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  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vernonv View Post
    As I said I'm not including pedestrians. I'm not sure I can be any clearer.
    Sure you can if you try.

    Why don't you just say "it's time cyclists were licensed and insured"? That's obviously what you mean, because you arbitrarily exclude any other road user not currently required to be licensed or insured with your arguments.

    You want this person to be licensed (or registered - the two things are quite different but you seem to use them interchangeably) and insured:
    Balance-Bikes1.DSC00488.jpg
    But this person you're quite happy to have go anonymously and uninsured:
    "I don't practice what I preach because I'm not the kind of person I'm preaching to."

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  3. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vernonv View Post
    If you want to include them then you are on your own.
    Cheers.

    Vernon.
    __________________________________________________
    Bite off more than you can chew and then chew like crazy.

  4. #48
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    Yes your argument is fading fast.
    "I don't practice what I preach because I'm not the kind of person I'm preaching to."

  5. #49
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    Took longer than I expected for the trolls to find this thread and take it off to an anti cycling tangent. The original post was about the inadequacy of a sentence for a driver who killed a bike rider.

    Small minded and ill informed people calling for registration/licensing of cyclists. Every government body that has looked at is has rejected it outright and not even motoring groups support the idea.

    First they ignore you
    Then they laugh at you
    Then they fight you
    Then you win
    It's only a mistake if you don't learn from it.

  6. #50
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    It's a bit sad that you need to resort to calling someone names, when they have an opinion that differs from your. Not unexpected though.
    Cheers.

    Vernon.
    __________________________________________________
    Bite off more than you can chew and then chew like crazy.

  7. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vernonv View Post
    It's a bit sad that you need to resort to calling someone names, when they have an opinion that differs from your. Not unexpected though.
    It does inflame opinions. It's pretty simple really.

    - 90% of bike riders already have licenses
    - The number of cyclist collisions causing damage you could count on your hand, so insurance is a void question
    - It is low cost
    - It reduces traffic
    - It increases fitness
    - It doesn't burn endless fossil fuel
    - It requires no extra infrastructure
    - It creates no smog

    So, in essence, you either support these statements or you disagree with them, in total.

    Since you don't support them, you must also agree with these statements:

    - running down little kids riding their bikes to school is perfectly fine, even my own
    - killing riders is ok as long as I can get to work on time
    - I agree my actions will be recorded by 3 high definition cameras and published to the Internet
    - I agree my insurer will be contacted with said video.
    - I like creating pollution
    - I want to burn fossil fuels and cause environmental damage
    - I like paying taxes for more roads
    - I like paying tolls
    - I don't mind handing over my superannuation, house and life savings when I horribly injure someone
    - I don't mind everyone's 3rd party insurance tripling when the no-win-no-fee lawyers seethe all over this issue like fleas on a dog.

    And the last, clincher, I will soon be 100% liable as a motorist for any damage caused by motorists due to the automatic liability rules soon to imposed.

    Devisive isnt it?

  8. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evanism View Post
    So, in essence, you either support these statements or you disagree with them, in total.
    Why does it have to be "in total"? I agree with most of what you said, but not all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Evanism View Post
    Since you don't support them, you must also agree with these statements
    I'm not sure if you are addressing this to me personally, but as I said above I agree with most of your statements, but not all "in total". Sorry but this issue is not so black and white - I wish it was.

    Those that see things see things in "black and white", "all or nothing" are the last people that should be developing reasonable policy. As I said I think it's reasonable to register and insure cyclists (for their own protection, as well as that of other roads users), but I don't think it's reasonable to register pedestrians (including skate boarders, roller bladers, etc). Silent was pushing that side of the argument, in part because he enjoys an argument and in part to attempt to make my opinion seem unreasonable.
    Cheers.

    Vernon.
    __________________________________________________
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  9. #53
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    I do not see why you would need multi choice questions for non motorised road users, there is only one rule they need to know- "keep out of the way of motor vehicles". Then they will live long and prosper.

    Regards
    Hugh

    Enough is enough, more than enough is too much.

  10. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by A Duke View Post
    "keep out of the way of motor vehicles".
    This is an opinion not a law... too many people seem to confuse the two.

    I absolutely guarantee that if you come anywhere near me on my bike in your vehicle at the least you're operating the vehicle in an unsafe manner at worst you've broken at least one law. I currently ride with a HD camera pointing aft on my bike and another on my helmet. I will take the footage to the police and I will see you in court. Good luck using the opinion above as your defence.
    It's only a mistake if you don't learn from it.

