Thread: two questions

I doubt that very few, if any of those big slabs will stand the test of time as fine furniture etc

Hi Sumu,
Are you intending to import some slabs and have your way with them?!!
From my experience big slabs are asking for trouble! A lot of Eucalypt slabs are pretty unstable unless sealed all over. They have a tendency to split (I have heard them crack when slabbing with a chainsaw mill), and cup too. If the timber comes from long dead trees, like the river red gum I have worked with (salvaged after salinity poisoning or flooding), it seems pretty good, but maybe a characteristic of the timber anyway. I just think that the slow dry of a whole tree standing in water must have some effect on seasoning...once heard about English oak baulks being purposely seasoned under water to prevent cracking?
Some of the other stuff you see as slabs aren't as bad, like red cedar and rosewood (rose mahogany). Tas blackwood isn't too bad, although I have seen splits in it; and camphor laurel is generally OK, but its not a native timber.
I tend to coat the ends with thick acrylic like ceiling white, but I really don't know if it makes a great difference...thinking of the stickered stack of macrocarpa slabs I just looked at, some with splits already. For small stock I often dip it in molten wax.

Originally Posted by echnidna

I doubt that very few, if any of those big slabs will stand the test of time as fine furniture etc

Do you mean in an aesthetic or fashion sense, or the actual properties of the timber, or even the joinery?!

Cheers,

Most timbers will move throughout the seasons, however, you can minimize movement by making sure that the stacks of slabs are level, have plenty of strips separating them and have a large very heavy wieght on top. I have seen this done at a timber mill and it should work well.

Originally Posted by Andy Mac

I just think that the slow dry of a whole tree standing in water must have some effect on seasoning...once heard about English oak baulks being purposely seasoned under water to prevent cracking?

To reduce cracking of timber rounds or cookies soaking them in water for a year or so before drying is supposed to be the go. I doesn't work for all types of trees but it's much better than nothing.

I agree that big slabs pose special problems. The 2 , 3800 x 50 x 900 jarrah slabs I made my desk out of were from near the middle of a air dried log that had been drying for more than 40 years. They were thicknessed in a 1m wide thicknesser to 42 mm so they were dead flat across the grain. They were so long I could get them to lay flat along the grain so I though I was on a winner but 3 months later I notice that one end of one of the sections of the desk slab sections had cupped about 2 mm across the 850 mm width. The other two sections are fine.

Hello,

Thanks guys! . Good and inspirational opinions as usual .

I am not a buyer just yet, I have to check out the timber at first, and all of those costs for different delivery methods, taxes, customs etc. But I am seriously looking for honest big slab and how to bring it home the easiest and safest way.

I have been generating a kind of positive obsession for big wood. I don't even know what would I do with it but it would be really cool to have.

It is a kind of dream I'd like to live through .

kippis,

sumu

I make a lot of furniture and large benches from slab timber. I always tell the clients that this timmber is live and always will be it will most likely move. Sometimes it will curl up a bit but I try and constuct them in a way that tey are held flat but can expand and contract. Humidity around Newcastle and the Hunter Valley can change from 30%RH in the Morning to 80 - 90 in the afternoon temp can go from 6deg to 25degC someone can turn on an air conditioner and drop the humidity to 20% or put on a cloths dryer and send it up to 90%. Design your pieces to hold but allow movement. I'm still perfecting the technique but it's coming along. My pieces boarder between slab and fine furniture, it's fun and a little scary. Just make it hang the odd split or curl, it's part of the character. The
Japanese call it Wabi Sabi (it doesn't have to be perfect)

Originally Posted by BobL

To reduce cracking of timber rounds or cookies soaking them in water for a year or so before drying is supposed to be the go. I doesn't work for all types of trees but it's much better than nothing.

You used to see butchers' blocks which were nothing but a tree trunk three foot and more across. No cracks or splits. I was told they left them in running water for a year or two.
Jim

Hello,

It is fine if big wooden furniture does not move much along time and changes in humidity and temp, but it is unnatural if it does not move at all. I haven't yet seen that unnatural things in my life. Some life signs in slabs is just ok and kinda cool, too. It is alive until dust, so to speak.

