Thread: 300 grit waterstone as alternative to grinder

If you are patient, yes. or if you have just dropped that sharp chisel onto a concrete floor, no. I have a Tormek T7 and still establish the bevels on my dry high speed grinder with both 60 and 120 grit wheels, then go to the 200/1000 wet stone to finish off.

Depends on your patience!

300 grit will shape a pretty ugly edge, but it is no match for a grinder in speed. I do sharpen some chisels starting a 300, but only for fun I also has the benefit(?)/difference of not having a radius on the bevel, which may matter to some.

Cheers,
Dave

I'm unaware of a waterstone of #300 grit that's any good. Too soft, too frustrating, too slow.

And yes, I've tried what I think are all of them.

There are ways to 'replace' a powered grinder with only stones, but #300 isn't it. Sorry.

Stu.

What's a better alternative for grinding then?

Preferably a cheap, non-mechanised alternative? An oilstone of some kind? (I've heard they're even slower)...

I don't know that the repetitive and pointless nature of using a 300 grit would bother me, since I'd be doing it once in a blue moon. But I don't want to spend $200 sharpening a bunch of chisels I got from a flea market for $5 each, and will be only using once a month or so...

https://www.woodworkforums.com/f127/s...-beast-134527/

Answers it pretty well I think.

And pretty much the same suggestion I'd have.

Stu.

As a 'proof of concept', I bought a cheap 4 sided diamond plates off ebay. It's got (I think) 200,300,400, & 600 grit sides.It probably wont last all that long, but I am delighted with how quickly I can set a bevel with it. I hate grinding chisels, as I invariably blue the edge. Once this gets tatty, I will replace it with a good quality double sided diamond plate.

Well, I guess "The Black Beast" it is...

Thanks for the help guys

Well, I received and tried out the 120 grit 'black bear' from Stu's shop.

After a concerted two hours of grinding I realised that grinding new bevels on 10 chisels and 5 planes is not likely to happen in my lifetime.

I think it would be perfectly acceptable to touch up the primary bevel on a blade that already had one; the stone certainly cuts aggressively. But these are all old, old tools and are almost round at the ends.

Snafus, If you've got a power drill and a make a fitting of some sort (possibly a small bolt and two nuts with spring washers and a large flat washer) that will fit through a rigid flat disk (made out of mdf or aluminium plate for example to act as a backing for a sanding disk) then you can make a cheap grinder out of a disk of coarse sanding belt. I pulled a couple of the big floor sanding belts out of builders skips and cut them up but you could buy a smaller one I am sure. You could even glue the abrasive disk onto the becking plate if you wanted it to sit flatter. The tricky part is holding the drill in vice or clamp to enable you to run it hands-free...A drill press would be perfect but I used a black and decker workmate as I don't yet have a bench mounted vice.
I used such a device to grind the bevels of my large oval bolstered mortice chisels that required a long flat bevel which cannot be achieved on a round grinding wheel except by grinding on the side of the wheel. I got caught out a bit with overheating the edge of the blade but with plenty of cooling water and a careful approach you can get bevels re-established which can then be finished off on stones. You have to freehadn the angle though which is fine if you check it with a sliding bevel or a protractor regulalry It removes metal quite quickly in my experience as evidenced by the shower of sparks flying off the disk when a high carbon steel chisel is applied to it. I would put up a pic of my own homemade version but have got one to show you here.
I guess this means you would have to find or make a nice round disk but I cut one with a quick home made router jig out of 16mm melamine coated chipboard. I do have a Triton wet stone grinder (not as well engineered as a Tormek of course) which I like to use on all other chisels as it gets the job done establishing bevels quietly and relatively quickly. I then move to 4000 and 8000 grit waterstones and polish on a worn 1200 wet and dry sheet with water.
It does not do anything about flattening blade backs of course. That's just method, time and effort

Sounds interesting, as I do happen to have those items lying about the place. But I don't really trust myself making my own drill attachments, and am keen to stick to the darkside wherever I can.

I've concluded that I must be doing something wrong with the 220 grit waterstone; I've read a post to the effect that it should be able to remove 1 ml every few minutes (which it most certainly does not). In fact, it currently cuts at the same speed as my 1000 King waterstone.

I'm determined to make the "Black Beast" thing work. I think it's probably best if I start a new post on the topic though.

Having read your other secondary post I realised you wanted non-mechanised solution which cancels out powerdrills
Well scratch that advice and go for coarse diamond plates or coarse sandpaper stuck to a flat surface. They stay flatter than abrasive stones.

One of two things are happening, and I suspect (sure) it's #1.

#1, the stone is glazed, and needs deglazing. There is a small bottle of loose grit and an instruction sheet included with every one of these stones, and it's critical to follow the instructions and deglaze the stone. The hard crust is thin, but incredibly tough. Once you get through it, you'll get into the really good stuff.

#2, push harder. You can't apply too much pressure on these things.


I'll break a new one open soon and video the process, just to further reinforce how important the deglazing really is. If you don't do it for whatever reason, the stone behaves like a mediocre #1000 grit stone.


If I didn't send the loose grit (and I try to make sure I always include it. I've even sent the 'kit' to folks who've not got a stone) let me know ASAP and I'll EMS one to you tomorrow. I can not say how important it is to deglaze the stone after a few uses. Left alone, it's a glorified, expensive brick and not even a very good brick because it's small.

(Am I making this clear enough yet?)

Once you get into the slightly more friable core of the stone, you'll know it. Believe me, you'll know it. Do be careful if you're free handing the bevels, if you slip, the doctor won't have enough meat left to stitch together.

Stu.

Sorry Stu, I started another post on the topic so I don't mean to double up. Please check that out. But I have ground the stone down a few times with the grit supplied. Maybe I'm not doing it properly / enough?