  11. #55
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    Hi corbs,
    I hope you have given your heirs and successors the right instructions because it does not matter how much you are in the right and how much evidence you have, when you are flattened by a motor vehicle you stay flattened.

    I did not intend it as a law but as a rule for self preservation.
    Regards
    Hugh

    Enough is enough, more than enough is too much.

  12. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by A Duke View Post
    Hi corbs,
    I hope you have given your heirs and successors the right instructions because it does not matter how much you are in the right and how much evidence you have, when you are flattened by a motor vehicle you stay flattened.

    I did not intend it as a law but as a rule for self preservation.
    Regards
    So you're saying I should not ride within the law because you won't drive within it?

    It's you (and people like you) whose attitudes on the road which need to change. I was trying not to get sucked into this pathetic discussion but unfortunately the anti cycling trolls have taken over. It's the same people every time too. They think they represent some sort of majority but are far from representative of the general population. I get passed by hundreds of drivers on every ride I go on. The vast majority of drivers are courteous and respectful as are the vast majority of cyclists. Unfortunately the small minority in both camps ruin it for everyone.

    I'm going to unsubscribe from this thread now, registering/licensing bike riders would change nothing. That was not the point of the thread so there is no benefit for me following it.

    Happy riding and safe driving.


    Corbs
    It's only a mistake if you don't learn from it.

  13. #57
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    there is only one rule they need to know- "keep out of the way of motor vehicles"
    Yes this is very much the problem in this country. It is surprising just how many people think exactly the way you do. Even the ones who give you a wide berth and don't try and clip your elbow with their wing mirror just have this ingrained belief that they are more important than anyone else when behind the wheel.

    We encountered one on Saturday. Perfectly straight stretch of road with about 1/2 km visibility ahead, broken centre line, no oncoming traffic. Still the [email protected] decides to give us a punishment pass, just to let us know how annoyed he'd have been if he'd encountered us through the winding bit. No inconvenience to him at all but he just had to let us know where we stand.

    Little did he know, one of the cyclists he passed is a highway patrol officer, so he will be getting an unpleasant visit in the coming week or so.
    "I don't practice what I preach because I'm not the kind of person I'm preaching to."

  14. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by silentC View Post
    Even the ones who give you a wide berth and don't try and clip your elbow with their wing mirror just have this ingrained belief that they are more important than anyone else when behind the wheel.
    So even when someone does the right thing, they are still in the wrong. Geez, no pleasing some people.

    I must say, I wonder how some of you cyclists stay upright on your bicycle with such a large chip on your shoulder.
    Cheers.

    Vernon.
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  15. #59
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    It's the mindset that I am talking about. They give you a wide berth but they are thinking "why are you even on the road?"

    People talk about wanting solutions to problems, well part of the solution to this problem is to somehow change the mindset that leads people to say something like "stay out of the way of motor vehicles". We can't even start talking about how to make the roads safer when most people think we shouldn't even be there. That is not an acceptable starting point for cyclists.

    So being honest, what do you think about cyclists on the road? Are you happy to accept them, or do you really think they should stick to the parks and bike paths and keep out of your way? How many cyclists do you encounter on your commute into work and do they cause you any inconvenience? How many cyclists do you see breaking the road rules compared to the number of drivers?
    "I don't practice what I preach because I'm not the kind of person I'm preaching to."

  16. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by silentC View Post
    It's the mindset that I am talking about. They give you a wide berth but they are thinking "why are you even on the road?"
    Wow, you are a mind reader now. Do you have a persecution complex?

    Quote Originally Posted by silentC View Post
    So being honest, what do you think about cyclists on the road? Are you happy to accept them, or do you really think they should stick to the parks and bike paths and keep out of your way? How many cyclists do you encounter on your commute into work and do they cause you any inconvenience?
    Ok, just in case your mind reading skills are on the fritz, I honestly don't have any issue with law abiding cyclists sharing the road. I generally encounter only a handfull of cyclists a week (dozen of so), some in town (40 and 50km/h) and some out of town (100km/h). I probably see more on the weekends, than during the week. I treat them the same as any other "vehicle" on the road ... I give way to them, I overtake only when safe to do so, etc, etc. The don't cause me any grief or frustration.

    Quote Originally Posted by silentC View Post
    How many cyclists do you see breaking the road rules compared to the number of drivers?
    To be honest, considering the number of cyclists I encounter, compared to the number of non-cyclists, I would have to say that per capita they (cyclists) would be slightly over-represented (only slightly). I don't know why that is???
    Cheers.

    Vernon.
    __________________________________________________
    Bite off more than you can chew and then chew like crazy.

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