Thread: Powermatic vs Carbatec jointers

i have just bought a carbatec 8";i am also wondering what is so great about powermatic;i have 2m tables,a parrallel pivot type of depth adjustment[has to be the better way of mounting and adjusting the tables];the base is very long;it really supports alot of the tables' length,reducing their cantilever;not a problem with depth adjustment sensitivity.really.recently returned a jointer i had purchased from someone else new[chinese] as the tables where out of line;to be honest it made me sceptical of jointer quality control;i did my apprenticeship on some very serious machines;how could i work with a dodgy jointer?
this carba tec machine is spot on i cant believe it,are they an australian company?

Originally Posted by jahman

this carba tec machine is spot on i cant believe it,are they an australian company?

The company is but the jointer isn't

I have not had a problem with a generic jointer. The fine adjustment is a moot point as it goes through the thicknesser next.

Originally Posted by Sir Stinkalot

The company is but the jointer isn't

i was told by staff at CT that they have had this designed and made to their own specs[i think the basic design of it is generic]based on what they found their customers wanted most;not much machinery being made outside of s.e.asia these days i imagine;i used to have a scheppach hmt260[p/th];payed a lot for it new and was never impressed with anything about it [including the very sloppy tolerances];i think that was EU built,going back more than 15 years now;

I would be interested to see just how much design input that they get to put into it ......

The cynic in me would say they get to choose the colour .... blue for CT and orange (or is that now green?) for Timbecon.

I would think they like to say that they get to tweek their model so the buyer would think it is slightly different (better) from the other store that imports the same model. After that it is up to the salesperson to put their spin on it.

I am not saying that there is anything wrong with the jointer ..... just some of the tactics used to sell them

As far as I could tell when I researched this very topic, they are a copy of the delta. I bought a second hand jet for the same price as a new carbatec, I'm happy with it but often wonder if I should have bought the carbatec they really look good.

Thanks for the responses.

If I was a Powermatic 8" jointer salesman I'd make the following points:

• machine is made in Taiwan, not China. Generaly better quality, though admittedly China is catching/has caught up

• machine has a 2hp motor compared to Carbatec 1.5hp

• machine has fine adjustment on depth of cut

• looks better quality somehow. Maybe it's the 'blocky' base and the yellow paint, and it doesn't have the retailers name plastered on the side of it.

Meanwhile, over at Carbatec the pitch is:

• costs $500 less, and a $239 mobile base thrown in for free (Powermatic have a $70 mobile base available. Admittedly tht's how much the Carbatec one should be valued at)

• table surface is 100mm longer

I don't think that a paint job alone should be a deciding factor, and too often H.P. claims are bogus. Bearing and motor quality, machining quality and accuracy should be the deciding factors. How exactly these things can be compared is left as an exercise for the student.

I have a mate who has a C/T 8" model-he is very pleased with it. I think that it is very good value for the money for those without three phase power.

Greg

If I was a Powermatic buyer I'd make the following points:

• machine is made in Taiwan, not China. Generaly better quality, though admittedly China is catching/has caught up
This from the same company that used to crow about it being made in the USA. It's not about provenance, it's about quality. At the end of the day, when you look at a piece of wood cut by a Powermatic or a Taiwanese/Chinese/Burmese or Moroccan machine - can you tell which one cut it? Will your customer?

• machine has a 2hp motor compared to Carbatec 1.5hp
If they are both the same quality motors, the 2hp is probably better. Is the Powermatic a 15amp machine?

• machine has fine adjustment on depth of cut
I mentioned earlier the fine adjustment doesn't really appeal as the next cut is on the thicknesser.

• looks better quality somehow. Maybe it's the 'blocky' base and the yellow paint, and it doesn't have the retailers name plastered on the side of it.
What would the cheaper machine look like if you painted it mustard and polished the tables?

Meanwhile, over at Carbatec the pitch is:

• costs $500 less, and a $239 mobile base thrown in for free (Powermatic have a $70 mobile base available. Admittedly tht's how much the Carbatec one should be valued at)
$500 buys a Japanese chisel set that'll give you wet dreams....
For $239 my neighbour tells me he will come into the workshop and move the jointer for me whenever I want. Tell them to remove it and drop the price $239, if they do, then I'll believe it. Mind you, it does look like a nice set up if you want to move it around a lot.

