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  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by doug3030 View Post
    "Laws are for the guidance of wise men and the blind obedience of fools."
    (Solon, the Lawmaker of Athens, d. 559 BC)


    I think there is a huge difference between "borrowing" one of a number of vacant disabled car parks for a short time and potentially life-threatening behaviours like double-parking in front of schools and speeding.

    Doug
    Doug, your quote is claptrap and a red herring trying to confuse the issue rather then justify this situation.

    Breaking the law is breaking the law.

    Whilst there are differences in degree of one crime to another, and then the punishment is different, illegally parking is still illegally parking, whatever spin you try to put on it.


    Peter.

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  3. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sturdee View Post
    Whilst there are differences in degree of one crime to another, and then the punishment is different, illegally parking is still illegally parking, whatever spin you try to put on it.
    Peter.
    There are two crimes aren't there ?

    Illegally Parking and Wilful Damage.

    Which do you see as the greater ? You have already given your judgement on one, your honour.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sturdee View Post
    I would have taken some photos with my phone camera and gone to the police or council and insist that they fine him accordingly.
    Fine $35.00 to $60.00 ... Fair ?

    So now, your honour, whats your decision on the next. Wilful Damage which you have recorded with your camera, because you were there. Now you have gone to the Police and you are insisting they fine him accordingly. (this crime carries a possible jail sentence)

    Because, after all ......

    Quote Originally Posted by Sturdee View Post
    Laws are made to be obeyed not broken at will..... there are differences in degree of one crime to another, and then the punishment is different, whatever spin you try to put on it.
    Your sentence, your honour ?

    cool bananas ... Greg

  4. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sturdee View Post
    Doug, your quote is claptrap and a red herring trying to confuse the issue rather then justify this situation.

    Breaking the law is breaking the law.

    Whilst there are differences in degree of one crime to another, and then the punishment is different, illegally parking is still illegally parking, whatever spin you try to put on it.


    Peter.
    Hi Peter.

    I did not say that it was right. I just said that it was wrong to compare an offence that at the worst causes someone some inconvenience to potentially life-threatening behavior like speeding and double parking. Making that comparison is the only "claptrap" or "red herring" in this thread. Who, other than yourself, have even alluded to the suggestion that someone might be looking to use this as a justification for speeding or double-parking? Personally I cannot see any sensible comparison between the two.

    Peter, there is a whole spectrum of colours out there; not everything is black and white. Lighten up! And thats it for me, I'm out of this thread, before it gets any more ridiculous.

    Doug
    Doug3030's Open Shed Day 2019 - Sunday 6 October 2019, Hoppers Crossing
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  5. #49
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    One crime only, and that is the illegal parking.

    As to the inadequately of the fine incurred that is another matter, personally I think it should be dealt with the same as under the hoon legislation, confiscation for one month for the first offence. Doubt that a second offence will ever occur again.

    My taking photos of the crime from the outside of the car, without touching it, is not a crime. Reporting same to the appropriate authority is a citizens duty according to law.


    Peter.

  6. #50
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    I'm gone too.

    Thanks Sturdee ... Carpe Diem

    cool bananas ... Greg

  7. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mutawintji View Post
    No ... Of course not ... But he didn't know that ? So .. Thats courageous, to place yourself at risk when the outcome is unknown.

    There were about six of these spaces ... All vacant. Still vacant when I returned, including the one he had parked in. His wife was in the car. It just seemed to me a bit over the top ... Two tyres ? I only have one spare, wouldn't one have been enough to teach me a lesson ? My own mission was urgent, for others, not myself.

    We all have our own problems ... I hadn't actually set fire to an orphanage, or stolen from the Salvation Army fund in order to laze on a tropical island paradise ?

    I was just in a hurry.

