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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Perth
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    19

    Default Diamond Plates Clogging?

    Hi everyone,

    I have been flattening the back of a plane blade for a P910 block plane and I'm having a few dramas with my fine DMT sharpening plates.

    It it seems like my extra and extra extra fine plates are clogging with swarf slowing the whole process down significantly. I'm not convinced if this is the issue or if I am just being impatient but I have been rubbing away for about 2 hours for each plate and I have not been able to fully remove the scratches from the previous grit plate (I have worked through each grit from extra coarse all the way through).

    Im using loads of water, I thought that might be the issue but the change hasn't made a difference. I have thrown them in the kitchen sink and scrubbed them with detergent in case I had picked up some oil, no change.

    I havent tried using windex yet but I will give it a go after dinner.

    Does anyone one have any ideas or similar issues?

    Cheers,

    Tim

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  3. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    1,940

    Default

    How much metal are you trying to remove?
    any chance you can take a photo of the blade as it is eg not yet finished Or can you see that it is rubbing only in a small area ?
    did you use a coarser material first?

  4. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Perth
    Posts
    19

    Default

    image.jpg

    This is a photo of the blade. It's not great but I have tried to capture the scratches. I started with the extra coarse plate and have worked through every grit.

    The extra coarse, coarse and fine worked really well. The extra fine and extra extra fine are the ones I am struggling with.

    It was the plate that lead me to think it was clogging as I was getting a dark stain across the plate. I have just had a go with the windex and the stain on the plate appears to be rubbing off.

    I think it may be something I am doing as I haven't picked theses up for a while.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  5. #4
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Sydney
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    1,940

    Default

    It's likely that the black staining is the old material being removed. If the windex works then it's no drama.

    What was your plan now? Are you happy that you have at least 5-6 mm at the business end of the blade that extends across the whole blade and into the corners. For me this means you are good to go to the next finest grit you have in a water or oilstone.


    Some may be wanting to take more material off for the whole back to be done a bit further up to 15 - 20 mm . I don't really think it's necessary but if you do I would suggest tickling the shiny parts gently with a Dremel ( though not near the edges) and going back to your coarser plates.

  6. #5
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
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    Default


    Another question. Are you rubbing the whole blade on the plate?
    the scratch patterns on the blade seem to indicate you are. Try rubbing the business end at 45 degrees to the plate and then alternate to the opposite 45 degrees when you change grits so you can see your scratch pattern being removed. Next plate 90 degrees.

    jim Daveys notes show this approach.Scroll down to polish the face of the blade http://www.jimdavey-planes-sharpenin...b0feea8bf.aspx
    Last edited by Pac man; 15th November 2015 at 10:58 PM. Reason: Spellink

  7. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    Perth
    Posts
    10,385

    Default

    You have done enough flattening. As long as the very back of the blade is flat, it is all that is needed. It is a waste of time and effort to try and flatten the entire blade, as you seem to be attempting to do.

    The Coarse stone is not coarse enough for what you are doing. It is about 250 grit, and you need about 120 grit. Use sandpaper.

    Remove all scratches with the next grit before moving on to a finer grit. There is no way you should have been using the Extra Fine if the Fine has not removed the scratches of the coarse.

    Regards from Perth

    Derek
    Visit www.inthewoodshop.com for tutorials on constructing handtools, handtool reviews, and my trials and tribulations with furniture builds.

  8. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Perth
    Posts
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    Default

    Pac man

    Thanks for the feedback. I was hoping that I had enough area flattened mainly because I was annoyed so I moved on to squaring up the cutting edge. The blade seems fairly wonky as well (it resembles the shape of a spoon) so I am worried about removing too much material from the thickness of the blade. I was rubbing the entire blade on the stone. I will give the 45 degree method a shot tomorrow.

    Derek

    Thanks for the advice on the sandpaper. I considered that today but I guess I overestimated how coarse the stone was. I have another couple of bigger blades to do so I will start with the glass and paper. I will also go back to the fine plate on this one now again while I try to polish the area near the cutting edge.

    How owe polished is polished? I understand this may start a long and difficult discussion so I will narrow the question, do you need to be able to see your reflection or is the removal of strong "visible" scratches sufficient?

  9. #8
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    Perth
    Posts
    10,385

    Default

    Try this short pictorial ..

    http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Woodwor...%20Blades.html

    Regards from Perth

    Derek
    Visit www.inthewoodshop.com for tutorials on constructing handtools, handtool reviews, and my trials and tribulations with furniture builds.

  10. #9
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Gold Coast
    Age
    69
    Posts
    2,628

    Default

    I started out using a DMT duo and eventually felt it was wearing out. It seems that many think that way if you google 'DMT stone wearing out'. Others say it is just the plates wearing in and loosing some initial aggressiveness. DMT itself give the advise to test the stone against glass if you feel they might have worn out.

