Thread: Jawas Abound!

LOL.

Yeah, I had an XS650 and loved the easy power. Had Koni's fitted to the rear but the handling was still rubbish. Later learned it really benefited from a fork brace at the front.

As for the Bonnie, that was my dream bike well before the Yammie and I was gunna do Aus to London overland on one. Slight shortage of dollars got in the way.

Later traded in the TDM850 in an amazing deal on a new Trumpy Sprint ST 995 with colour matched panniers.

Pearl of a motor. Great tourer. But oh the fit and finish and reliability belonged back in the 70s. (Other folk had better experiences to be fair.)

Wrote it off with 36k km on the clock and switched to my current ride, a Honda Fireblade 954, 2nd hand with 18 k km on the clock.

Very sweet machine. The last 'blade before they started to make track day replicas.

Great all rounder: touring, commuting, track days and fanging through the hills.

Only one drawback: takes about 120 kph or more for the wind to lift the chest and lighten the load on the ageing wrists

Originally Posted by Optimark

My Ducati manual said to do an oil change every 2,500 miles and clean the sludge trap every 5,000 miles, unless on dusty roads.

As about 80% of my riding was inland on dirt, I changed the oil and cleaned the sludge trap every oil change. Trust me, it was often half full of pure sludge.

Many a Guzzi rider is now a BMW owner, and so it goes

On my fourteenth BMW now, possibly the last one, but one never knows!

Mick.

The manual is wrong. Yes the trap fills quickly enough but once it reaches the oil channel it stops and sludge is just passed through the big end and back into the sump. It does no harm.

14th BMW ? If you'd stuck with guzzi you'd still be on the first one.

I know a chap who put 2 million kilometers on a lemans 2. The K's go big miles but the flat twins aren't nearly as wonderful as the owners would have you believe, and of course they are as awful as jap bikes to ride. I always laugh as they tell me it's done 400 k kms without trouble then as you probe they start detailing the various repairs and rebuilds in that "trouble free" riding. Guzzi is simple, 100,000 kms change the rings and timing chain, change the oil every 5000, the filter if it has one every other oil change. Keep the uni wet and the rear wheel splines greased. No problems.

Anyway, as long as your having fun..

The TRX 850 is/was a very good bike.

I have a friend with MV 175 (?) and a 350. I suggested he could tell people he's an "MV collector" with a "collection of MV's", his face lit up at that lark

The flat twins with the telelever front end, handle like you wouldn’t believe, and then some.

I personally do not know of many flat twins with over 400,000 klm’s on the clock, and I know an obscene amount of flat twin owners in this country and a few over seas as well. There is a Dutchman who has done 500,000 klm’s on a BMW his is close to the highest I know, although the highest flat twin I personally know of, has close to that or maybe higher by now. I’ll ask him when he comes back to the country next month.

Regarding a Moto Guzzi Le Mans having 2,000,000 klm’s on the clock, I would be reasonably sceptical about that.

My last flat twin did 305,000 klms it was a 980 and never had the heads off. The clutch died at 275,000 and I put a set of Ikons on at 250,000. The gearbox dropped it’s lunch at 235,000. Apart from that, normal maintenance was done. Timing chain twice. It was floated across rivers, bogged in sand, ran knobbies in mud and generally did bulk touring easily. I sold it to someone who wanted to use it for parts, it was so good he kept it for another 100,000 klm’s before giving the motor an overhaul.

The flat twin before that did 85,000 klm’s in 18 months, did three clutches, rear suspension (mono lever) re-built three times, got rid of it as it wasn’t going to last the distance being ridden like I was riding and where I was riding.

The flat twin before that, 350,000 klm’s original gearbox, heads off once for a hand valve seat grind on one head, timing chain twice, rear shockers replaced with Konis. Very good bike, just very tired. Also floated across rivers, including the Jardine up Cape York in 1980. Fitted an oil cooler to keep the 980 engine coolish in heavy sand. Still had the original clutch.

