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  1. #1
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    Default Veritas PM-V11 Blade sharpening

    Wondering if anyone has had same experience, and can tip me in the right direction.

    Bought my first Veritas plane with the PM-V11 steel blade.

    Hard work sharpening but got there - 400/1200 diamond plate then water-stone 6000 to polish.

    then the darnedest thing - trying to strop and get the burr off - it just wouldn't let go at all. back and forth, back and forth and all it would do is shift, not fall off.

    It's gone now after some actual planing but to me that's real strange that the burr hangs on for grim death.

    Should I be more aggressive on the strop with this kind of steel??

  2. #2
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    Well they did select this steel for it's overall toughness.....

    Can't say I've had that problem though, but my regime is different. Diamond plates up to 600, and then diamond paste 1200/3000/8000/14000. From memory the burr usually goes with the 8000.
    Regards, FenceFurniture

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  3. #3
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    Yes FF, I figured it would be tough but that burr hanging on the way it did really threw me.

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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by FenceFurniture View Post
    Well they did select this steel for it's overall toughness.....

    Can't say I've had that problem though, but my regime is different. Diamond plates up to 600, and then diamond paste 1200/3000/8000/14000. From memory the burr usually goes with the 8000.
    Do you have a resource that shows how that diamond paste sharpening works?

  5. #5
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    Water stones work fine, takes a lot of effort though.
    Innovations are those useful things that, by dint of chance, manage to survive the stupidity and destructive tendencies inherent in human nature.

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    Just as fishing lures are designed to catch fishermen as opposed to fish, fancy metal technology is designed to flatten woodworkers' wallets, not their work-pieces
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bendigo Bob View Post
    Do you have a resource that shows how that diamond paste sharpening works?
    I do indeed. There have been quite a number of converts since.

    There are waterstone diehards too of course....but I don't know of anyone who converted to paste & plates who reverted to waterstones.....
    Regards, FenceFurniture

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  8. #8
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    I use waterstones on my PMV11 blades and haven't noticed this issue. I use 1200, 6000 and 13000 grit. I find they sharpen quite quickly and easily.

    Cheers, Dom

  9. #9
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    The scanning electron microscope pictures show that steels are soft and plastic and shredded at 1,500 grit.
    On my wood carving gouges and adzes, I'll tip the axis up a degree or so at 1,500 then for honing with CrOx/AlOx.
    That seems to bite off any wire edge that I can still see with a 10X magnifier.
    I never want any steel so hard that it's brittle and chips to leave scratches in the gouge cuts.

  10. #10
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    With that input will get to again today and put on the magnifier to see what is happening too. Like everything, practice, practice, practice, then it starts to come naturally I guess.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bendigo Bob View Post
    Wondering if anyone has had same experience, and can tip me in the right direction.

    Bought my first Veritas plane with the PM-V11 steel blade.

    Hard work sharpening but got there - 400/1200 diamond plate then water-stone 6000 to polish.

    then the darnedest thing - trying to strop and get the burr off - it just wouldn't let go at all. back and forth, back and forth and all it would do is shift, not fall off.

    It's gone now after some actual planing but to me that's real strange that the burr hangs on for grim death.

    Should I be more aggressive on the strop with this kind of steel??
    That does not sound like the PM-V11 I know and use. More typically, the wire edge off this steel is very small. What you are describing is more common with A2 steel or steel that is on the softer side (which should not be the case here).

    Once you do remove the wire, does the blade hold an edge? What was the edge like - sharp?

    Iíve not had a rogue blade from Veritas, and I have used these blades longer than anyone else outside the factory. Typically, the steel is hard enough that it warrants being hollow ground, which I do. Then hone on Shapton and Sigma waterstones. Or Spyderco. Diamond stones are only good for the initial grind. They are not for polishing. Diamond can leave deeper scratches as it does not break down. I do not see this as the problem, however.

    Fresh blades are often too hard at the edge and chip a smidgeon. The recommendation is to grind back about 1mm. This is unlikely to work in your situation, since the steel sounds soft and not hard. I would contact Lee Valley and explain. Their backup is superb.

    Regards from Perth

    Derek
    Visit www.inthewoodshop.com for tutorials on constructing handtools, handtool reviews, and my trials and tribulations with furniture builds.

  12. #12
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    The edge will be held by enough steel behind it for support. Not enough support and the edge will crumple.
    I read that there's a range of suitable bevel angles that found this claim for work in a broad spectrum of woods.

    My Canadian wood working edges would need maybe 3-5 degrees extra to cope with your superbe hardwoods.

  13. #13
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    I don't think bevel angle is at play here, RV. I've used PM-V11 from 25 degrees through 50 degrees. This has no effect on the wire edge.

    Bob, tell us about the way you sharpen, and the angles.

    Regards from Perth

    Derek
    Visit www.inthewoodshop.com for tutorials on constructing handtools, handtool reviews, and my trials and tribulations with furniture builds.

  14. #14
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    Thanks Derek,

    400 and 1200 diamond at 25 degrees seeing that's the angle it is set at from the factory (The blade is for a low angle Jack.) I did notice that the primary bevel is something under 25 - I used the Veritas sharpening jig set at 25 and it is creating a secondary bevel at 25 so happy with that.

    I then took it to a 6000 King water stone (I always flatten that against a 1200 water stone before every sharpening and have never had problems with flatness)

    then to the leather on wood strop with green paste. That was where the strange immovable burr occurred.

    I swear I must have stropped it a hundred times each side altogether in a vain attempt to get that burr off. Mind you when I took the plane to a 50 year old piece of recycled Vic Ash it cut beautifully, so it obviously removed the burr in the process, so maybe I shouldn't worry. It was just strange thing I was curious about I guess

    I think I'll try it again tomorrow on a hard leather strop I made. Haven't been in the shop the past 2 days, and tomorrow will be about my last chance before going in to Hossie for the chop Friday (the old prostate cancer. Luckily they caught it early and prospects are good)

    Hopefully will be back to work in a months time. That's why I spent some 'found money' on a couple of good planes, to give myself something to look forward to 'after the chop'

    I'll ad a pic of the blade for interest. It came with a chip in the corner which I thought disappointing. I sent the photo to Carbatec for QC feedback to Veritas and they responded straight away with a gift voucher to compensate even though that wasn't my intention. Can't complain about the customer service.

    Loving the feel of the Jack plane I must say.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  15. #15
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    Bob, contact Lee Valley, not Carbatec. Carbatec are unlikely to understand the technical issue.

    A time-honoured way of removing a wire edge is to run the blade edge-on through end grain. Or slap it with your palm, as if you were playing the spoons

    Regards from Perth

    Derek
    Visit www.inthewoodshop.com for tutorials on constructing handtools, handtool reviews, and my trials and tribulations with furniture builds.

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