Thread: If I mill my own pine for framing timber, with what do I treat it?

Originally Posted by rustynail

I think you would loose the bet. A 4.8m long log with a dia of 620mm will yield 44 lengths of 4.8 x .100 x .050= 1.06m3 or 211.2 linial. At $7 per lineal metre = $1478.40 per log. Log cost = 0. Cutting time = 1 hour. Handling time (usually about double cutting time)= 2 hours.
Therefore after 3 hours work you have a potential $1478.40 stacked and stickered. Which, in simple terms, represents $492.66/hour for your labour.
In summary,
The logs are free.
3.5 logs and I've paid for my second hand saw @ $5K.
7 logs and Ive paid for a new one @ $10K.
Labour per log = about 3 man hours.
Even if you buy a new saw and pay someone $100/hour to run it you only have to mill 10 logs to be in front.

I'm not disagreeing with your numbers but it's what I call a "rose eyed glasses millers view" of what often happens.
It's the sort of justification used by many newbies especially in North America.
The result is lots of used mills for sale by folks for whom it did not quite work out.

Let me put the opposite view;
- cost of transporting and handling of logs and timber. Even a 6 x4 trailer costs money to buy and maintain.
- Free logs can = crap logs ie twists, nails, knots, branches, cracks, rot etc.
- inexperienced operator wastes time and timber all the way down the line,and for some time before they at your level of productivity
- poor/limited recovery from stacked timber.
- wait time of a couple of years to air dry, after all, time does after all equal money.
- cost of space and cover for mill and timber storage.

Then if you're not using it, you have to sell the timber to unknown persons and entities to recover costs.
This is a lot harder than it sounds,
- not everyone is a salesman,
- because it's not coming from a unknown source/supplier people will want it dirt cheap.
- worthwhile selling deals require higher volume and regular supply - not always possible if you rely on free logs or are time limited.
- the time and phone calls involved esp dealing with tyre kickers, becomes a right PITA.

A determined/skilled operator can do very well, especially with the current timber prices, but it's still not quite as straight forward as it sounds.

Bob, I could not agree with you more. I have often written on the vagaries of saw milling. I am well aware of the setup costs and potential losses on crook logs, inexperianced operators, poor drying yields, etc, etc, etc.
BUT the OP said he had his own trees on his own property and obviously a bit of time on his hands.
Time only costs money if you waste it.
Efficiency is the name of the game.
Yes, I have the experience. But if I had not taken the plunge as a young bloke, I would not have gained the ability to make the operation pay, nor would I be able to make a difficult job seem easy.
I don't consider myself to be a rose glasses type of person. In fact, quite the opposite.
As for selling the timber, the OP was not suggesting this to be his intention. All he wants to do is cut scantling for his own use. The cost to do this is a mill, some fuel, oil and time. Some tin to cover the stacks which may or may not come with a price tag and thats it.
If he goes to Bunnings he will fork out $7.00/LM. Probably rubbish and now he has to get it home. Meanwhile, his trees are still standing in his paddock wishing they could whistle.
So he bites the bullet, buys a mill, cuts what he wants, decides that's enough milling for him and sells the mill. How much out of pocket is he? Depends how close to purchase price his mill goes for. Now here is the rose glasses bit you are not going to like; When I sold my original old mill I got $2K more than I paid for it. Sorry about that. I promise I won't do it again. ( Removes rose coloured glasses and stops talking with a Yank accent.)
I would hate to be without my mills. Yes it can be hard work but it is also thereputic. Forking out good money unnecessarily at Bunnings isn't.

Originally Posted by rustynail

I would hate to be without my mills. Yes it can be hard work but it is also thereputic. Forking out good money unnecessarily at Bunnings isn't.

The therapeutic value is indeed very interesting.

When I started (chainsaw) milling in 2007 I was still working at Uni where I was line managing about 65 people, some of which were very difficult to deal with. I really looked forward to my Saturdays when I could go early to the Tree loppers yard alone and and fire up my big chainsaw mill, make a lot of noise and sawdust and make the odd bit of useful timber too. I'd typically get home late covered in sawdust and grime, physically knackered but happy. During the week after work I'd spend a couple of hours each evening sharpening chains, or building mills (I've built 4 of them) or milling related gizmos, or doing other wood/metal work. I started sleeping better and was able to deal with work issues in a more relaxed way. I unintentionally left a large chainsaw bar clearly visible in my office - people coming to see me about "issues"noticed it and I was amused at their increased wariness reaction - I left it there for several years and added a few others.

