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Thread: R&D Question

  1. #1
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    Default R&D Question

    We are making a 50mm (2") bandsaw for use on our NEW monorail system.

    Question for our R&D is how much cutting width is wanted by those who would use the bandsaw version of this mill.

    Wheels are 630mm diameter so in theory we can have a cut width of 900mm to 1.2m.

    Motivation will be 13hp, 18hp, 30hp and hydraulic power units.

    We are developing this bandsaw mill for australian hardwoods but it should be good for any.

    thanks
    End of another day milling

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  3. #2
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    How long is a piece of string?
    Regards, Bob Thomas

    www.wombatsawmill.com

  4. #3
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    As long as you require if you cut it right.

    I prefer the swing mill but there are times when I wished I had a bandsaw.

    The monorail mill we have produced currently uses a 90degree swingmill or a chainsaw version for slabbing.

    With the right sized bandsaw you have three different milling heads on ONE mill with a possible price of less than $12,000 for everything.

    The 50mm band width is somewhat fixed but the overall cutting capacity is not hence the question on what is needed.

    A piece of string that is too long is a pain and one which is too short cannot be used for the job needed!!!
    End of another day milling

  5. #4
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    Calm is offline Stubby Owner and proud of it. Now coming back to Earth.:D
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    Quote Originally Posted by echnidna View Post
    How long is a piece of string?
    Always approximately 1 inch shorter than required
    regards

    David


    "Tell him he's dreamin."
    "How's the serenity" (from "The Castle")

  6. #5
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    would you not make use of the 1200 mm if made 900 mm bet every second log would be 950 mm always the way and why is it limited to 50mm if this is increased the chainsaw power head would not be needed on your set up.

  7. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmaxwell View Post
    would you not make use of the 1200 mm if made 900 mm bet every second log would be 950 mm always the way and why is it limited to 50mm if this is increased the chainsaw power head would not be needed on your set up.
    As has been said you always need that extra inch so where do you stop?

    I believe that the chainsaw head will always be needed for those who only want to spend $4000 for the mill and need a highly hand portable solution. Difference is you the owner use your own powerhead and therefore the cost and weight is reduced as most millers need a chainsaw anyway.

    However, after using a chainsaw slabbing mill all day the reduction in noise and vibration would be wonderfull. An electric for home use would almost be silent.

    We could always go to 1.5m but that would require additional power to drive the band.

    The other question is then portability. The chainsaw powered mill is very lightweight and very hand portable at lessthan 100kg plus chainsaw.

    The swinger is about 220kg and the bandsaw at 1.2m will be approx 250kg.

    We plan to add another 100kg by upgrading the carry cradle to become a road legal trailer so the mill actually converts to a trailer taking about 10 minutes. This will allow the mill to be transported to the log with ease and be milling within 10 minutes. No room for timber on the trailer just your tools.
    End of another day milling

  8. #7
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    i have a few questions for you.

    The other question is then portability. The chainsaw powered mill is very lightweight and very hand portable at lessthan 100kg plus chainsaw
    how can a chainsaw milling frame weigh that mutch without the saw and still be called "Highly portable".

    The swinger is about 220kg and the bandsaw at 1.2m will be approx 250kg.
    how do you get this onto the milling frames with only one person. or to teh log for that matter.

    We plan to add another 100kg by upgrading the carry cradle to become a road legal trailer so the mill actually converts to a trailer taking about 10 minutes. This will allow the mill to be transported to the log with ease and be milling within 10 minutes. No room for timber on the trailer just your tools.
    this would limit the portability of the mill. it can then only be taken where you can drive with a trialer. in most cases i find myself milling up in the bush or in a bcak yard.


    i would not buy a bandsaw mill with less cut than 1.2m but 1.5m would be more eceptable.

    www.carlweiss.com.au
    Mobile Sawmilling & Logging Service
    8" & 10" Lucas Mills, bobcat, 4wd tractor, 12 ton dozer, stihl saws.

  9. #8
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    Excellent questions Carl - I would like to read some answers.

    I must say I have trouble hiking around the scrub with my own "highly portable Ecosaw". I am still waiting to see how the trailer I bought goes, but in the meantime have recently found that a 1000lb rated mini crane mounted with steel reinforcement on the back of my 4wd does the job.

    Darkwood

  10. #9
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    The weight is lessthan 100kg depending on the configuration of the mill.

    The lightest uses 1.2m endframes and a 3m rail and is about 55kg. The 1.5m and 6m rail is up around the 100kg.

