Thread: process of grading timber

Seems a bit odd but is probably OK
When I graded the frame for my extention the building inspector (who didn't know a lot) didn't like my timber crayon F11 etc. He told me if I was a proper timber grader I would have a rubber stamp. So I got a rotating number stamp with an F stuck on it and used my return address stamp for envelopes and stamped every stick. I asked the instructor who taught me what was needed he said you need to show something so they know who to blame if a stick fails. So this bloke with the paper is taking a risk maybe.

I was told during my grading, that yep, timber has stamps on it, but it's not a requirement. The inspector wants to see a stamp so he is 'let of the hook' with regards to any litigation - after all in the event something fails, he 'inspected' the work and 'passed' it.

With my build I was all keen to show council inspector my grading certificates (as no timber was stamped or even written on with chalk) but he wasn't interested and even went so far as to embarrass himself by mistaking pine framing for hardwood framing I didn't pick him up on it, thought discretion would be better on my part.

On a legal side I'd suppose it would be good to have the timber stamped, but the wording of the building regulations is such that "All timber to be used in domestic construction is to be graded." it doesn't specify how, or even that it needs to be graded by someone with a ticket or equivalent qualifications and definitely does not state the timber is required to be stamped.

In response to your question Footrot, if I graded a pile of timber for someone else, there would be nothing stopping them adding more timber to the stack once I've left - other than, it's their own building/house/home and who would be silly enough to run the gauntlet???

I was told by our largest local hardwood sawmill, when asked about grading tickets, his response wasn't every one of our employees are qualified, or we have a grading team that does it or we have 1 guy who grades... he said it's common sense, if you wouldn't use it then it doesn't pass!!!

he said it's common sense, if you wouldn't use it then it doesn't pass!!!

and that's exactly right.

So when I start building my shed I should scrawl F14 on each member with timber crayon and it's all good then? It will be up to standard of course, I just don't have the ticket

Yep I was told when we did the grading course that any one could grade and you didn't need to be qualified. Well you could read the rules to say that.
I cut the timber for my shed rough sawn pine ungraded and the building inspector was happy. I new nothing about grading then, it seems that the building inspector new little more.

seems to have changed a bit since the 70's, you used to have to mark the grade and your grading lisence number on the timber,

Bob I think only saw mills get numbers. My number is 01/96 meaning I was the first to get a licence in a new system in 1996. I asked if I put this number on timber and this is when he told me anyone can grade.

I had a grading licence issued in 1975 or thereabouts under the old system.
By the time I woke up after a few years things had changed and I didn't have a licence.

Anyone can grade? even without a licence?

if anyone can grade without a licence then why have a licence?

i have always been taught that if you are selling the timber you must have a grading ticket.

Maybe if you are selling graded timber you need one carl. It was 13 years ago when I did mine so I can't remember exacxtly what he said and it may have changed.

I think the problem comes about from the way life is heading now, with all this bloody litigation for stuff which used to be common sense. Nowadays it's easier to blame someone else rather than accept we should have used common sense in the first place.

In reality graded timber is not needed for making projects like chook pens, dog houses, sandbox for the kids, it's needed for construction/building, right? The wording of BCA regulations is so general and broad, it allows interpretation. As it doesn't specify something like 'a person has to be qualified and hold a relevant ticket for grading...' society nowadays interprets that as a ticket isn't needed, and legally I can see that being okay. It defies common sense, but that's the way the legal system is now. The wording of the BCA is and I quote "All timber to be used in domestic construction is to be graded." There is no mention of, to what standard, if the grading is done physically or mechanically, if the person doing it has a qualification - nothing. So if you get RSH from a mobile miller and you look through the timber and decide to use 20 out of 35 sticks, you could legally argue that you have 'graded' it and I can see that in court that would stand up - ridiculous, but tell me (when considering the legal system) it isn't true???

I'm not saying it's right, I'm not advocating doing it that way - I have recently had 5x2peices of timber, which could have been F17 (AS 2082-2000) and they just split in half when I took a wheelbarrow of concrete over a 600mm length. The timber was clean, no knots, borrer holes, sloping grain, no other discernible factors to effect it's use as F17, but just broke in half!!! This is where you need qualified graders, to most people that would be a totally serviceable peice of timber, but it was nowhere near serviceable - hence I was using it just to bridge a 100mm trench.

You get what I mean

Originally Posted by Sigidi

I'm not saying it's right, I'm not advocating doing it that way - I have recently had 5x2peices of timber, which could have been F17 (AS 2082-2000) and they just split in half when I took a wheelbarrow of concrete over a 600mm length. The timber was clean, no knots, borrer holes, sloping grain, no other discernible factors to effect it's use as F17, but just broke in half!!! This is where you need qualified graders, to most people that would be a totally serviceable peice of timber, but it was nowhere near serviceable - hence I was using it just to bridge a 100mm trench.

What species was it? How would a qualified grader have known better than an unqualified person in that instance?

The BCA wording could also be interpreted as "All timber to be used in domestic construction is to be graded to standards, ie. Properly"

Sigidi, did the timber break at an invisible felling shake?

FC the species was bluegum, it was clean - no knots, splits etc. the problem was it was heart. When it split, (Bob) I thought it could have been felling damage, but along the split line both faces of the timber where a whitish/grey colour. I wasn't using it because it was all heart, but most people would look at it and say it's a good stick - even the neighbour wanted to buy some sticks off me, (told him I didn't have any spare) I have a timber yard in the front yard at the moment, he said "what are those for?"
'rafters for side decks'
"and those?"
'rafters for middle deck'
"and those?"
'joists for middle deck'
"what about these?"
'verandah beams and pole plates'
"what about them?"
'roof battens'
"ok, what about these?"
'nah, you don't want them, they are cr@p'
"they look better than what I'm buying already, I'll take 'em"
'no good mate, you don't want 'em, I can't sell em to you' - It was a stack of heart boards I had weeded out of from all the timber.

I'm not saying the legal system is right, but you can see, I've directly quoted the BCA wording and there is another interpretation...