In terms of generating value for money "timber wise" this period was a complete failure (I hate selling stuff) but I reckon the therapeutic value of all this is what got me though my last 6 years at work. My tree feller dad passed away in 1999 so never saw me doing any of this but I reckon he's up or down there laughing his head off at his white collar son doing blue collar work for a hobby, especially after he worked so hard to send us to uni to get white collar jobs.

Anyway, all this was a major contributor to my early retirement in early 2013 when I decided a retirement with less income was better than driving myself nuts at work. I kept saying to myself, what's the benefit of retiring with more income but a shattered mental health. I don't feel guilty about it as I don't draw any pension (yet?).

Not that I've chainsaw milled much timber since I retired. In 2014 I started bandsaw milling for the tree lopper. It's not quite the same experience as chainsaw milling, although the greater productivity provides a decent element of satisfaction. Anyway, although I have cut up some bulk timber for the tree lopper, my main task at the tree loppers yard is not to mill bulk timber but to service the two bandsaw mills which I find much more engaging. Meanwhile I have HEAPS of other interests like metal work, electronics, dust collection, coffee, keeping SWMBO supplied with wood and metal related gizmos for her hobbies, and being a general BS artist on these and other forums. I've had other health concerns slow me down, especially where milling is concerned, but I seem to be getting over these new.

I'm not a pro miller by any means but I think i can really appreciate more than most the level of skill and organization needed especially in milling large amounts of consistently milled timber.

I have just come in for morning tea (smoko). A mate arrived at 5am this morning with a log I had agreed to slab for him today. What a log! 3.6m long 1.5m dia at the butt and 1.3m at the head. Australian Red Cedar. One of my favourites. He has recently purchased a property in the Barrington area of NSW and in the course of clearing lantana "found" this log when his dozer stopped going forward in a particularly dense thicket. How long it had been laying there is anyones guess but all the sap wood was gone. We have slabbed it to 60mm through and through, yielding 19 slabs ranging from 500mm to 1500mm wide. He is also taking a stack of pine I had drying since the fires to make up a load.
Thats milling. Thats therapeutic ( I spelt in wrong before.) No pressure, no tyre kicking no sales pitch. While we have been sitting having a cuppa I showed him this discussion we have been having. He just smiled, shut his eyes and slowly shook his head. Bush blokes are like that.

Two excellent summaries of chainsaw milling for fun or profit!

Both views are spot-on, I reckon. My own approach has been strictly hobby-scale & largely for fun (though as I said, the fun part is diminishing with age ). I inherited the slabbing rail when my then 85 yr old father decided he'd had enough of playing with timber. It came with a very much-used Stihl 070, which served me well enough for a few years but eventually became more bother to keep running than it was worth, so I bought a smaller, lighter, MS391 which is really stretched driving a 36" blade, but I only use it occasionally in that role. My aim is solely to grab the occasional windfall like the large jacaranda the folks next door had taken down.

Chainsaw milling is tedious & converts way too much wood into sawdust, but at least I get to save some stuff that would otherwise end up as chips. How profitable it is for me is moot. I do get some good stuff that would be difficult, impossible or expensive to buy, I got the gear for nothing (the new saw was bought mostly for other purposes so not much has to be put against yields), so my only real outlay has been fuel & oil, which would be insignificant compared with the value of the wood I've obtained.n As Rusty said, time only costs when you waste it (I like that one!).

One other thing to consider - as a lad I spent a lot of time with my dad in the bush, so I had a fair background in felling & sawing up trees before I took up occasional milling. Handling large powerful saws & bowling trees over needs to be done with a bit of care, & it's not the sort of job for the inexperienced to tear into will-nilly. Mistakes can be very costly to life & property but the risks are manageable & caution will help while you gain experience. Good gear, appropriate to the sort of milling you want to do will make the job so much easier & more efficient.

Cheers,