    Also depends on size of bar which we can include.

    The chainsaw power head can be upgraded to a petrol driven unit with an allup weight of lessthan 120kg using a 13hp unit for the smaller config. For a dedicated slabber this is far less weight than the Peterson or Lucas slabbing mills, cheaper and when packed away is a lot more compact.

    The trailer option is just that an option for those who dont have a utility vehicle but want the enjoyment of milling their own timber. The trailer option is a bolt-on and still allows you to transport the mill by any other means including by hand.

    If you disassemble the endframes (about 30 minutes) two people can carry the entire mill. One each end of the single rail.

    1.5m would be the upper limit. However we could offer 1m and 1.5m although the price difference would only be about $500 or so. The longer would be more inclind to wonder in the harder timber but is this that much of a problem?

    I know there has been much discussion on the problem of bandsaws wander in hardwoods. Can be a big problem with boards but in reality how much of a problem is it if the bandsaw is just used for slabbing or the boards are to be dressed?

    Carl, hope this helps
    End of another day milling

  11. #10
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    I use a Lucas as i mill trees that are up to 1800 wide so if you guys made a bandsaw mill that could handle australian hardwoods & maybe have tungsten teeth on the blade id be interested.
    but 1500 wide would be more appealing & the more power the better.

    would be interesting to see its cut speed as apposed to the chain on my lucas

  12. #11
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    Bunta

    Bands supplied will be either 5xsteel or 1 x Stellite tip for approx $300. We will be testing using the Stellite tip as it is a harder tip more suited for aussie hardwoods.

    1.8m would be another milling head all together using a 100mm (4") blade and 900mm wheels. Far heavier and needing hydraulic power unit using 160hp diesel. Not realy what we are looking at and plenty of good manufacures out there already.

    The bandsaw we are looking to develop will use our milling system so you can have the choice of circular or bandsaw on the same milling system. Or both!!!
    End of another day milling

  13. #12
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    Anyone who has a medium to large bandsaw in their shop knows how hard it is to set-up and cut consistently when you start taking it to it's cutting limits. 1-2mm over a slab is all I would accept in variation.

    I just don't see how, when taking into consideration the fine tuning one performs in the shop with a bandsaw, then factor in the bandsaw never moves or vibrates down country/dirt roads and never has to be packed up and set-up each time it is used. Then start looking at how many bandsaw mills like the american ones (quite a lot in use) and all of them are very limited in width.

    All of this into consideration, I feel one would need to re-invent the wheel to get a bandsaw slabber (1.5m capacity) with consistent, accurate, reproduceable results in a mobile scenario.

    It sure would be nice as the recovery would be quite good when looking at losing 3in of mateiral over 7 slabs so if gaining a slab for every seven when compared to a chainsaw slabber that's about 15% better recovery.

    But I'm just the quintesential doubting thomas, just about everything works on paper
    I love my Lucas!! ...just ask me!
    Allan.

  14. #13
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    I had a small Portamill (20" from memory) and it was a major pita , after ripping about 4 slabs off a brown stringy the blade would lose edge and wander,

    Bloke down this way in Cudgee (since deceased) used to make bs mills that would slab 5' or 6' redgum logs. See him demonstrating at the field days and he would always have wavy slabs.

    None of the local spot millers down here use bandsaws, they all have swingsaws.

    The only way you could make a reliable small bs mill is to build into the machine a band sharpeing & setting tool so you could sharpen bands on the machine. I posted a link to a bandsaw sharpener in these forums that would be perfect for the job. See here their website was online last time I looked. You should be able to adapt a cordless angle grinder fitted with a fine grit wheel to do the job.

    ps I tried stellite tipped blades etc, it was still a fool of a thing to use.
    Regards, Bob Thomas

    www.wombatsawmill.com

  15. #14
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    As an example

    Other manufacturers who have been making bandmills for almost 80 years require a 49hp power head to drive a maximum 800mm cut and in excess of a massive 2.5Ton peice of equipment to hold everything together.

    So what I'm wondering is how can a 13hp power head push a 900mm cut using something with less than 10% of the weight behind it and still expouse mobility, accuracy, production in comparison with the aformentioned example of technology currently available by a mufacturer with over three quaters of a century of experience???

    still very much a doubting thomas....
    I love my Lucas!! ...just ask me!
    Allan.

  16. #15
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    13hp will handle a 50mm blade comfortably.
    Regards, Bob Thomas

    www.wombatsawmill.com

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