veneers -- I haven't done much with the 2-3mm sawn veneers used by John. The 3mm stuff behaves much like solid wood.

attached is a veneered table top and the first steps for my current project a pair of demi lune end tables -- the front apron will be silky oak veneer on a 300mm radius curve created using segmental construction.

If I get a chance I'll post a photo of the segmental apron tomorrow

Thanks for this , ian, it gives some insight as to the amount of accuracy and patience needed - not my strongest point, patience

Liked the 2nd photo - another case of when "too many clamps is not enough", to paraphrase HG Nelson and Roy Slaven

Looking forward to your next pics

Some years ago I was in an antique store in New Orleans. They had a beautiful cabinet that was veneered in end grain. The veneers (about 25 mm X 40 mm) were arranged in a square pattern so the grain radiated out from the centre of each "box" of four pieces.

It was one of those pieces that about takes your breath away.

I have done some trials in an attempt to duplicate this effect. The veneering is not the hard part. Getting the grain to remain visible after finishing is. The timbers I have used go so dark (as end grain so often does) when lacquered so that I am losing a lot of the effect of the end grain.

My guess is that either timber selection or type of finish or both is important. Given that the unit I saw was high gloss lacquer or shellac (or similar) my guess is that finding timber where the different colours in the end grain remain conspicuously different after finishing is the real trick.

Can anyone help with understanding the solution?

End Grain veneer Japanese style

寄木細工職人、本間 昇さんとヅクを作る。 - YouTube

One word, awesome.

Originally Posted by Chris Parks

End Grain veneer Japanese style

寄木細工職人、本間 昇さんとヅクを作る。 - YouTube

One word, awesome.

I have an old cigarette box made as shown in the video. I recall as a child studying it to try and figure out how it was made ... then my grandfather told me and I had one of those "of course" moments.

The piece I saw in the US was different. It's main feature was the end grain itself.

Originally Posted by John Samuel

Some years ago I was in an antique store in New Orleans. They had a beautiful cabinet that was veneered in end grain. The veneers (about 25 mm X 40 mm) were arranged in a square pattern so the grain radiated out from the centre of each "box" of four pieces.

It was one of those pieces that about takes your breath away.

I have done some trials in an attempt to duplicate this effect. The veneering is not the hard part. Getting the grain to remain visible after finishing is. The timbers I have used go so dark (as end grain so often does) when lacquered so that I am losing a lot of the effect of the end grain.

My guess is that either timber selection or type of finish or both is important. Given that the unit I saw was high gloss lacquer or shellac (or similar) my guess is that finding timber where the different colours in the end grain remain conspicuously different after finishing is the real trick.

Can anyone help with understanding the solution?

Hi John

most likely a combination of wood and finish technique

some species are more porous along the grain than others -- this affects how much finish fills the pores

finish technique is most likely a combination of pore fillers and shellac -- done "right" the pores will fill without discolouration.

Originally Posted by Chris Parks

End Grain veneer Japanese style

寄木細工職人、本間 昇さんとヅクを作る。 - YouTube

One word, awesome.

yes awesome, especially the plane used to cut the veneer leaves.

Originally Posted by Dengue

I want to have a go at veneering for the first time, and I am having difficulty in finding out how to do it. There seems to be a scarcity of information. Can anyone please advise on where I can get some info, ef Veneering for Dummies would be a most appropriate title.

You may not be aware but Tiger has a book on veneering for sale in the market place. Have a look at it as it may be just what you need at a cheap price.


Peter.

Originally Posted by ian

Hi John

most likely a combination of wood and finish technique

some species are more porous along the grain than others -- this affects how much finish fills the pores

finish technique is most likely a combination of pore fillers and shellac -- dome "right" the pores will fill without discolouration.

Ian,

That was my guess. Ran a trial with cedar ... very porous ... and the grain almost disappeared under lacquer. My guess is that a closer grained, denser timber will work better, but I need a timber with good contrast in the end grain. Any suggestions? I will likely try NG Rosewood next ... because it is sitting in the racks.

Any recommendation for pore fillers/sealers?

Hi John, I have an old Woodman 14" bandsaw that's been sitting in the corner of the shed for some time. It needs a bit of work to get it back to scratch and I was hoping you could tell me what was the make of blade guides you brought and also the type of blade you use for resawing.

Thanks