Thread: Making shingles.

If it is the same sheoak in WA it should be OK for shingles, but sheoak is a beautiful timber - can't you get it milled?

Hey Feralwoody,

why not give Big Stan at Billinudgel Wood Works a call, and have a chat, don't know how far away he is, but closer than here.

HazzaB

Big Stan has got a great websight and he's just up the road. Luv to slip up and have a yarn with him, great tip thanks. Don't know what you blocks have got over in the west but i might try and slab a couple of the bigger ones just for the interest, I'll keep you posted. Thanks for the feedback.

To get the best figure from sheoak it needs to be quarter sawn.

Originally Posted by feralwoody

Big Stan has got a great websight and he's just up the road. Luv to slip up and have a yarn with him, great tip thanks. Don't know what you blocks have got over in the west but i might try and slab a couple of the bigger ones just for the interest, I'll keep you posted. Thanks for the feedback.

That's an idea It's too nice to burn that's for sure.

Originally Posted by feralwoody

Hi guys , Ive got a stand of she oaks that have got to go. I was thinking of making shingles or shakes from them. Most Ive asked tell me its only good for fire wood. Seems a terrible waste as they are straight and for the most part branch free. Any feed back would be greatly appreciated.

Feralwoody

It is an excellent firewood, but....

It was one of the preferred woods for shingles (Shingles are bandsawn and shakes are split, normally with a froe.) If your logs are good enough make furniture boards, then smaller pieces for tool handles and other small objects, then shingles (actually if they are not good enough for boards they probably won't make shingles/shakes ) and lastly firewood, but only the waste offcuts.

Regards
Paul

And wood turners love half logs for turning large hansom bowls. :cute: And the crotch pieces and bits that other people think are rubbish. And even pen blanks.

Originally Posted by rustynail

To get the best figure from sheoak it needs to be quarter sawn.

rustynail

I have heard a lot of people say this and from people whose opinions I value highly, but I'm not sure if I agree . My take on the matter is that the main figure comes from the pronounced medullary rays that are so prominent in the Casuarina family and indeed almost anything named "Oak."

The medullary rays run from the bark towards the heart of the tree. If you back saw these rays it produces many small eliptical shapes. On the quartersawn face it captures large circles that to my mind are not so contrasting particularly on smaller pieces of timber and in some instances are indistinct. I accept that differentspeciecs of Casuarina will vary a little.

I cut up a small piece today that I retrieved from the firewood pile in an attempt to demonstrate.

Casuarina 005.jpgCasuarina 003.jpgCasuarina 004.jpgCasuarina 002.jpg

This small flat board has the quartersawn face on the narrow edge and the backsawn face is the wide side.

Casuarina 010.jpgCasuarina 008.jpgCasuarina 009.jpg


In this second group of pix on a square piece of timber the middle board is backsawn and the two other pix are backsawn.

Zhen kitchen knives 002.jpg

This pic probably illustrates my point a little better as the knife scale is small, but the figure is still prominent.

I can see this becoming a contentious point . What are your thoughts?

Regards
Paul

Hi Paul,
No, its not a contentious point. You are quite correct, many of the "oaks" will produce a decorative grain when back sawn or rift sawn. My comment was more specific to the manufacture of shingles. The quarter sawn grain remains far more stable, particularly for such thin material as shingles. One of the first things to go wrong with a shingle roof is the back sawn shingles start to cup. As soon as you try to nail em back down, they split down the guts and leak like a sieve.
Many years ago, we did quite a bit of experimenting with different sawing methods on casuarina with some spectacular results. Unfortunately, in thin material, stability was compromised. It would be interesting to see if dry sawn material was less inclined to deform. I would expect a marked improvement.
This of course would mean a lot of double handling and may not be cost effective when a more orthodox approach could be taken in the first place.

Originally Posted by rustynail

Hi Paul,
No, its not a contentious point. You are quite correct, many of the "oaks" will produce a decorative grain when back sawn or rift sawn. My comment was more specific to the manufacture of shingles. The quarter sawn grain remains far more stable, particularly for such thin material as shingles. One of the first things to go wrong with a shingle roof is the back sawn shingles start to cup. As soon as you try to nail em back down, they split down the guts and leak like a sieve.
Many years ago, we did quite a bit of experimenting with different sawing methods on casuarina with some spectacular results. Unfortunately, in thin material, stability was compromised. It would be interesting to see if dry sawn material was less inclined to deform. I would expect a marked improvement.
This of course would mean a lot of double handling and may not be cost effective when a more orthodox approach could be taken in the first place.

RN

Yes my comments specifically applied to the figure. You are right on the money with quarter sawing/splitting for shingles/shakes. I suspect that any increase in stability with a drysawn shingle would be outweighed by the difficulty in nailing and the high probability of splitting. I have only seen shakes split on the quarter.

Regards
Paul

Originally Posted by Bushmiller

rustynail

I have heard a lot of people say this and from people whose opinions I value highly, but I'm not sure if I agree . My take on the matter is that the main figure comes from the pronounced medullary rays that are so prominent in the Casuarina family and indeed almost anything named "Oak."

The medullary rays run from the bark towards the heart of the tree. If you back saw these rays it produces many small eliptical shapes. On the quartersawn face it captures large circles that to my mind are not so contrasting particularly on smaller pieces of timber and in some instances are indistinct. I accept that differentspeciecs of Casuarina will vary a little.

I cut up a small piece today that I retrieved from the firewood pile in an attempt to demonstrate.

Casuarina 005.jpgCasuarina 003.jpgCasuarina 004.jpgCasuarina 002.jpg

This small flat board has the quartersawn face on the narrow edge and the backsawn face is the wide side.

Casuarina 010.jpgCasuarina 008.jpgCasuarina 009.jpg


In this second group of pix on a square piece of timber the middle board is backsawn and the two other pix are backsawn.

Zhen kitchen knives 002.jpg

This pic probably illustrates my point a little better as the knife scale is small, but the figure is still prominent.

I can see this becoming a contentious point . What are your thoughts?

Regards
Paul

What species are you displaying Paul? Certainly very pretty on the back/riftsawn grain...backsawn or riftsawn oak can at times be very stunning,particularly when there is fiddleback present..surface checking can be a problem though,along with unwanted cupping and twisting,a sad side affect when not quartersawn ..MM

I've played with a froe and split some what I feel to be not bad shakes. The green wood only. The older dryed stuff was nearly immposible to split. The ones I've made are out in the elements and are behaveing themselves nicely so far. Nice pics Mapleman. I'm setting up to slab a couple of the rounder ones soonish. If I can work out how to add pics to an email I'll show you all the results.

Originally Posted by MAPLEMAN

What species are you displaying Paul? Certainly very pretty on the back/riftsawn grain...backsawn or riftsawn oak can at times be very stunning,particularly when there is fiddleback present..surface checking can be a problem though,along with unwanted cupping and twisting,a sad side affect when not quartersawn ..MM

MM

I pulled that wood from the firewood pile as I had previously looked at the log and decided it was too small to be of use so I am not absolutely certain which one it is. However, it can only be Bull Oak or Hairy Oak and I think it is the former.

Interestingly, the knife handle is also Bull Oak but much deeper in colour even allowing that the handle has been varnished. It does show how much variation is present even in the same species in the same location.

The Casuarinas can be problem timbers with an unfortunate tendency to split. The log from the firewood pile had opened up with a 25mm longitudinal split. Spiral splitting is another issue I have seen.

Regards
Paul