Thread: Seeking advice on timber selection

These timbers could be bit hard to work with.

I would also suggest Blackwood or Fijian Mahogany. Cherry could be another option.

For finish, I prefer hardwax oils. Osmo or Livos Kunos are two good options.

Thanks for the reply. I recognise that they may be hard to work with, but I wanted a hard wood so that it can take abuse and not get dented. Blackwood, apparently dents easily.

I'm only trying to make a board for the top of a desk out of them. So gluing boards together, cutting with circular saw, router edges, sand and then finish and drill and screw to desk frame. So hopefully not too hard?

Have you thought of using tas oak? Not sure what your local marketing name is for it in Vic. but it is timber from eucalyptus
obliqua,regnans and delegatensis mainly. Which all grow over your way. Easy to work, hard wearing and light in colour.
Cheers Wayne

Blackwood dents if you just look at it the wrong way

Tas oak/vic ash is probably in the "hard enough" category, not super hard though. Works well and takes stain well and is probably the most stable of the lot suggested because it's quarter cut instead of crown cut, but being indoors they should all stay pretty flat.

Redgum is a bit lighter in colour than Jarrah, but ALL timber will change colour with age.

Blue gum and spotted gum are kinda waxy, so it's recommended that the surfaces to be glued should be wiped down with solvent (turps or acetone) before gluing

Somerfly

Have you thought of using tas oak? Not sure what your local marketing name is for it in Vic. but it is timber from eucalyptus
obliqua,regnans and delegatensis mainly. Which all grow over your way. Easy to work, hard wearing and light in colour.
Cheers Wayne

Yes I did! It was the first timber I looked at, I got samples of it and Jarrah, and I found out that I could dent it with my fingernail so decided against it. Really liked the pinky light brown colour though! I've now turned my back on Jarrah though seeking something lighter in colour.

Blackwood dents if you just look at it the wrong way

Tas oak/vic ash is probably in the "hard enough" category, not super hard though. Works well and takes stain well and is probably the most stable of the lot suggested because it's quarter cut instead of crown cut, but being indoors they should all stay pretty flat.

Redgum is a bit lighter in colour than Jarrah, but ALL timber will change colour with age.

Blue gum and spotted gum are kinda waxy, so it's recommended that the surfaces to be glued should be wiped down with solvent (turps or acetone) before gluing

I assume there's no way to prevent this colour change? At this point I'm leaning towards the Blackbutt or Spotted Gum for the lighter colours. From what i've seen, Blackbutt is slightly more expensive, but more consistent and Spotted Gum more variable and maybe more lively? Both are durable enough. Gonna be hard to decide lol.

The solvent tip is one I would never have thought of! Thanks for that. What finishes do you suggest for a waxy timber? Also considering it's going to be regular contact with human skin... not sure if that does anything or not.

Originally Posted by Engi

I assume there's no way to prevent this colour change?

Keep it in a vacuum chamber with zero exposure to light. In practical terms, no.

What finishes do you suggest for a waxy timber? Also considering it's going to be regular contact with human skin... not sure if that does anything or not.

I'd go for something like this if you want hard-wearing and easy to maintain https://cabots.com.au/product-listin...or-water-based

Who would of thought that Victorian's were soft Once varnished it should be ok or you could use a two pack epoxy for extra durability.
Cheers Wayne

A nice project to begin with ...

One important consideration is the grade of the timber (no matter what timber type you choose). Just make sure that it is quarter sawn select grade timber ... and select it at the wood yard for consistancy of colour and grain pattern. Any lesser quality will be harder to join and more effected by warping.

Are you just making the bench-top for an existing desk??? You may wish to go to 35mm or 32mm thick for a desk top with beveled edges.... if the desk to is over say 1M long or 400 wide then you will need to have some pretty good clamps to join the boards.

I tend not to go above 90mm wide boards for desk tops, and take your time in matching the grain, colour and features so that the top is balanced. I choose to ensure that all the grain is in one direction because it is easier to plane a nice finish (no sanding required) and avoids excessive chatoyance.

I have made plenty of desk and table tops with Tas Oak (5.5 Janka) and never had a problem.

If you plan to treat your furniture so badly that you need wood with a Janka in the 8 to 11 range then jyou might want to consider Laminex or similar.

