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30th April 2016, 11:25 AM #31Bit of a Tool
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Maybe I am stating the obvious, but I can't see that anyone else has, so... If you care about flatness this much, you should probably check your plane sole is actually flat cause mine certainly wasn't . It may be easier to flatten while still whole than after its cut, but then may go out of flat again when cut. I haven't actually made one of these so I could be way off base, I am just referring to the plane I use for planing wood which needed a fair bit of flattening. I'm currently using shapton pro's or sandpaper to flatten and get some sharpness, followed by autosol metal polish on wood for polish. Do you all find your woodwork is actually significantly better or easier with your *perfect* edges? Not having a go, just curious )
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30th April 2016, 11:49 AM #32
The box Derek made to house it should be easy enough to hold for any further flattening, I should think.
Well I'm told that a sharper edge stays sharper for longer, and it really is nice to have a chisel that cuts effortlessly, particularly for use without a mallet. With the diamond paste system it's just not much effort to go another grit or two, and extremely cost effective to add those two grits, so as far as I'm concerned - why not?
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30th April 2016, 12:21 PM #33Bit of a Tool
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30th April 2016, 02:19 PM #34
Hi Sam
Do I use these cast iron plates and diamond paste still? Not often. I find it more convenient - less upkeep/mess - to use ceramic Spyderco Medium and Ultra Fine stones (very hard and minimal to nil wear), and finish on green compound. The diamond is useful for lapping the backs of old blades.
Regards fro Perth
DerekVisit www.inthewoodshop.com for tutorials on constructing handtools, handtool reviews, and my trials and tribulations with furniture builds.
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2nd May 2016, 09:11 AM #35
Hey Derek, I have seen many people reference green honing compound, but rarely a brand. What brand(s) do you recommend ? I have purchased Josco but I am not sure it's the right solution for hand honing.
Glenn Visca
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2nd May 2016, 10:53 AM #36
Hi Glenn
I use Veritas green compound as it is a known commodity. I have not read reports or reviews of other brands or makes.
Keep in mind that compounds are not "pure" and will differ from one another. The Veritas is a nominal 0.5 microns, but may be made of slightly larger and slightly smaller grit. It is this variation that is relevant.
Regards from Perth
DerekVisit www.inthewoodshop.com for tutorials on constructing handtools, handtool reviews, and my trials and tribulations with furniture builds.
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3rd May 2016, 01:45 AM #37GOLD MEMBER
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It's strange that the honing stick is now referred to as Veritas, as last I checked, it was the same stick sold by other retailers with the label "microfine" on it (and made by formax).
It's described as a nominal 0.5 microns, but it's 70% aluminum oxide with particles as large as 6% permitted in it, and there are those large particles in it as the folks on the razor board have posted pictures of edges stropped with it. A user can look at the edge or back of whatever they're honing and see spider web patterns from them.
For woodworking, we want those particles in the compound, though, pure green chromium oxide graded at 0.5 microns cuts significantly less fast than the green microfine compound (and often costs a lot more). It will make a uniform bright polish with no spiderwebbing for the obsessed, though.
What's curious is that LV doesn't usually participate in naming something exclusively if it's not exclusive (and the price is higher than anyone sells the formax microfine stick - LV has it for about $13, Woodcraft $9 and Industrial Suppliers $7) - I'd be curious if they have had formax mix a special batch that is different than the microfine.
I have my doubts that the average particle size is 0.5 microns based on its cut speed, though. I've got graded pigments down to 0.09 micron (they are all a waste of time for woodworking, and in my opinion, for razoring, too, where they are popular because they do make a blindingly sharp edge for a shave or two), and the pure graded green chromium at a much higher concentration than 30% does not cut as fast as the compound LV sells.
(the stuff that the razor people were nutting over damaging a 1 micron film honed edge came from LV -their definition of damage is different than mine - they couldn't stand the random large scratches, but the overall effect on a shaving edge of that stuff is not nearly as pronounced as it is visually).
I've had other green sticks, but none are as fine overall as microfine, except for the ones that are pure chrome ox, and woodworkers would whine if they had to use those because half of a micron on a leather surface cuts slowly.
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23rd June 2016, 10:06 PM #38
Hi all.
well, after yet another hospital admission (the dreaded cancer.... yeah I know, but don't worry, I won't die from it, I'll probably die with it - hopefully in about 20 years or more )....
Anyway, I'm all good now and have got back to running the shaper again.
So the project is getting back on track.
Here are a few photos of the machinery and the plates, showing an example of one of the cast iron pieces progressing to flat:
IMG_20160623_194631.jpg IMG_20160623_194543_1CS.jpg IMG_20160623_200325.jpg IMG_20160623_194806.jpgCheers,
Joe
9"thicknesser/planer, 12" bench saw, 2Hp Dusty, 5/8" Drill press, 10" Makita drop saw, 2Hp Makita outer, the usual power tools and carpentry hand tools...
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23rd June 2016, 10:13 PM #39
Fantastic to hear playing with big toys.
Is far better than being stuck in big buildings.
Glad to hear your on the mend
Cheers Matt
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23rd June 2016, 10:14 PM #40
Thanks for the update. Sorry to hear you've been in hospital.
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23rd June 2016, 11:03 PM #41
Good news sir, AND THANK YOU AGAIN.....
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13th November 2016, 08:46 PM #42
Been using this method for a little while now since getting the plates off Joe at Crowies.
I found that the method was as described in terms of repeatability. I also enjoyed not having to flatten a number of stones. Have used it for chisels, plane blades and some scandi grind knives getting sharp tools with a minimum of fuss but with one problem - black oilymess particularly doing a longer session. Granted not as much mess as with water stones but enough black stuff to get it from A to B to the residue shown on 1 of Derek's honing plates.
Brett or anybody else who uses this method did/have you experienced this? were/ are you wipingbthe residue off the plates at the end of the session?
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13th November 2016, 10:33 PM #43
You mean black stuff on the CI plates, or transferring to perhaps a final water stone?
I don't clean up the CI plates at all - just wrap the rubber sheet (non-slip mat) around them and back in the drawer. If you clean them up you lose whatever paste is on top.
If you mean getting onto the final water stone, sometimes I wipe down the blade with white spirits (turps will prolly do), but there is still some transfer. I don't worry too much about it on the stone - has to be flattened soon enough anyway.
You don't need to add paste every time either. Just a drop or two of camellia oil will get you going again with the embedded diamonds in the plate.
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13th November 2016, 11:57 PM #44
Pac Man
You can wipe the paste residue away. It is what is embedded in the cast iron that cuts. The surface still seems to leave a grey film on fingers.
Regards from Perth
DerekVisit www.inthewoodshop.com for tutorials on constructing handtools, handtool reviews, and my trials and tribulations with furniture builds.
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16th November 2016, 03:33 AM #45GOLD MEMBER
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- Apr 2011
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- McBride BC Canada
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What nominal grit particle size do you all recommend for diamond honing paste?
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