    What would you have done to teach me a lesson ? What would you decree as suitable punishment ?

    cool bananas ... Greg
    I drive a minibus ,on occasions, for the local old peoples home. Once a week they go on a "shopping spree." Our local shopping centre, to their credit, has placed several disabled parking spaces, side by side, which affords enough room for the bus while leaving two extra spaces for cars. Unfortunately, the larger than usual number of spaces often leads to non permit bearing vehicles availing themselves of a space, usually in the middle, so I am unable to park.
    Your punishment? He should have screwed the tekscrews in each side of your head, to let the dirty water run out.

  8. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mutawintji View Post
    No ...

    What would you have done to teach me a lesson ? What would you decree as suitable punishment ?

    cool bananas ... Greg
    shove the car up your .... lets say where the sun don't shine
    Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and Im not so sure about the universe.


  9. #53
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    Its amazing how angry people get about parking. Just talking about parking is making people angry in this thread!

    I don't like feeling angry so about 5 years ago I started getting all my supermarket groceries delivered to my house instead of having to drive to the supermarket and find a park. The supermarket people do all the packing and its delivered to my house with a smile . I know people reading this will try to pick holes in my solution by saying that sometimes you just need to buy a couple of things and don't want to do a whole order. Sure I get that sometimes, and I always notice how much more stressed and tired I feel on the days I have stop into the supermarket or malls for just a few things. One angry confrontation can stick in people's minds for years, even decades. That's why I pay the extra $10 for delivery and save myself years worth of accummulated anger

  10. #54
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    I would love to have home deliveries but, unfortunately, they only exist in the cities.
    For us it is a 45 km round trip to buy anything at all so, when we get there and some idjit thinks he/she is above the law and parks in the reserved spaces, it ticks me off big time.
    Every day is better than yesterday

    Cheers
    SAISAY

  11. #55
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    I saw what I thought was a young chick with huge sunglasses on, pull into a disabled spot and no visible disabled badge. I looked at her and then tapped the large disabled sign shaking my head in disgust. I then walked into Coles, looking back over my shoulder I saw a very old and obviously disabled woman clamber out of her car with difficulty. I scurried off and tried to hide in the fruit & veg, but she had seen me and gradually made her way to my hiding spot where she politely, but firmly explained to me that she was 82 and had had a double hip replacement operation the year before and that she was legally entitled to park there. Looking down at my feet I sheepishly apologised. On the way out I checked and there was a disabled badge there, I had just missed it. A lesson to be learned!

  12. #56
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    Yes JDP, can be embarrassing for some...

    I have been in and out of a wheelchair for the past 26 years...

    At the moment I am just walking, last 6 years I have had a good run using a painkiller that makes my muscles relax enough to walk but! thats a big butt now, I am suffering more every day, even tho I still walk but thats because I am very stubborn and my wheel chair is not motorised so if I have to use it, i'll be buggered altogether(I have no strength in my arms to push it anywhere)..

    I have found Disabled parking bays are rarely used by people that are not disabled in some way, but not all display there permit.

    I have people look at me as if I dont deserve a permit as I get out and walk away from my car.. They don't know that I can walk a small distance with no problems then I have to get back to my car(and yes I quite often go too far away)..

    Its deceiving about some injuries, and noit knowing a person makes you the fool rather than the consciencous(silly word) person if you speak too soon..

    We can all get a lesson in understanding by just giving others a chance rather than being too quick at judging them.. Maybe one day they will be the one that gives you a hand up when you need it..

    Ok I have had my 2 bobs worth, i'll go back to my rock now

  13. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by souwester View Post
    Its deceiving about some injuries, and not knowing a person makes you the fool rather than the consciencous(silly word) person if you speak too soon..

    We can all get a lesson in understanding by just giving others a chance rather than being too quick at judging them.. Maybe one day they will be the one that gives you a hand up when you need it..

    Ok I have had my 2 bobs worth, i'll go back to my rock now
    Yes, some injuries and disabilities are not readily obvious to the casual observer/cetin whose business it is not anyway. I have a bad back. Some days I can do almost anything I ever could. Some days I can barely make it out of bed. I do not have a disabled parking permit but some time ago I bought an ebony walking stick blank to make a mobility aid for myself on the bad days when I could use a bit of support. I have not made the walking stick yet and over the last few days my back has been absolutely terrible as a result of three nights on an air mattress while camping out with friends over Easter. So today I spent $29.95 and bought an adjustable aluminium walking stick to use while my back heals. This walking stick is definitely not ornamental. It looks 100% medical, not at all a fashion accessory. You would not be seen dead carrying this stick unless you needed it.