I have heard about that water soaking method. As a matter of fact, I have heard about actual wood cooking in salt water, where common NaCl is driven into wood to hold down moisture and that way keeping the wood more stable and elastic. I have not tried out this method, but I have heard it has been in use in mallets and such.

Kippis,

sumu

Hi Sumu, might have to try the boiling in salt water. That could be an easy process with smaller pieces.

Hi sumu,
I have been thinking about this thread, wondering about the logistics and choices of timbers etc.
I guess weight of the slab is an issue, but it seems that volume of the package also adds to transport cost, at least in domestic freight. Some of the Eucalypt timbers are awesomely heavy, which make options like red cedar, hoop pine, Tassie blackwood etc more attractive.
Just a couple of figures: crows ash 950kg/m3; river redgum 900kg/m3 (typical of Euc's); rose mahogany 720kg/m3; blackwood 640kg/m3; silky oak 540kg/m3; hoop pine 530kg/m3; red cedar 420-550kg/m3; kauri pine 420kg/m3. As a reference for you, Sitka spruce is 430kg/m3 and white oak about 750kg/m3. (all info from the Australian Timber Buyers Guide, which is a good but limited reference book).
Just to whet your appetite, here is a dining table I made in the late '80's from a rosewood (a.k.a. rose mahogany) slab, in Murwillumbah. I think it was finished with nitrocellulose spray then waxed, but I didn't do any finishing, just design, make it and sand ready to go. M&T joinery on the legs, obviously through tusk tenons on the stretcher, and the top was held down by dowels in slotted holes.
I had been working previously for a company well known for its solid timber furniture, and I did lots in river red gum, blackwood, some in red cedar and rosewood... they had a mind boggling store of slabs, but this was one of the most beautiful I have ever seen, one enormous bark to bark slab, not a split, sound and flat, and the smell! It came from a forest floor near Mooball, south of the NSW border, but the downside, the tree is all but logged out, a rainforest species from an area under threat. Sadly it only sold for $1500 I think, and I'll never see a slab of timber like that again.
Apologies if I've posted this before, it was a memorable piece!!

Cheers,

Originally Posted by Andy Mac

I had been working previously for a company well known for its solid timber furniture, and I did lots in river red gum, blackwood, some in red cedar and rosewood... they had a mind boggling store of slabs, but this was one of the most beautiful I have ever seen, one enormous bark to bark slab, not a split, sound and flat, and the smell! It came from a forest floor near Mooball, south of the NSW border, but the downside, the tree is all but logged out, a rainforest species from an area under threat. Sadly it only sold for $1500 I think, and I'll never see a slab of timber like that again.
Apologies if I've posted this before, it was a memorable piece!!

Cheers,

Andy was that perhaps at the Treetops factory? Every time I drive past the covered up sign at Condong I wonder what happened to the factory and that huge store of timber they had out there. I used to love wandering through the store when it was open, even though I'm not into raw edge furniture. I'd love to someday get my hands on some of the Antarctic Beech they used.

Sumu, I've recently returned from a holiday in Portugal and I was surprised at the extent of the Eucalypt plantations there. I saw some very large and old redgums around the place. You might be able to source some decent slabs of the more common eucalpyts from sawmills down there, cheaper than shipping from Australia.

Originally Posted by Fuzzie

Andy was that perhaps at the Treetops factory? Every time I drive past the covered up sign at Condong I wonder what happened to the factory and that huge store of timber they had out there. I used to love wandering through the store when it was open, even though I'm not into raw edge furniture. I'd love to someday get my hands on some of the Antarctic Beech they used.
Yes that was the place, but was called Griffith Tablecraft back then. That store was paradise, clambouring over the stacks and pulling pieces out, comparing grain and colour to match!
They went through a lot of workers however...

Sumu, I've recently returned from a holiday in Portugal and I was surprised at the extent of the Eucalypt plantations there. I saw some very large and old redgums around the place. You might be able to source some decent slabs of the more common eucalpyts from sawmills down there, cheaper than shipping from Australia.