As for finish ... if you are not skilled in paint application .... or lack a spray booth ... then let me recommend a water based wipe on poly ... you will need to apply 4 or 5 coats to build it up but the finish will be much better that painted on poly. Just use 2000 grit wet and dry (with water) for a light cut back before the final coat.

Good luck ... be sure to post some pics.

Rob

Originally Posted by Tahlee

A nice project to begin with ...

One important consideration is the grade of the timber (no matter what timber type you choose). Just make sure that it is quarter sawn select grade timber ... and select it at the wood yard for consistancy of colour and grain pattern. Any lesser quality will be harder to join and more effected by warping.

Are you just making the bench-top for an existing desk??? You may wish to go to 35mm or 32mm thick for a desk top with beveled edges.... if the desk to is over say 1M long or 400 wide then you will need to have some pretty good clamps to join the boards.

I tend not to go above 90mm wide boards for desk tops, and take your time in matching the grain, colour and features so that the top is balanced. I choose to ensure that all the grain is in one direction because it is easier to plane a nice finish (no sanding required) and avoids excessive chatoyance.

I have made plenty of desk and table tops with Tas Oak (5.5 Janka) and never had a problem.

If you plan to treat your furniture so badly that you need wood with a Janka in the 8 to 11 range then jyou might want to consider Laminex or similar.

As for finish ... if you are not skilled in paint application .... or lack a spray booth ... then let me recommend a water based wipe on poly ... you will need to apply 4 or 5 coats to build it up but the finish will be much better that painted on poly. Just use 2000 grit wet and dry (with water) for a light cut back before the final coat.

Good luck ... be sure to post some pics.

Rob

Thanks

Yes, I plan to attach it to a white metal electric standing desk frame. I don't plan on treating it badly, it's just that I don't wan to be precious with it either. I expect to spill drinks and drop things on it from time to time, get bumped by chairs. Possible have my computer on it and of course my arms will rest on it when I'm typing, so it's going to need to survive cleaning. Because I'm investing the money I want it too look good in 5-10 years time, and softwood dents would no-doubt accumulate.

I ended up deciding on blackbutt 32mm dressed. I realise sawn is cheaper, but I don't have a table saw or a plainer nor do any or my friends, so I'm prepared to pay the premium for dressed stuff. Not cheap, but hopefully will last well and look good. Unfortunately I don't get to pick the pieces, because it come swan and they dress it up for me. If I enjoy the project, and like it then I might look at investing in some equipment in the future.

I looked at epoxy and it scratches easily and isn't reversible and expensive (i'm spending enough now thanks). I'm considering the acrylic polyurethane (thanks for the recommendation, if I go poly i'll go use the wipe on stuff) or perhaps a more high maintenance option like oils. might do some tests with some off-cuts. Hopefully I'll get the timber this weekend.

I don't want to sound like a Jonah, Engi, but have you got a game-plan of how you are going to glue up multiple 32mm wide boards? I get the impression from reading this thread that you have absolutely no w'working gear, so you are not going to be able to finesse the edges of your boards as you stick them together, and at the minimum you will need the use of some sash clamps [expensive] but panel clamps which pull the boards together in both dimensions would be better [more expensive still]. You can cobble up clamps using some cheap utility-grade studs and pegs & wedges, but it's a fair bit of faffing around.

If your boards have been machined very carefully, they start out straight & clean, but they will almost certainly move a little over a week or two & need a bit of refining here & there to get tight joins. In any case, you get your best glue joints between freshly-prepared surfaces. You have an awful lot of joins to make, with such narrow strips, & even if your glue-up is as close to perfect as humanly possible, there will be some irregularities (it takes <.2mm difference to show), which will need to be cleaned up after the glue cures. A couple of well-tuned hand-planes is the usual choice for this, it's easier to keep the surface dead flat. Unless you are skilled with them, hand-held sanding machines will result in a surface with lots of hills & dales that rather detract from appearance. Another way would be to take the glued-up top to somewhere that can run your top through a large thickness-sander - the small cost would be worth the better surface & save you a lot of toil.