    So I bought the stick at the chemist shop and then walked, with far better mobility than I walked into the centre, into the supermarket next door. Walking slowly and in considerable pain and getting used to walking with the stick, I set out to collect a few items from the supermarket. Within my first 10 minutes of using a mobility aid I was knocked flat by a woman with a shopping trolley, who swept the stick out from under my hand when I was just about to put my full weight on it and then rammed the front corner of the trolley into my hip as I was falling.

    I managed to grab the side of the trolley and basically fell into it, saving myself from hitting the floor, but the pain in my back and hip were excruciating! Was this woman sorry? Well - NO, NOT AT ALL. She started screaming at me to let go of her Fv{<!ng trolley and making a huge scene. I learned some new words and some new ways to use some words I already knew. She was amazing.

    Even more amazing was that she had her own walking stick in the trolley.

    If that is the sympathy and understanding you can expect from others who are in a similar situation to the one you are in, I suppose it is no wonder that you get no sympathy from the able-bodied either. Since I live in Melbourne, the rudeness capital of the world, I hope that I do not need the walking stick for too long. Instead of looking at you as someone who may need a bit more consideration, they seem to look at you as a soft target that is easily knocked over. The incident mentioned above is merely the worst of the incidents I experienced today, My first day with walking stick. We live in a very disappointing society here in Melbourne.

    Doug
    Doug3030's Open Shed Day 2019 - Sunday 6 October 2019, Hoppers Crossing
    See here for details:
    https://www.woodworkforums.com/f303/...-2019-a-224305

  14. #58
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    We live in a very disappointing society here in Melbourne.
    Not only Melbourne but everywhere, no-one cares about anyone but themselves. There are the Baby Boomer Generation, X generation, Y Generation and now we have the ME generation!!! Glad I won't be here in 30years time.
    Kryn

  15. #59
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    But I am glad I was bought up decent and my sisters are bringing up their kids the same way

    Ratty 05/2004 -05/07/2010 COOPER 01/08/1998-31/01/2012

  16. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by KBs PensNmore View Post
    We live in a very disappointing society here in Melbourne.
    Not only Melbourne but everywhere, no-one cares about anyone but themselves. There are the Baby Boomer Generation, X generation, Y Generation and now we have the ME generation!!! Glad I won't be here in 30years time.
    Kryn
    I don't know about that. I've argued for a long time that we specifically notice bad behaviour because it IS abnormal.

    The thing is 99% of the people around us do the right thing every day. Every time someone does not cut infront of you in the supermarket line or traffic, every time someone gives you the right change or a smile in passing.

    It's just that it's so common we don't notice it, until someone does the wrong thing then we get cranky.

    It's important to realise this, because forgetting it allows us to justify bad behaviour as "everyone's doing it" and to do it ourselves.

    I was in Sydney a couple of weeks ago. I lived there for 30 years and it's a notoriously hostile place, yet surprisingly everyone I encountered this time was remarkably friendly and polite. It was quite odd actually.

    I hate to harp on about the driving thing but I have to say I spent 4 days running up and down King Georges Road and around the city visiting people and was quite relaxed (apart from when I was stuck in traffic and needed the bathroom but that's another story), I hadn't even made it back into Brisbane proper before I was yelling abuse at people through the car window. In Sydney if you leave a car length gap head someone will take it, yep they are awfully aggressive, but they all know what they are doing. In Brisbane half are like that and the rest seem asleep at the wheel. Scary and frustrating.
    I'm just a startled bunny in the headlights of life. L.J. Young.
    We live in a free country. We have freedom of choice. You can choose to agree with me, or you can choose to be wrong.
    Wait! No one told you your government was a sitcom?

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