  11. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Bellingen
    Posts
    587

    Default

    I can't comment on everyone else's tools as the makers change their quality over time but I'm yet to wear out an ezelap diamond hone. I have one that is almost 20 years old and it has been seriously flogged. I now have many more. Probably about eight big plates plus a few small pocket hones.
    I have only ever used turps as a cutting fluid and never had a clog issue. The only one I have had problems with was a DMT 8000 grit hone that I scratched up... First time I used it as well. I have no idea as they come pretty highly regarded... Maybe I just was unlucky?

    How hard is the steel you are sharpening? I was warned about using un hardened steel on the diamond hones as this can cause them to clog up.

  12. #11
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Perth
    Posts
    19

    Default

    Thanks Derek the magnet is a great idea. I think I am not flattening this correctly either after reading your article.

    In in regards to the stones wearing out, I thought this initially but once I cleaned them up properly they worked much better again. I washed them in the kitchen sink with a scrubbing brush and removed a significant amount of material from them.

    I don't know how hard the blade is, I am going to have to do some homework.

    I am am beginning to think that the water may have something to do wit the issue. I'm not sure if it is my imagination, I need to come up with a way to quantify this statement, but I find they work better with windex as a lubricant. I see a few people use turps so I may try that at some stage and see if it works and see if I can measure a difference.

    At this stage it's back to the sandpaper on glass. I have a series of late nights for work this week so I will have another go on the weekend and post the results.

  13. #12
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Buderim qld
    Posts
    842

    Default


    Eze-Lap Diamond Products

    The Sharpener People









    FAQs

    Question: What is the best way to clean my sharpener?
    Answer: We would suggest Comet or Ajax and some warm water. Using an old toothbrush, scrub until clean.
    Question: What grit would I use on kitchen knives?
    Answer: The appropriate grit would be fine (600). Popular stones for this use would be Round Sharpeners, Models P and G and Oval Sharpeners.
    Question: What model of sharpener is best to use on serrated blades?
    Answer: The best models are the Hook and Knife, Model ST, and the EZE-Fold, Model 571.
    Question: What is the best angle for sharpening?
    Answer: The best angle is 7 – 10 angle.
    Question: What is the thickness of the credit card stone?
    Answer: .056″
    Question: What is the diameter of the Round Diamond Sharpener, Model M and Model S?
    Answer: The Model M is 1/4″ in diameter and the Model S is 3/16″.
    Question: What is the diameter of the Hook and Knife Sharpener, Model C?
    Answer: The Model C sharpener is 7/32″ in diameter.
    Question: How can you tell if the knife is sharpening?
    Answer: Use a felt-tipped pen and draw a line on the edge of the blade. Now sharpen the blade and notice that the mark will come off as you sharpen.
    Question: Should I use oil or water on the stone when sharpening?
    Answer: Either is fine and neither will hurt the stone. However, oil will tend to clog the stone and it will need to be cleaned more often than when using water.
    Question: Which of your sharpeners would you recommend for sharpening a machete in the field.
    Answer: We would suggest that you use one of our EZE-Fold sharpeners. Either the Model 501 fine grit or the 520 Double-Sided with fine grit on one side and coarse grit on the other.
    Question: My EZE-LAP sharpening stone did not break, but it came off its wood backing plate. What should I do?
    Answer: You can either re-glue it using contact cement or epoxy. Or if you would rather, you can return it to us and we will repair it for you.
    Question: I bought three of your 2.5″ x 11″ laps to install in my Multi-stone fixture. I know the laps are compatible with water, but you say nothing about thier compatibility with oils or other lubricants. The Multi-stone fixture is built so that the stones move through a lubricant (mineral oil) as they are rotated. This simplifies the cleaning of the stones. What I need to know is:
    * Will the metal substrate rust if it is left in water?
    * Is the bonding agent that you use compatible with mineral oil, light oils such as 3-in-1, and kerosene?
    * Will continuous exposure to water or one of the above liquids soften or damage the bonding agent?
    Answer: As with any metal piece, it should not be left in water. Even though the stone is coated in nickel, if left for long periods of time in water, it could eventually rust. You do not need to worry about compatibility or damage to the bonding agent with regard to mineral oil, light oils or kerosene.





  14. #13
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Bellingen
    Posts
    587

    Default

    Hahaha nice one kidbee!

    Thanks for posting this up!

    I remember having a chat with a cabots rep at a show a long while back. Nice chap and very helpful but one of the things he showed me on the back of their pamphlet was a little saying "when all else fails, follow the instructions!"

  15. #14
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Buderim qld
    Posts
    842

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Dono View Post
    Hahaha nice one kidbee!

    Thanks for posting this up!

    I remember having a chat with a cabots rep at a show a long while back. Nice chap and very helpful but one of the things he showed me on the back of their pamphlet was a little saying "when all else fails, follow the instructions!"
    Working for a High School I often sharpen 90 chisels at a time. Mostly I have used WD40 or the like to unclog the diamond plate.

  16. #15
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Bellingen
    Posts
    587

    Default

    That makes sense. WD 40 is mostly a solvent with a little light machine oil (so I have read anyway). I think it was naphtha?

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