• table surface is 100mm longer
If you know how long a piece of timber you can joint on a jointer 100mm shorter, and what you will miss out on if you don't get the extra length, then maybe it's important. For the one off long jointing session it isn't too hard to attach an extension jig (2 clamps, 8 nails, 8" x 10" board and two sticks 2" x 16" to nail it to).

When I bought mine I would have loved to buy the Powermatic (now Jet), but settled for the cheaper Taiwanese machine with a dust collector included. I don't regret the decision 2-3 years later.

Just make sure the fence is square to the tables at BOTH ends, returns to square when it is moved, the tables are coplanar and there is no twist in the tables or the fence. The switch on the post is a good idea, I like it.

Personally I just think JET and Powermatic are just a little bit better. I can’t tell you what it is. Maybe it is the reputation.

They dealer in Sydney (Major woodworking) is very good to deal with plus they gave me free delivery ($150) and they were very helpful when the machine got here. I got mine 10 months ago and it didn’t run in the beginning, gave them a call, the guy came to me the next day, checked it and replaced the broken safety switch right away.

I am probably paying for the name and the good service from them. More importantly I am very happy with the machine.

Thanks Gregory, Wongo and others for your feedback. Thanks Groggy for your comprehensive post; in response:

At the end of the day, when you look at a piece of wood cut by a Powermatic or a Taiwanese/Chinese/Burmese or Moroccan machine - can you tell which one cut it? Will your customer?
If they aren't dead straight i might be able to!

If they are both the same quality motors, the 2hp is probably better. Is the Powermatic a 15amp machine?
Good point.

I mentioned earlier the fine adjustment doesn't really appeal as the next cut is on the thicknesser.
It matters to me cos I mainly use a jointer for edge jointing boards; they don't go throught he thicknesser at all.

What would the cheaper machine look like if you painted it mustard and polished the tables?
Yellower and shinier. Sorry, but proportions still aren't as nice!

$500 buys a Japanese chisel set that'll give you wet dreams....
Where can I get a set of those?

Just make sure the fence is square to the tables at BOTH ends, returns to square when it is moved, the tables are coplanar and there is no twist in the tables or the fence.
No can do. Machine will be two hours from retailer when I check these things, and I would have to pay for return freight. I want a machine that doesn't arrive like this!

Theres not much between the two when you look at everything.

If the $500 wasn't such a big issue I'd go with the Powermatic personally. Why?.. Reputation mostly...Almost all Powermatic machines get good ratings (tablesaws,mortisers,drillpresses,thicknessers,jointers), and have done for years. They are well made, parts are well machined, fit and finish is usually spot on.
But $500 is alot of $$$, could go towards something else:confused:

Review after review, the JET and Powermatic machines rate highly. They are usually made in the same locations as many of the other machines but their quality control is known to be a lot more stringent than many of the unbranded/store branded machines.

There was a thread about branding and in the end you not only pay for the name but a more consistent quality. That said, most of the Carba-tec branded machines I have looked at seem to pretty good.

I like Wongo have only good things to say about JET, Powermatic and Major Woodworking in Sydney. For mine, I will continue to pay the extra and will expect to get it back if I sell any of the JET gear.

I note that no one mentioned resale value. Put it in the Trading Post and it usually dissappears pretty quickly. Every upgrade I've made, it has been very easy to sell the JET gear.

Very good point there boban.

I mainly have old heavy gear. The only Powermatic machine that I own is a morticer. I am extremely happy with this machine. Machining and fit quality are excellent. I have only had it for a few weeks, and have done enough jobs with it, that have paid for the machine. I would always pay a little extra, from now on, after experiencing the quality and function of their gear.

There are plenty of potential faults with a machine, that you may not be able to see, or readilly identify. Ask about the castings on the machines. Does the higher priced machine have better castings? These machines are shipped out of chasia at an allarming rate. How many of the castings have been seasoned and releaved as part of the manufacturing process.......... Especially important with a jointer.

Just a couple of rambling thoughts...


Edit... spelt chasia incorrectly.