Thread: Strapping Timber Question

I would use webbing and adjustable tensioners rather than steel banding, timber shrinks and you'd be cutting and rebanding the stack if steel bands were used not to mention getting stain from the timber tannis reacting with the steel, whereas with webbing you just crank it up a bit each time it starts getting loose.

Yes that makes sense,thanks DJ. So would you suggest something similar to a truckies tie down system or is there something more specific to the timber way of things?
Excuse my ignorance.

I reckon it depends if you just want to hold some timber packs together or you really want to put the squeeze on the timber.
It also depends on the size of the timber and the amount of timber you have available.
I had some of my stuff under webbing but I found that quality webbing straps and tensioners are expensive and don't even think about using the cheap Sontax blue webbing packs you see on special in the big hardware stores as they just stretch and stretch and stretch
If you only have a few packs of timber and/or already have the webbing straps then webbing is a very good quick solution but you will have to do the sums yourself.
If the webbing is too small it will not be able to provide the same tension as steel so you may have to use more straps

It's very easy to re-tension steel banding using a couple of opposing shallow wedges across each strap.
When the strap get loose the wedges are belted in a bit further with a sledge hammer.

I agree about the steel strap staining being a problem.
To get around this I don't strap direct onto the timber. I strap mine cross the stickers or blocks of wood because this also protects the edge of the wood.
In the diagram the length and thickness of the stickers are a bit exaggerated.
Normally I cut the top and bottom stickers so they are only about 10 mm longer than the wood is wide


In terms of tools, the first thing that goes on steel strapping tensioners is the knurled grippy thing.
On cheap units these will wear out very quickly.

This is the steel banding one I have: http://www.signet.net.au/store/categ...trapping-tools
and this is the crimper I have
http://www.signet.net.au/store/categ...-strap-crimper
Not cheap but they work very well.

I do mine the same as BobL. I only use 12mm steel strap and have had no problem. You should be able to pick up a set of strapping tools for less than $150 second hand. Be carefull of the elcheapo's. Better to only go for reputable makes if second hand and make sure the knurls are still sharp and not warn down. I got mine off ebay from a courier that was going out of business.

Thankyou, that's helped me out a lot. At the moment I'm milling Radiata pine , probably a couple of hundred logs. I'm going to use some of it to build a big blokes shed (using traditional joinery) and also Warre bee hives and other bits and bobs. The bee boxes are about 20 ml thick, I milled the timber oversize to compensate for movement. This summer sorted out my assumptions about how much timber can wander under extreme conditions.
Anyway now that the year is starting to cool, I'm looking forward to making more boards and posts.

Originally Posted by HUON

Thankyou, that's helped me out a lot. At the moment I'm milling Radiata pine , probably a couple of hundred logs. I'm going to use some of it to build a big blokes shed (using traditional joinery) and also Warre bee hives and other bits and bobs. The bee boxes are about 20 ml thick, I milled the timber oversize to compensate for movement. This summer sorted out my assumptions about how much timber can wander under extreme conditions.
Anyway now that the year is starting to cool, I'm looking forward to making more boards and posts.

On Ya Huon. Like to see the photo's once you are done

If I may butt in, a proffessional miller I know uses huge slabs cast in concrete to provide a stabilising influence. These are left overs from a nearby concreting business. They also place a small hook of reo to assit with mving and lifting

He does not use banding or strapping

Willy

I hate steel strapping and wouldn't recommend it to anyone except in the following circumstances:
1. You're getting the gear very very cheap
2. You intend to sell sleepers to QLD rail.

Other then that it achieves nothing that you won't achieve with good quality 3/4 poly. Poly can be reused... just leave a long tail on it and cut the right side the clip and it's perfectly fine.
Poly does not discolour timber. Steel will leave black staining when in contact with wet timber. If the timbers dry it's already too late to worry about in-pack movement.
Poly is strong enough to hold packs in place during any normal handling operation. If you're really stressed about it just run a few more straps... it'll hold the timber better then using fewer steel straps.
Poly is not a PITA to use.

Strapping is the least important element of getting timber to dry straight. It's far more important to have boards at an even thickness, properly placed stickers, stickers at an even thickness, and proper storage, including not having too much airflow, no direct sunlight, and putting weight on freshly sawn packs if necessary. Strapping should be really only there to make it easier to move packs around.

If you're really hung up on needing strength use signode high strength tenax.... as strong as steel but it's still poly.

My $0.02

Hi all

I use fencing wire and Gripples. As the pack shrinks, just add a little more tension. Gripples are reusable, wire is cheap. But also John G is correct in saying that straight timber is comes from doing the entire process correctly and exactly from the start. Be fussy with your milling and racking and you'll get straight boards.

Cheers

James

Originally Posted by tassietimbers

Hi all

I use fencing wire and Gripples. As the pack shrinks, just add a little more tension. Gripples are reusable, wire is cheap. But also John G is correct in saying that straight timber is comes from doing the entire process correctly and exactly from the start. Be fussy with your milling and racking and you'll get straight boards.