The flat twin before that, 118,000 in 15 months, nothing went wrong at all, except about 4 sets of throttle cables which I believe were a design fault where they went into the Italian carbies (that should tell you what model it was) Very good bike, but I had already bought another one which was sitting in the lounge brand new after a bike shop went belly up in tasmania. Bought at a repossession auction by pure happenchance.

The flat twin before that, well plenty of them, but probably the best one of all was one that I did 350,000 miles on. It was old when I bought it, travelled at 50 – 55 mph comfortably, 60 – 65 mph was a strain. One throttle cable, one set of spark plugs every 50,000 miles and do the valves every 150,000 miles, give or take. Had 5 rings on each piston, two oil and three compression rings. Built to last, not for speed.

Another flat twin had a sidecar on, which was basically a big box that I slept in and in which all my worldly possession were stored in. I have no idea how far it went, the odometer never worked, the speedometer did. It normally cruised around the 35 – 45 mph range comfortably. That was in the sixties, things were slower then, plus most of my travels were on about 90% dirt. I did do some reasonably interesting trips on that bike. I had sealed the side car box so water wouldn’t seep in when crossing creeks and small rivers. The box always started to float whenever the water was deeper than the bottom of the cylinders, which was a good way of finding out if things may have start to get interesting. I rode that bike for 14 months almost non-stop around the country.

The 745 flat twins from 1969 onwards had some issues with rear main oil seals, used to travel with one in the tank bag, but by the time the second model 898 flat twin appeared from September 1974 onwards, the rear main seal issue, was more or less fixed.

All machines have issues, all have quirks, all require good maintenance if they are used well and hard, simple really.

I have seen some quite interesting high kilometreage machines in various parts of the world, however I have never seen any bike with 2,000,000 klm’s on it. I have seen one with over 1,000,000 kilometres on it, that was a BMW test bike and I saw it at the factory. Knowing how long many items last on bikes is something that comes with the experience of many, many kliks travelled over decades of travel in all sorts of situations.

I drove taxis in the very late sixties onwards for a time, I never saw a taxi that would run very well after 1,000,000 miles (1,600,000 klm’s approximatly) Everything is basically just worn out

Regarding the sludge trap built into the Ducati big end throw, I can tell you that the big ends on those bikes regurgitated their innards if their owners rode the bikes hard over dirt and didn’t clean the sludge out. Personally seen that happen. The original manual that tells of dire consequences if the sludge trap isn’t cleaned out every second oil change, still reads the same as it did 42½ years ago. I don’t think it is a miss print as the other manual I have for another Ducati in the same era I had, gives the same maintenance instructions regarding the sludge trap.

Mick.

Interestingly, at EICMA, there is a Guzzi with a drum front brake and a rear disc brake, looks terrific.

Mick.

I've knockeed off the quotes because I want to answer each paragraph indivdually:

The flat twins with the telelever front end, handle like you wouldn’t believe, and then some.

Yes much better than the old ones. I'll still keep my rattly old guzzi though

I personally do not know of many flat twins with over 400,000 klm’s on the clock,

I've known a few people over the years with 400+ bm's. They are good bikes (although too soggy for me) and definitely superior to guzzis in some situations like pottering up rutted roads. What annoys me is the insistence of many BM owners that thier bikes run forever and never break, but as I said when you probe for details you get the repairs...

At 400 a guzzi no matter how well maintained will need major work. It is still economical to overhaul it and keep riding for another 400 but your wallet will have a bit of a heart attack.

Regarding a Moto Guzzi Le Mans having 2,000,000 klm’s on the clock, I would be reasonably sceptical about that.

No it was pretty accurate, several round australia tours and I think he rode it round the world or something once. he did rebuild it about 4 or 5 times during that period.

The bike doing isn't the miracle, it's that he could still walk afterwards. Another mate rode a mk2 from phillip is to brissy in one 19 hour run some years back. Talk about iron b....