I take the minority view here, starting out with a large panel glue-up when you have no suitable gear is not an ideal first woodworking project, imo - it's do-able, for sure, but you'll need to proceed with care & your choice of wood is not going to make matters easier for you. I attempted something similar many years ago with very basic gear & minimal skill and although I got my table top together, it was a bit rustic. However, I hope your project goes well and encourages you to delve deeper into the wonderful world of woodworking - it's a great hobby!

Cheers,

Originally Posted by IanW

If your boards have been machined very carefully, they start out straight & clean, but they will almost certainly move a little over a week or two & need a bit of refining here & there to get tight joins. In any case, you get your best glue joints between freshly-prepared surfaces. You have an awful lot of joins to make, with such narrow strips, & even if your glue-up is as close to perfect as humanly possible, there will be some irregularities (it takes <.2mm difference to show), which will need to be cleaned up after the glue cures. A couple of well-tuned hand-planes is the usual choice for this, it's easier to keep the surface dead flat. Unless you are skilled with them, hand-held sanding machines will result in a surface with lots of hills & dales that rather detract from appearance. Another way would be to take the glued-up top to somewhere that can run your top through a large thickness-sander - the small cost would be worth the better surface & save you a lot of toil.

I do have a rough plan, I've got about 5 clamps that will provide horizontal compression. So no issue there.

Preventing things going out of alignment is a little trickier. one idea I had is to place it on a flat concrete floor, provide horizontal compression and and then weight anything and everything the lifts of the ground down with weights. Alternatively I have 4 aluminum bars 50x50 and few smaller clamps that I can use to try and prevent the boards moving out of alignment.

I have a circular saw which I'm going to run along one of the aluminum bars to cut straight ends once the boards are glued together. I might be able to scrounge up an old hand plane or two, never used them so a little worried how that might go..

Sanding was going to be done with an orbital sander. One idea i had was to find a flat peice of glass and place it on table, look for points of contact and sand those... I have no idea where i'd find such a sander, but if it all goes pearshaped I'll consdier it. Thanks for the advice so far.

Originally Posted by IanW

I take the minority view here, starting out with a large panel glue-up when you have no suitable gear is not an ideal first woodworking project, imo - it's do-able, for sure, but you'll need to proceed with care & your choice of wood is not going to make matters easier for you. I attempted something similar many years ago with very basic gear & minimal skill and although I got my table top together, it was a bit rustic. However, I hope your project goes well and encourages you to delve deeper into the wonderful world of woodworking - it's a great hobby!

Cheers,

Thanks for the encouragement.... yeah I'm not familiar with wood working, but that said I don't think i'm trying to pull of anything too complicated and I'm quite good with handy stuff (did my own timing belt on my car, don't quite a bit of reno work at my parents place) and am a civil engineer by trade. So I think I understand what's required. Time will tell if I screw it up or not.

Well Engi, we're all keen to see more people succumb to the attractions of working wood, & there's only way to get experience! At least you have a better start than I did if you have some sash clamps!

Your plan of attack seems pretty sound, I think. Laminating is usually best done in stages so you only have to deal with one or two glue-lines at a time. Clamping the boards together in a dry-run will show you how good your edges are, but be aware that when you put the glue on, it can act as a lubricant and things may slide about until it develops a bit of tack. Splines, biscuits or Dominoes will prevent slipping & sliding & assist alignment, but don't guarantee perfect alignment, and you can do as well without them if the pieces are straight and even. I'd use a couple of bearers on the floor, and either your aluminium angle or another straight piece of wood as a caul, with a couple of small clamps to hold the panel flat & in alignment once it starts to grow a bit. Applying a liberal coat of paste-wax to the bearers & cauls will prevent the glue from sticking to them.

My only objection is to the sander part of your strategy (I'm not a totally un-plugged woodworker, but I avoid tools with tails as much as I can & I'm a bit of a plane tragic ). Hwever, you have to use what weapons you have available, I suppose. I've watched people trying to flatten large areas with a belt sander and the noise, the dust and the results were all objectionable....

The sooner we can entice you into the arcane world of hand planes and all those other luverly hand tools, the better....

Cheers,

With regard to Bluegum: you may find it a bit to open/coarse grained to get the smoothness you would probably seek on a desk. It may require a grain filler to overcome that.