Thread: Axe talk

So you can use yours to saw and split? Neat.

There's a lot of old heads out there. If you have a shaggy dog and are interested in a rehab job it may be worth instead being picky and finding something in good shape.

You find quite a few rehabbed jobs FS on eBay and Gumtree. If the owners had studied that Forest Service manual linked to here, they could have avoided some simple errors. The saddest case I've seen is I think current on Aus eBay where the owner has made a handle out of Red Cedar.

Originally Posted by rsser

...... the owner has made a handle out of Red Cedar.

Well, maybe it looks nice. Just don't try to use it!

I made a handle for a splitting axe a couple of months ago. Against my own better judgement, I used sawn stock instead of riven. It was going very well for about 2 hours, then one mis-hit revealed some oblique grain, down near the head, where it really counts.....

Cheers,

Indeed, it does look good.

My last Cyclone splitter went the same way as yours Ian. Disappointing. Went for a Fiskars splitter after that. Not bad. Could do with more head weight but the handle will last.

Originally Posted by rsser

If you have a shaggy dog and are interested in a rehab job it may be worth instead being picky and finding something in good shape.

Nahhh ... one axe is enough for me ... The Kelly was just in a bucket with some other stuff.



Some of you fellas might have enjoyed a clearing sale I went to today.

... Lots of old rusty, neglected and abused, crosscut saws, handsaws of all types, adzes, axes, etc.


Took a pic of this head ... didnt get a makers name .....

... too many people were giving me weird looks while I was spitting and rubbing ... so I gave up looking ..

Reading around the web....

Is hand better than drop forging? No evidence - Ross Gilmore. Wood Trekker: Myths and Misconceptions About Drop-Forged Axes

Carving an axe handle - Robin Wood.
Does handle grain to head alignment matter? No, unless it's old growth hickory.
Carve green & let dry. The sound on tapping will tell you when that's happened. axe handle

On the subject of handles I have a prejudice for spotted gum. This stems from the time I supplied timber to the handle manufacturer Hely Bros.

They, of course, turned the handles on a lathe four at a time following a steel pattern. The handles were turned green and then kiln dried. As I mentioned before, sapwood was used as well as heartwood. Spotted Gum has a particularly thick sapwood so it is ideal in this regard.

Hickory is often touted as being the preferred timber for handles, but a quick glance at the specifications for both timbers shows that Spotted Gum is superior in many areas: Strength, density, rupture, hardness and modulus of elasticity (Wood in Australia - Keith Bootle.)

I think that some of Hickory's reputation stems from the selection. Not all Hickory was used: I am not clear on the percentage, but it is quite possible that only a quite limited amount was suitable for handles.

The differences, even perceived superiority, are likely so small it is not worth the time and effort of chasing Hickory down. There is probably more mileage in selecting a suitable handle from the hardware store for grain orientation etc. Fashioning your own handle from a blank is even more satisfying, but not quite so quick .

Regards
Paul

Originally Posted by Bushmiller

..... Hickory is often touted as being the preferred timber for handles, but a quick glance at the specifications for both timbers shows that Spotted Gum is superior in many areas: Strength, density, rupture, hardness and modulus of elasticity (Wood in Australia - Keith Bootle.)

I think that some of Hickory's reputation stems from the selection. Not all Hickory was used: I am not clear on the percentage, but it is quite possible that only a quite limited amount was suitable for handles.....

Paul, I tend to agree that Hickory's biggest advantage is its reputation. There are many woods that can make perfectly good handles for striking tools. Some of the Acacias are very similar in their properties to Hickory (several get the common name 'hickory wattle'). They have an advantage to me that they are a little les dense than SG, and tend to be a bit easier to put a nice, splinter-free surface on than any of the Spotty I've come across (barring that piece you gave me, perhaps). I very much agree that selection of the piece is everything. For example, the Acacias around my place are extremely variable - some are very short-grained & carrot-like, while the tree growing a few metres away (same sp as far as I can tell), will yield tough wood that can be bent close to 180 degrees before a single fibre shreds. My problem is, it can be very hard to pick one from t'other, just looking at the wood, though a good clue is that the denser wood tends to be the good stuff.

I should think that sapwood could be used to advantage in a handle. In general, sapwood is more elastic & will take more tension than heartwood, so for e.g., bowyers put the sapwood on the 'out'-side of the bow. If you work your handle so that the sapwood is on the side that incurs the most tension in use, it ought to be beneficial. Just watch out for borers in susceptible woods...

Cheers,

Ian

I forgot to add the proviso that out of the commercially available species Spotted Gum stands head and shoulders above the rest. I was also thinking about timber to which somebody living in the city might have access. You, and I, are lucky in having access at times to other suitable species.

Your point about borers is a good one, particularly with spotted gum. It would be advisable to treat it with some sort of insecticide. I always forget to do this.

Regards
Paul

There's plenty of Fraxinus around cities and towns and that's also good for handles. (BTW I'm not suggesting a midnight raid with a chainsaw.)

Spotty I've only ever used as a plane testing piece. A lovely cranky grained lump it is. It's a bit oily. Is that normal? Would add to its virtues for handles perhaps.

As for sapwood/heartwood, someone on the web reports some testing with Hickory and couldn't see any difference.

Originally Posted by rsser

There's plenty of Fraxinus around cities and towns and that's also good for handles. (BTW I'm not suggesting a midnight raid with a chainsaw.)

Spotty I've only ever used as a plane testing piece. A lovely cranky grained lump it is. It's a bit oily. Is that normal? Would add to its virtues for handles perhaps.

As for sapwood/heartwood, someone on the web reports some testing with Hickory and couldn't see any difference.

Ern

I don't think Spotty is oily like some woods, but it can be difficult to work. Probably leave your attractive cranky grained material for other purposes. Straight grain is what we are chasing here.

I think the significance of Spotty in milling is that it is normally discarded. In this instance and for this purpose it is treasured.

Regards
Paul

Originally Posted by Bushmiller

Ern

I don't think Spotty is oily like some woods, but it can be difficult to work. Probably leave your attractive cranky grained material for other purposes. Straight grain is what we are chasing here.

I think the significance of Spotty in milling is that it is normally discarded. In this instance and for this purpose it is treasured.

Regards
Paul

I have used spotted gum for handles and had good results, Its been a very durable timber, even for some of the maul heads as well.
Another little axe that I am quite fond of is my Keesteel corrugated, found by an good friend very rusty and pitted, cleaned it up as best as I could and fitted a handle.
it actually gets a bit of use.


Melbourne Matty.

Originally Posted by rsser

There's plenty of Fraxinus around cities and towns and that's also good for handles....

Ern, most of the Fraxinus I've seen as street trees in Victoria are cultivars of desert Ash F. angustifolia, (Claret, Golden, etc.) are they not? It's a very different animal from the European or Nth American species that make good handles & wheel spokes. I've used it a bit for chair spindles, but it's quite brittle compared with the white Ash from Canada, which I have also used a bit. It's possibly ok for handles compared with some other woods (like Toona australis ) but not really suited to axe or hammer handles, I would think.

So leave the trees on the nature strip......

Cheers,

Originally Posted by Bushmiller

I think the significance of Spotty in milling is that it is normally discarded. In this instance and for this purpose it is treasured.

Regards
Paul

Ooops. Left out the all important word. Should have read like this:


I think the significance of Spotty in milling is that sapwood is normally discarded. In this instance and for this purpose it is treasured.



Regards
Paul

Ian, yes, the local stuff is Claret and Golden. Thanks for that warning.

Matty, I've seen those in the catalogues. What was the thinking behind the corrugated cheeks do you think? Reduce sticking?