My last flat twin did 305,000 klms it was a 980 and never had the heads off. The clutch died at 275,000 and I put a set of Ikons on at 250,000. The gearbox dropped it’s lunch at 235,000. Apart from that, normal maintenance was done. Timing chain twice. It was floated across rivers, bogged in sand, ran knobbies in mud and generally did bulk touring easily. I sold it to someone who wanted to use it for parts, it was so good he kept it for another 100,000 klm’s before giving the motor an overhaul.

Yup that sounds about right. As I say above that's a fine reliability record, what I object to is people insisting they did the miles "with no trouble".

The flat twin before that, 118,000 in 15 months, nothing went wrong at all, except about 4 sets of throttle cables which I believe were a design fault where they went into the Italian carbies (that should tell you what model it was) Very good bike, but I had already bought another one which was sitting in the lounge brand new after a bike shop went belly up in tasmania. Bought at a repossession auction by pure happenchance.

/6 900S or something ? No doubt you recall the cable to master cylinder front brake ? And Guzzi were stupid enough to copy that crazy idea.

The flat twin before that, well plenty of them, but probably the best one of all was one that I did 350,000 miles on. It was old when I bought it, travelled at 50 – 55 mph comfortably, 60 – 65 mph was a strain. One throttle cable, one set of spark plugs every 50,000 miles and do the valves every 150,000 miles, give or take. Had 5 rings on each piston, two oil and three compression rings. Built to last, not for speed.

/5 or before I assume.

All machines have issues, all have quirks, all require good maintenance if they are used well and hard, simple really.

Yep. One of the really big differences I've found is that while a harley BM and Guzzi are all air cooled carburetted twins (often with points etc) you seem to need 800 special tools to get into a BM, you need to gain an elbow and lose 9/10th of your brain to work on a hardly, but I can strip a tonti guz right down in half an hour and put it back together in a couple of hours, and the loop frames aren't that much harder. I can honestly say I've never seen an easier bike to work on, at least that I can remember.


Regarding the sludge trap built into the Ducati big end throw, I can tell you that the big ends on those bikes regurgitated their innards if their owners rode the bikes hard over dirt and didn’t clean the sludge out. Personally seen that happen. The original manual that tells of dire consequences if the sludge trap isn’t cleaned out every second oil change, still reads the same as it did 42½ years ago. I don’t think it is a miss print as the other manual I have for another Ducati in the same era I had, gives the same maintenance instructions regarding the sludge trap.

Yep, like I say the twin manuals insisted it had to be done every 40,000 kms and I know of 860s that did 200,000 and more never having it cleaned. Not a misprint, just wrong.

Taglioni made some marvelous stuffups with the design of the bevels, the two most talked about being the big ends and the twin clutch. It has always astounded me that he designed the first roller bigend in 57ish and it wasn't until the mid 80's that they finally put the problem to bed. You are welcome to believe the sludge trap causes the big ends to die but I would suggest that isn't the cause, nor does it exasserbate it. The design is appauling, it works even less well when laboured and needs frequent clean oil. I've had 3 or 4 singles and frankly there is a case for just riding the little pigs of things until they break and rebuilding as necessary, or buying something better.

I got given a Z200 years ago and I did it up to teach the boss to ride. I rode it around a bit and every time I kept thinking if this had a ducati badge on the tank it'd be a $10,000 bike. Flamin marvelous thing it was, couldn't kill it with a big stick and buckets of fun to ride.

The bevel twins are not so much transport as marital aid, but when the bike tells you it's time to fix something you better be ready with a wheelbarrow full of money right on the spot because the bill will increase exponentially with every passing hour.

Anyway, I wouldn't know. I only had a dozen of them over 20 odd years. I am sure if you ask Ian Gowanloch you'd get a completely different answer.

Had the pleasure of taking a 500 Jawa around Tivoli short circuit track many
years ago.

The six cyylinder Honda was a CBX 1000 and a wild thing to ride at the time. A bloke from Ipswich made up a short circuit sidecar with one and was just mind blowing to watch.

Foo