Cheers

James

Y'know I'd never thought about using Gripples for that and I've got a heap of the things in a tin in the shed: the complementary comes on the end of a roll of barb ones, cause we cut them out. They failed as a wire joiner on fences up here because every grass fire that went through burnt the guts out of them. Thanks James.

I hear you when you advise using same dimension timbers and packers, I'll follow those suggestions, thankyou. And poly and non staining properties makes good sense. I wasn't going to worry too much about tying down the big timbers (10x10 posts for example),definitely pack and stack with care though.
You've given me food for thought, thanks again.

Hi all

Having your rack sticks even is very important. I use 42 x 19 DAR for racks sticks for all boards and square stock up to 100mm. (I was lucky enough to get a full semi load of down grade 42 x 19 at a price that made it not worth cutting my own sticks!) After that, 40mm hardwood or 35mm pine sticks for 125mm squares and above, and all slabs. This allows me to slip the fork tynes between ther layers and avoid any heavy lifting.

Rack bases are made of heavy gauge ex-drill pipe with movable cross members, levelled perfectly with base plates and old cement sheet packers. Packs then hessian wrapped to even out air flow and avoid sunlight and capped with a heavy duty ex-mine poly tarp (old ventilation bag). Then strapped down with wire over a top cross member to given an even pull down on the top. The results are very good. A few pics for your info.

Cheers

James

I used to have three stack systems, but now I have four:

Slabs are stacked anywhere and anyhow I can fit them in piles till they reach "don't bump it with the forklift" height. Stickers are invariably 75 x 38 shorts of batten, and I'm quite particular on keeping them (the stickers) aligned verticaly. As James said, it makes life easy if you can just slip the forks in and lift a few off at a time. All slabs get an identifying number in paint on the end, and a picture of both sides prior to racking. This means if a dude is chasing a slab I can show him an album of pictures rather then having to pull every slab to look at.

Scantling timber is block stacked. There's a row of stickers every third layer, which serves to open the timber out for penetration in the dip and to stop the stack falling over when the straps get cut. Packs are kept strapped as much as possible to keep moisture levels from dropping... gets to dry and it gets hard to drive nails into it. Packs are kept at 800 wide for standardised loading.

Anything going to dry is stacked using a frame to help align the stickers. Stickers are run on 450 centers, though in material under 25mm or highly figured timber I expect to move I put another row between those. Stickers are mostly 20 x 20 DAR which means it doesnt matter which way they are placed. I do have some wider ones I use where two pieces of timber are butting up in a stack, and I also use 12 mm stickers I use if I want to retard airflow through a stack for slower drying. All stickers are 800 mm long, meaning that I can get three packs of stripped out timber across a truck for standardised loading. Packs are kept at 5.7 long as much as possible as that means they fit in a standard TEU container or a kiln based on one. With stickers removed I can also get three packs across an ISO container for sending to the USA. 25mm packs have 12 layers to the pack... it gives me that standardised height for loading on top of each other again and means I can use full width dunnage on trucks. It also works out at just over a cube to the pack which means smaller forklifts can load/unload them.
The cabinetry woods are a little different as I tend to get a lot of bits and pieces but I use the same stickers, same spacings, it's just that a high proportion of the packs will be short. We often get one tree packs as some of the lesser species we only cut occasionally and they're often small salvage size logs. Those packs will be mixed thickness as I try and cut that one tree to suit a "project"... couple of wide 2", bit of 38, and the balance at 25mm.
Packs are seperated by 75 x 38/50 at 800 long thats been dressed back to 65. The bottom layer off the shed floor is treated, and the entire shed is sprayed once a year in addition to borax dipping when green. I got borers in there once and never want to go there again... we still get borer damage in the yard though.
Standardising as much as possible means you can stack packs on top of each other with no drama, and i tend to try and put dry packs on green packs for weight. Weather depending I may stack fresh packs in front of dryer packs to keep a higher moisture level through a stack, or partially seasoned in front of green if I want to drop the moisture faster. Stickers are kept in line easily because they're all the same distance apart even in differing length packs, and each new row of packs is lined up with the last for airflow through the stacks. I can pretty much air dry in my sheds faster then a lot of solar kilns and only need to kiln to drop the last few percent.

IMG_0438.jpgIMG_0435.jpgIMG_0288.jpg



When it's time to say goodbye, packs are broken, stickers removed for further use and the timber is again stacked in the rack to get the same standard width pack. Standardised loading makes for lower freight rates, and I seem to spend a lot of time making stickers so I hate seeing them leave.

Originally Posted by tassietimbers

Hi all

I use fencing wire and Gripples. As the pack shrinks, just add a little more tension. Gripples are reusable, wire is cheap. But also John G is correct in saying that straight timber is comes from doing the entire process correctly and exactly from the start. Be fussy with your milling and racking and you'll get straight boards.

Cheers

James

I've been doing the same for a while.
Do you find that the newer gripples don't grip as securely as the older ones. I am finding when I get to the last bit of tension that they allow the wire to slide 10-15mm, sometimes a bit more, before they grip whereas the old gripples seemed a lot more secure in their action. I've never had a gripple slip off once it gripped though.