Not a bad idea, might be worth looking into.

Cheers

Hello guys ,

Again, lotsa tips and serious points of view .

Originally Posted by Andy Mac

Hi sumu,
I guess weight of the slab is an issue, but it seems that volume of the package also adds to transport cost, at least in domestic freight. Some of the Eucalypt timbers are awesomely heavy, which make options like red cedar, hoop pine, Tassie blackwood etc more attractive.

I think the weight of goods is not that much of an issue as the volume is. Sea freight containers will take this and that by weight, (for example 21,7 metric tons), and usually the entire container must be reserved for a delivery, unless there is an opportunity to join with someone. I could of course use DHL etc. to take care of the shipment, but it is at the moment the last change.

This is also one of the things I need to check out whether someone I happen to know is about at some point to bring cargo from Oz. I know a number of guys working with commissions of their enterprises. If there is no legal or other obstacles, it might just happen that I am lucky and manage to reserve a slab and get it brought to the container, so it can begin the trip to hereabouts .

Just to whet your appetite, here is a dining table I made in the late '80's from a rosewood (a.k.a. rose mahogany) slab, in Murwillumbah. I think it was finished with nitrocellulose spray then waxed, but I didn't do any finishing, just design, make it and sand ready to go. M&T joinery on the legs, obviously through tusk tenons on the stretcher, and the top was held down by dowels in slotted holes.
I had been working previously for a company well known for its solid timber furniture, and I did lots in river red gum, blackwood, some in red cedar and rosewood... they had a mind boggling store of slabs, but this was one of the most beautiful I have ever seen, one enormous bark to bark slab, not a split, sound and flat, and the smell! It came from a forest floor near Mooball, south of the NSW border, but the downside, the tree is all but logged out, a rainforest species from an area under threat. Sadly it only sold for $1500 I think, and I'll never see a slab of timber like that again.

Waaah!

Originally Posted by Fuzzie

Sumu, I've recently returned from a holiday in Portugal and I was surprised at the extent of the Eucalypt plantations there. I saw some very large and old redgums around the place. You might be able to source some decent slabs of the more common eucalpyts from sawmills down there, cheaper than shipping from Australia.

Well, I have heard that gum trees, especially Bluegum (Eucalyptus globulus ) are very successful in Portugal. Those trees can grow pretty big if only allowed to do so. I have heard seedlings and younger trees are not so prone to cattle damage either, so the yield ratio per planted seedling is quite good.

The other not so attractive thing what I have heard is that in Portugal, there happens about 7000 fires every year, quite many of them deliberately started to remove local plantation to make room to plant high yield gum trees. This causes trouble to the nature, like desertification and so on. This is just something I have heard from so many sources. That's why I am not at the moment so eager to consider for example European originated gum wood. But generally the idea to look around is of course very good.

I like sustainable (and salvaged) wood. This way I am banning some of the nicest wood from myself, but there is still thousands of lovely species left I can use. I'm not some hardcore militant tree hugger, I just like the idea of vast diversity in nature and it's preservation.

kippis,

sumu

Originally Posted by Fuzzie

Andy was that perhaps at the Treetops factory? Every time I drive past the covered up sign at Condong I wonder what happened to the factory and that huge store of timber they had out there.
Sumu, I've recently returned from a holiday in Portugal and I was surprised at the extent of the Eucalypt plantations there. I saw some very large and old redgums around the place. You might be able to source some decent slabs of the more common eucalpyts from sawmills down there, cheaper than shipping from Australia.

Don't think Treetops is ever re-opening, the highway bypassing seems to have lead to its demise. There is a guy doing camphor slabs on the old highway and next best places are Stan Ceglinski at Billinudgel and Slab Factory at Mullumbimby.

As for overseas Eucalypt plantations, this may be his best source for slabs, however, since the lack of natural pests allow the eucalypts to grow about 4x faster than it does in Australia, I wonder if it is as dense?