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Thread: Vintage car woodwork
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1st March 2020, 07:28 AM #1
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Vintage car woodwork
I have a vintage car which is in need of new wood skeleton which is all but rotted and eaten by what ever eats European ash like a delekasy. Not knowing much about wood and their uses I searched the internet to figure out what wood to use for this project it seems that every time I asked I would get a different answer.
Some qualities of car timber should be strength, lightness, rot resistance, bug resistance, work ability. The wood I am favoring at least at the moment is Merbau which is quite a dense type of wood and therefore also pretty heavy. I have been suggested to use American Ash, Cellery Top Pine, Rock Maple, White Ash and so on.
Wandering if anyone has experience and opinions.
Ivan
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1st March 2020 07:28 AM # ADSGoogle Adsense Advertisement
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1st March 2020, 07:53 AM #2
I think coachwood would probably be a good option. Might have to hunt around a bit to find a supply though.
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1st March 2020, 10:28 AM #3
NcArcher is right Coachwood is the go to for restorers easy to work easy to form.
Other than that Ash good solid but weighs a ton.
Of course it depends on a number of factors
What you are restoring?
How much needs replacing?
Funds available!
Try contacting Greg Ward Or Mal Ward at Boutique Timbers Greg is a member on here.
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1st March 2020, 01:26 PM #4
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Im facing a similar issue to you Ivan with an old dodge tourer. I will most likely use Tas Oak.
See link below to the Morgan owners club for their suggestions.
https://www.morganownersclub.com.au/...0Selection.pdf
TonyYou can't use up creativity. The more you use, the more you have. ~Oscar Wilde
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1st March 2020, 03:15 PM #5
Paulownia may be an option.
Mobyturns
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1st March 2020, 03:42 PM #6
A friend who died almost twenty years ago, was an old-school shipwright who morphed into a restorer of vintage cars, specialising in the wooden frames. His preferred timbers, in order, were:
- celery top pine,
- golden sassafras - no need to pay the price premium for black heart, and
- Tasmanian myrtle - non-figured paler wood preferred.
In all cases he preferred quarter-sawn timber with the straightest, closest grain available.
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1st March 2020, 04:25 PM #7
China
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Coachwood is called "Coachwood" for a reason, the framing you are referring to is "Coachwork"
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1st March 2020, 08:42 PM #8
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The car is a 1949 Healey Duncan, the car was in an accident some 60 years ago was stored out in the weather I would say for a long time which rotted the woodwork to a point that some places the wood is completely gone. What remains of the woodwork is in some places is just enough to see what was there originally. All the suggested wood types you guys have named have very poor natural resistance to borers and water and that is what I really want to avoid.
I was looking at this site for comparisons.
https://www.business.qld.gov.au/indu...-timbers/kwila
Please keep going with your thoughts.
Ivan
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1st March 2020, 09:54 PM #9
China
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Who ever wrote that has obviously never seen the Termite parties I have seen with Kwila on the Bbq, there are many qualities needed for Coachwork other than being termite resistant
it needs to be flexible, needs to have straight grain, needs to be favourable to steam bending, needs to be have a amount deformation without splitting needs to be hand tool friendly ( you can't do everything with a machine ) I have rebuilt Coachwork one one truck and one car and have not found anything that is more suitable ( in Australia ) than Coachwood.
There a very very few if any timbers than termites will not attack
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1st March 2020, 11:19 PM #10
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Well basicly your best choices will come back to Coachwood or Satin Sycamore (which is interchangeable with coachwood in working properties and appearance).White Beech would be good, as with the other traditional lightweight planking timbers like Huon, Celery Top, and Kauri. Come to that Western Yellow Cedar (imported) would also work well. Cairns Pencil Cedar too I suppose: it's got that nice straight grain and is quite flexible and workable, though not very resistant to indentation and perhaps too prone to splitting. Silver Quandong perhaps also.... certainly its got inherent dynamic flexibility and is in the weight range.
Kwila/ merabu/ Johnston River Teak wont do what you want it to do. Nor will Vic Ash/Tas Oak. Coachwork, as with hull planking, needs to be able to flex and move constantly without splitting while being light enough that it doesn't tear the attachment points apart. You have considerations to take into account beyond borer resistance and water resistance, or you would be using plate steel.
How big is your budget, theres a price scale and budgetary considerations might rule out some options. I have some of the above and access to others but none are cheap.
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31st March 2020, 10:35 AM #11
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I grew Paulownia and milled it. Paulownia has a hollow centre that is not as straight as the log. For this reason there was always a 'plank' in the middle that was of no value. I gave a number of these to a friend to put on the ground between the rows in his vegie garden. This was in 1997. They are still there. Not rotted or consumed by termites. The garden is in Murwillumbah that has termite problems and has about 1800 mm of rain each year.
I won't go on about the actual timber other than to say it has all the qualities that China mentioned in his post.
Consider it?
John
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31st March 2020, 12:35 PM #12
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1.pawlonia
2. white beech
3. new guinea rosewood
4. coachwood
5. sitka spruce
6. english elm
7. American oak
8. Pacific maple
9. damar minyak.
all of these would be suitable and have been used. But it would be very difficult and expensive to find a lot of them. Rosewood would be my choice, and I know my old man has used it for coach work many times.
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31st March 2020, 05:53 PM #13
If you want it to be a period correct restoration European Ash is the way to go on a Pom car.
I did a White steamer a few years back and Ash was the chosen and used timber.
I have a ‘59 Morgan I’m very slowly restoring for myself and I’ve used Ash for some repairs.
Ive also used Teak for lower corner braces and Western Red Cedar for higher up braces.
The Ash will blue stain and rot eventually not so the Teak and Cedar. A coat of West system epoxy helps.
Ive also installed fabricated square steel tube and heavier gauge round tube reinforcement up the door pillars and across under the windscreen.
Hopefully this will tie it together and stop the doors falling off.
The problem with Morgan’s is with limited suspension they have to flex or the chassis cracks and breaks.
Mine had a crack under the drivers door and another in front of the firewall, repaired by a previous restorer with a piece of heavy angle. Just tear along dotted line please.
H.Jimcracks for the rich and/or wealthy. (aka GKB '88)
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3rd April 2020, 12:35 PM #14
A major consideration is the timbers ability to withstand shrinkage, dry rot, borer, extream Aussie weather conditions. Moisture content and then brying out throughout its life. Add to this holding powers for screws not just tightening them into the timber but over the years while in use. The same goes for joints they must be tight as a drum. My ex Tech teacher never used glue as each frame was paneled tightly around each frame they were secured using either nqils or screws keeping them in place as well as the frames.
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6th April 2020, 10:56 AM #15
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Further to the post by wheelinround I would like to add. The major weakness with Paulownia is its softness. As you would expect it doesn't act like other timbers in regard to screws and nails. However because of its softness glue is easily absorbed into the grain/timber and the joins are extremely strong. I don't know its breaking strength but from a practical point of view it's quite strong. I seem to remember that in boat plans if Paulownia was substituted for say pine the the timber sizes should should be increase by half eg a 50 X 20 mm pine required a 75 X 30mm Paulownia. I'm sure some other member will correct me if my memory has let me down.
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